Help with timing marks/ idle timing with strobe timing light

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

[hotsam]

[ashman40]

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

[andk5591]

Max advance should be between 28 and 32 degrees.
_________________
D-Dubya Manx clone - 63 Short pan,1914.
Rosie 65 bug - My mostly stock daily driver.
Woodie 69 VW woodie (Hot VWs 7/12).
"John's car" 64 VW woodie - The first ever
Maxine 61 Cal-look bug - Cindy's daily driver.
Max - 73 standard Beetle hearse project - For sale
66 bug project - Real patina & Suby conversion
There's more, but not keeping them...

[mark tucker]

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

[mukluk]

Where is your static timing set?
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1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga"

[ashman40]

Does the timing advance even further from 25BTDC if you raise the rpms above idle?


If you are suggesting that the engine cannot run with 25BTDC idle timing and that is why it can’t really be 25BTDC, this may not be a good basis for judging things are wrong. Many engines have a 15BTDC idle timing and a very limited mechanical advance. And an engine with 15-20BTDC idle timing will run VERY well indeed.

Have you already checked that your TDC mark is 90deg CW from the woodruff key slot on the ID of the pulley?
What happens if you rotate the distributor so your idle timing is around 7.5BTDC? Then rev the engine while you watch your timing. What is the total advance (idle + mechanical)? Does it exceed 28-32BTDC?
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AshMan40
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'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}

[Slow 1200]

I would try a different timing light

[Vanillagurilla]

I just helped a friend with timing on my last desert trip. We have the same distributor (009) and both have degree pulleys. I went to time his car, clipped on #1 and it was showing me 20+Deg at idle. I ended up timing it by ear and driving it but I still have no idea why it was reading so far off. I even tried all the plug wires to be sure because on a 009 your plug wires are usually 90 deg out on the cap but his were in the stock location. Runs great but i still am lost with it.

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

[andk5591]

Totally agree not to make adjustments until you verify what you have. TYPICALLY with a mechanical advance distributor, the idle timing will be between 5 and 12 degrees, with max (around 3000 RPMS or so) coming in between 28 and 32. So usually you will have an advance range of about 20 degrees. (019 per Glenn is 17 degrees) This is a generalization and vairies some from distributor to distributor. But this is fairly typical. I am assuming that your advance does increase with RPMs and you have a similar range.

I have never run into the dimple being off as far as you are experiencing. I use a basic timing light without the built in advance feature however.

Trying another light would be a good idea....Would suck to be chasing you tail because of a defective tool.....And yeah, if the timing was really what you are seeing, it wouldn't run for shit.
_________________
D-Dubya Manx clone - 63 Short pan,1914.
Rosie 65 bug - My mostly stock daily driver.
Woodie 69 VW woodie (Hot VWs 7/12).
"John's car" 64 VW woodie - The first ever
Maxine 61 Cal-look bug - Cindy's daily driver.
Max - 73 standard Beetle hearse project - For sale
66 bug project - Real patina & Suby conversion
There's more, but not keeping them...

[mark tucker]

even a bone stock motor higher idle timing would mainly make the rpm higher and smoother idle...I reckon if there was a issue ( crapo fuel,low battery,week starter, hot engine with hot carbon spots and more it may kick bock a bit, but it shouldent cause any other issues like the vw in heaven thinks. high idle timing rarely could cause pininging..but if the max timing is exceded for the load&rop, yes pining could occur.carb also plays a part in this. with this said there is no reason to set it too high....it can make tuning a bit different as well as rough idle and some carbs may not be able to idle down enough....thus set the timing for what is needed. most oe timing settings are more of a "EPA" thing to lower emissions....I kinda doubt there is more than 4 of these cars that could pass a current cars emissions spec...but the cleaner burning you can get it the better it will be.and us too
also remember high idle timing will change the ex temps as well as raise the rpm witch may make the engine run on after turned off(diesel).and diesel is the reason why vw put the silonoid on the carbs.as well as many other manufacturs. there is no "perfect timing" for all engines. tune your engine for what it needs.

[ashman40]

[AlmostHeavenWV_VW]

Ok boys and girls time for some information for the class to review:

I verified I was hooking up my strobe light correctly (Yep)
Checked to make sure I was in "4-cycle" mode (Yep.)
Even borrowed another timing light from the FLAPS and hooked that one up
No changes in results with the new light (therefore I assume both lights are functioning correctly)

Test Results:
Static timing: ~25deg BTDC
Dwell: 45degrees
Idle timing(@850-900RPM): 25deg BTDC (allegedly)
Max advance (@3500RPM)- 42deg BTDC (allegedly)
Bosch 019 Dist gave me full advance @ 17deg advance
Idle then returned to ~900RPM and I was again showing 25deg BTDC idle timing

Also:

[mukluk]

Looks like a stock pulley, VW mark or no.

I'm starting to get a sneaking suspicion the crank pulley woodruff key is toast or completely missing.
_________________
1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga"

[VW_Jimbo]

[ashman40]