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notchboy
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
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Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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 Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:35 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Not exactly. No Standard came OEM with carpet ya lunk. Besides, that's a '66 and Joel's is a '67. IIRC the black plastic sliders may have been '67 only as '67 came with black knobs on the dash and split speaker grille and in '68 they went with twisty vents.
Looks like I was correct about the engine, steering wheel, horn delete, bullets, and side trim though. Did that '66 have a chrome hood beak? What about an outside door lock on the passenger door?
A birth certificate will be the final authority.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
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notchboy
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Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 22448
Location: Escondido CA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Tram wrote: |
Not exactly. No Standard came OEM with carpet ya lunk. Besides, that's a '66 and Joel's is a '67. IIRC the black plastic sliders may have been '67 only as '67 came with black knobs on the dash and split speaker grille and in '68 they went with twisty vents.
Looks like I was correct about the engine, steering wheel, horn delete, bullets, and side trim though. Did that '66 have a chrome hood beak? What about an outside door lock on the passenger door?
A birth certificate will be the final authority. |
Jesus Christ  
You forgot that its green, has been slightly lowered and the pic was taken in Marietta CA and not Tri Cities WA 
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| t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:02 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| notchboy wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
Not exactly. No Standard came OEM with carpet ya lunk. Besides, that's a '66 and Joel's is a '67. IIRC the black plastic sliders may have been '67 only as '67 came with black knobs on the dash and split speaker grille and in '68 they went with twisty vents.
Looks like I was correct about the engine, steering wheel, horn delete, bullets, and side trim though. Did that '66 have a chrome hood beak? What about an outside door lock on the passenger door?
A birth certificate will be the final authority. |
Jesus Christ
You forgot that its green, has been slightly lowered and the pic was taken in Marietta CA and not Tri Cities WA |
And yer point is? 
But yeah, I'm thinking a standard just had bare bumper blades with no uprights, too.
I ask you if the passenger door has an outside lock and you tell me where the pictures were taken.
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Slow 1200
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Joined: July 02, 2004
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:00 am Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Does it have the K code 1500cc sidedraft engine?
The other 1600As I know are 68s and 69s so it might not be 100% applicable, but they did have blade bumpers with no overriders, bullet turn signals, flat tail-lights and no side trim
There's probably a M code that includes all those things probably |
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Slow 1200
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:02 am Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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this is a 8/66 german brochure
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Slow 1200
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:05 am Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Then of course it could be one of these:
M234 Chrome and interior trim as in model 311 from Chassis No. 317 000 001
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M237 Moldings, overriders, trim rings, second sun visors, clock, loop carpeting, and flashing indicators as in model 311 from Chassis No. 316 000 001 up to 319 500 000 |
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Tram
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:51 am Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Slow 1200 wrote: |
Then of course it could be one of these:
M234 Chrome and interior trim as in model 311 from Chassis No. 317 000 001
or
M237 Moldings, overriders, trim rings, second sun visors, clock, loop carpeting, and flashing indicators as in model 311 from Chassis No. 316 000 001 up to 319 500 000 |
This is why we need a birth certificate. There could have been "a la carte" special order bits as well.
The other thing we all need to do someday is start a birth certificate info pool because it seems to be hit or miss on VW actually being able to identify what some M codes were on a given day.
The 1500 Club guys are doing a good job of documenting. I started a 'Club 1600' thread years ago for 1966- on cars that sunk like a stone because people aren't as serious about 4 lug models as they are about 5 lug.
I've said it before- we need to start getting anal and serious about this before all is lost to history. It scares me that I'm seemingly one of the last people around who is familiar with a lot of this stuff, but what I learned was strictly by osmosis being just old enough to have started out when these cars were much more plentiful and far younger, when the old OG guys were in their final working years. We were beyond fortunate to have Russ Wolfe here with us for the time we had. Everything I learned second hand he was there for when it was new. Russ and I disagreed vehemently and could have come to blows on other subjects but our mutual love for these cars overrode all that.
I remember a lot about the U.S. spec cars but Euro cars we need input on, and that includes Standard models. When Type 3s were finally imported into the USA for the 1966 model year, all were Deluxes by mandate of VW. Standards weren't even offered, either in the regular dealers or by VWoA Tourist Delivery, until the end of the line in 1973- and those US delivered Standards are rare as hell.
I heard from various sources in the know that the Special deluxe models- Pigalles and Teaks- were commissioned especially for the USA official debut. On the regular Type 3s these were only made from August through December 1965. The Type 34 P&Ts alone continued through the entire 1966 model year AFAIK.
I swear I saw an Azure car at the dealer around 1977-8 or so... it was a Fastback. I remember thinking it was just like the red and light brown interior cars but F-U-G-L-Y, because my young whippersnapper self didn't care either for Fastbacks or baby blue... and liked blue interiors even less.
Everyone tells me I'm full of it, that these never existed. Of course in those days we didn't have phones or Facebook to document every aspect of our lives including things that should remain secret for one's own good, so I have no proof. Even if I did, people would probably scream "FAKE NEWS!" these days, but why on Earth would someone fake that way back when? Bits of these Azure cars have surfaced but never a whole car.
It's only really since the dawn of the Internet that Type 3s have really finally started to be appreciated. I remember trying to restore my '66 Euro Square in 1999-2000 and turning to the WWW to try to get more info and find parts. There was one other Type 3 geek out there that I found... our very own notchboy. He had almost all I was looking for, made me a sweet deal, and I paid up and he shipped. It was a nice oasis of parts. We've been pals ever since. I was surprised to find out years later when we finally met in person that he's probably 15-ish years younger than I am. And yes, he IS "twice the man that I am... Literally" but then bra cup size isn't everything. It's OK, he's got a "nice personality". 
But seriously... I am geeky enough to care about things like original factory paint marks on suspension components, chalk/ grease pencil marks on the insides of doors, under interior panels, etc., the fact that a lot of metal fixtures, linkages, fasteners, and even fan housings were originally yellow cad plated that has worn away with time. What about all the code stampings that should be stamped on belt guards? And PLEASE- for the love of Nordhoff- STOP the fucking gloss powdercoating, LOL! How were dealer options like A/C installed? Which suppliers supplied them, and what were the differences? What year did VW drop the "Variant Only" VOLKSWAGEN badges and use the regular Fastback (and notchback) badges at an angle? What options were true factory and which were dealer installed/ supplied? Did you know that silly options like Formula Vee appearance packages, "woody" side decals, and vinyl tops were available for late Type 3s? Why do euro Squarebacks say "Variant" where USA ones had a straight blanking bar? What is a Uni Vent kit?
Having other fingers in the Mercedes and Porsche worlds as well of being an East Prussian German from NYC I can tell you that VW people in general have a long way to go on "fanaticism".
I'll get off my soapbox now. Sorry I trainwrecked your thread, Joel.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
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Last edited by Tram on Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Boo-Koo-Z 
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Posts: 437
Location: Tri-cities … South Eastern Washington State USA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:52 am Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Will get a birth cert ordered
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64 N Model Notch,65 OG White Notch
65 Squareback
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60 crew cab, 64 21 Window Deluxe Bus clone
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Bobnotch
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Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22407
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:16 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Boo-Koo-Z wrote: |
I recently had a chance to purchase a rare beast. I’m learning a lot just based off of observation. A little background on this sweet ride...
This 1967 Notchback originally ordered from Germany by the Grandmpa of the gal I recently bought it from. Gramps enjoyed the car from new and passed it down to his son who drove it for a while until handing it down to his daughter who I bought it from. She drove it through high school and when she went away back east to college in 1992 the car was parked on blocks in the back yard and tarped. I removed it from its blocks towed it home and how you see it in these pictures is how it came home. The car has 77,475 original documented miles. At some point in the 80’s the car had a very poor exterior only respray. As for the motor I have not confirmed correct number time frame yet but do see it’s got Weber ICTs on it instead of the factory solex. As for my plan with the car.. I’m not really sure! Since it’s in mostly survivor condition maybe a nice mechanical restoration with an exterior respray and replace the rubbers.
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So what market was this car actually built for? I mean it was ordered in Germany, but it's not a "deluxe" model (for USA market), and it doesn't have side marker lights in the front fenders, or a right side external door lock.
Without a birth certificate, you/we won't know if it was originally a single carb car, or a dual carb car.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Tram
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Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:48 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Boo-Koo-Z wrote: |
| Will get a birth cert ordered |
I'm sure there will be some "cannot be identified" info there but at least it will give us a good road map. Let's make it a collective effort to keep this car 100% as it came from Wolfsburg. I am even willing to give up a set of my cherished original Wolfsburg Tourist Delivery plates as a finishing touch if we find this was somehow a TD car.
Let's show the '1500 Club' crowd what pikers they are! ARE YOU WITH ME??? RAH RAH RAH!!!
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
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ibjack
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Joined: February 06, 2002
Posts: 2105
Location: Imperial Beach CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:45 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Tram, just so you know of couple of us 1500 Club guys have or will have a four lugger in the stable soon. Since we are motivated to actually get stuff done, perhaps we will get the Club 1600 going.
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'68 Lotus White T34 automatic sunroof
'64 Manila Yellow T34
'65 Sea Blue Square Panel
the1500club.com
Shop Lacky at the T3/34 Factory, https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100094313902074 |
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Tram
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Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:15 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| ibjack wrote: |
| Tram, just so you know of couple of us 1500 Club guys have or will have a four lugger in the stable soon. Since we are motivated to actually get stuff done, perhaps we will get the Club 1600 going. |
Take it away, Mr. Confection!  I'll be watching to keep youtes guys in line. Good to see the 1500 Club's interests expanding. Seriously. You'll do things right. 
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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Boo-Koo-Z
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Joined: February 03, 2004
Posts: 437
Location: Tri-cities … South Eastern Washington State USA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:20 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Pulled the engine code to submit for birth cert. code looks correct for build date.
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64 N Model Notch,65 OG White Notch
65 Squareback
55 Vert Bug, 62 gulf blue patina bug
Desert Fox Spoiler Buggy
60 crew cab, 64 21 Window Deluxe Bus clone
63 OG Manilla yellow Ghia
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Tram
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Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:22 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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The hell are those pie pans for? "What's the M-code, Kenneth?"
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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Boo-Koo-Z
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Joined: February 03, 2004
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Location: Tri-cities … South Eastern Washington State USA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Pie pans 😂
In 67 it would have been dual carbs even on a standard ?
Carbs on it are ICTS I believe.
Birth certificate is ordered we will review it in 6 months lol
It gives me an option for a data sheet too. What’s all on there?
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64 N Model Notch,65 OG White Notch
65 Squareback
55 Vert Bug, 62 gulf blue patina bug
Desert Fox Spoiler Buggy
60 crew cab, 64 21 Window Deluxe Bus clone
63 OG Manilla yellow Ghia
73 Thing |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:18 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Boo-Koo-Z wrote: |
Pie pans 😂
In 67 it would have been dual carbs even on a standard ?
Carbs on it are ICTS I believe.
Birth certificate is ordered we will review it in 6 months lol
It gives me an option for a data sheet too. What’s all on there? |
It depends how it was ordered on a Standard, but I wonder if it was changed because the single port side draft parts were unobtanium from VW over here.
Data sheet should have interior colors, key code, etc. if it's anything like a M-B data sheet. In short, all the info that's not on the Birth Certificate.
It still has the '67 only generator. Nice.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
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Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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Joel, I just noticed your engine number is a KO. It started life as a 45 hp 1500- that's a single side draft AFAIK. I think she's been upgraded.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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Boo-Koo-Z
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Joined: February 03, 2004
Posts: 437
Location: Tri-cities … South Eastern Washington State USA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:05 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Tram wrote: |
| Joel, I just noticed your engine number is a KO. It started life as a 45 hp 1500- that's a single side draft AFAIK. I think she's been upgraded. |
So narrowed beam and air ride it is
_________________
64 N Model Notch,65 OG White Notch
65 Squareback
55 Vert Bug, 62 gulf blue patina bug
Desert Fox Spoiler Buggy
60 crew cab, 64 21 Window Deluxe Bus clone
63 OG Manilla yellow Ghia
73 Thing |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: 1967 Notchback 1600A Standard |
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| Boo-Koo-Z wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
| Joel, I just noticed your engine number is a KO. It started life as a 45 hp 1500- that's a single side draft AFAIK. I think she's been upgraded. |
So narrowed beam and air ride it is |
Hey- it's your car... go for it!
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