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brother
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Joined: December 04, 2016
Posts: 4
Location: around
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 Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:56 am Post subject: Knocking from rear end |
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A knocking sound has started from what sounds like the back end over the past day. Below I'll list the details:
-Usually starts around 15 MPH
-Doesn't seem to be related to the engine
-Frequency is congruent with speed (faster speed = faster knock, vice versa)
-Intensity/loudness seems to be random, sometimes it's loud then I'll slow to a stop and start moving again and it'll be nonexistent or real quiet for a minute to a few minutes, then it'll show up again.
-When I accelerate the knock seems to mellow out, I don't know if it's just the sound of my engine drowning it out, but it seems to be mellower.
-Generally, the knock has gotten a little louder than it was sounding last night.
Here's the kicker. I'm far from either option of home. One is in the bay area, California. The other is in west Michigan. I was heading east as I need to head east towards Michigan moreso than towards California. Currently I am semi-stranded in Santa Fe, New Mexico. My vanagon runs and moves, but I am afraid of getting stranded in a more remote place. I've worked on my vanagon a decent, but my still regard my mechanical knowledge as novice to intermediate at best, but this issue is new to me and I'm having a hard time diagnosing the issue.
Also I'm stressed out 
Any help is greatly appreciated. |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
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Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Steve M.
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Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:45 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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Don't just look - put a hand on each axle and try to move it in all directions.
Side to side between gearbox and axles there should be some normal sliding movement to compensate for the suspension up and down movement.
Front to back placing a hand closest to each CV joint you probably will not see much movement if any as the balls will hold it fairly well even if starting to go bad. What your really looking for is the bolts holding the CV joint in place. If there loose it will be fairly obvious!
If you can identify which axle it is and it is a cv joint you can replace the cv joint or maybe a faster way would be to buy a new axle with the cv joints installed.
Here is one that will get you moving for 50 bucks from parts geek.
I have no clue as to how good it is, but should last long enough to get you home if this is the worst case scenario. Trouble is it is only for a manual transmission. If you have an automatic you'll have to do some searching online.
Don't stress too much-it is fixable. Though you will need a torque wrench to tighten the cv bolts properly and then check and re-torque them again in a 100 miles.
https://www.partsgeek.com/6rw8b6q-volkswagen-vanag...e+Assembly
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84Cabby82Westy
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Joined: April 03, 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Missoula, MT
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:53 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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Definitely check the bolts - hopefully that's all it is. I had exactly the same problem last summer along the coast in northern California.
Mine started similar to what you describe and then got progressively louder to the point that it sounded like someone was beating on the back with a hammer. Had the same thing happen in town about 8 years ago. I found a shop open late in a very small town that had no experience with vans and I suggested that they check the bolts. It was fixed in 10 minutes and they didn't charge me because they didn't think they did anything. 2K miles later and everything is fine. |
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alaskadan
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Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1858
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:24 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| When checking for loose bolts or bad cv park it in neutral with wheels blocked so there is load or bind on the axle. |
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9.5isCanadian
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Joined: September 16, 2017
Posts: 465
Location: In your blind spot.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:32 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| alaskadan wrote: |
| When checking for loose bolts or bad cv park it in neutral with wheels blocked so there is no load or bind on the axle. |
Quoted to fix missing word.
5 marks for the assist.
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djkeev
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Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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danfromsyr
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Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:55 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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fast foreign auto repair in Santa Fe has seen Vanagons before.
this should be an easy assessment and repair for them.
they are closed today (sunday)
5453, 2786 Agua Fria St, Santa Fe, NM 87507
www.mechanicsantafe.com (505) 471-0326
https://goo.gl/maps/7rBtuBde8gN2
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brother
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Posts: 4
Location: around
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:56 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| thank you all for the quick responses. before checking back here i crawled under and spotted my rear right joint/boot by the wheel is wet so that looks like the problem spot. i just got to a friend’s place and will do some further inspection after showering and gettin settled. thanks again! |
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danfromsyr
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Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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as an FYI, any brake shop who services axles can/should be able to service a vanagon rear axle. it's nothing special. in fact it's fairly easy.
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| Abscate wrote: |
| These are the reasons we have words like “wanker” |
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MsTaboo
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 3:45 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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Definitely keep the old axle if replacing with cheap FLAPS part.
Remember to label the axle for transaxle side and wheel side. This is so the axle goes back in with the same torque twist direction.
Good luck!
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fxr
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:44 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| MsTaboo wrote: |
Definitely keep the old axle if replacing with cheap FLAPS part.
Remember to label the axle for transaxle side and wheel side. This is so the axle goes back in with the same torque twist direction.
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Only if swapped to the other side of the van, surely? Swapping trans-axle to wheel on the same side doesn't change the thrust direction inside the CV.
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brother
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:48 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| alright so when i got under and moved the axle side to side between the gearbox and the wheels there was a strong knock as it hit the wheel end. sounds just like the knock i'm experiencing on the road. i'm assuming that means it's a bad joint, hoping it's not something bigger than that. the one on the back left is way more heavy sounding than the one on the right but they both are knocking. |
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dhaavers
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 5:53 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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Possible the CV axle is hitting the stub axle. Loud & annoying but not particularly worrisome. Pulling each boot
towards the CV at each end will tend to center the axle & help prevent the clunk...try it & report back...
- Dave
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IdahoDoug
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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What year and model Vanagon are we discussing here, and is it automatic or manual?
It sounds like you just need the rear axles removed, lubricated with new boots and re-installed. Most places will prefer to replace the whole axle as a unit preassembled as the cost is about the same to do that. Unbolt and replace with all new is comparable to the large amount of shop time to take your old one and properly clean and regrease.
I'm asking about the details because sure as heck we'll find out you have a diesel conversion, or an automatic, or that you have a 6" lift and huge tires, etc. So give us some details on the car.
While I'm asking questions, I grew up in W. Michigan - Holland, Grand Haven, Saugatuck, Berrien Springs, etc. Where is home in W. Michigan?
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Wildthings
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| Pumping additional grease into the joints by using a long grease needle under the small ends of the boots can often quiet them up. Preferably the needle will be long enough to get grease in between the bearings. |
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MsTaboo
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Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:01 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| fxr wrote: |
| MsTaboo wrote: |
Definitely keep the old axle if replacing with cheap FLAPS part.
Remember to label the axle for transaxle side and wheel side. This is so the axle goes back in with the same torque twist direction.
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Only if swapped to the other side of the van, surely? Swapping trans-axle to wheel on the same side doesn't change the thrust direction inside the CV. |
The idea is to keep the torque direction the same on the axle.
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brother
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:34 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| idahodoug, it’s a manual 2wd 1985 waterbox 1.9 westy camper, stock wheels. also, i work at the art school in the woods in saugatuck/douglas late spring thru late summer/fall |
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Wildthings
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| Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:50 pm Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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| MsTaboo wrote: |
| fxr wrote: |
| MsTaboo wrote: |
Definitely keep the old axle if replacing with cheap FLAPS part.
Remember to label the axle for transaxle side and wheel side. This is so the axle goes back in with the same torque twist direction.
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Only if swapped to the other side of the van, surely? Swapping trans-axle to wheel on the same side doesn't change the thrust direction inside the CV. |
The idea is to keep the torque direction the same on the axle. |
How often does a bus axle fail for this reason? Don't think I have ever heard of an instance. Guess you should never downshift on a hill either if this particular failure is a concern to you. |
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t3 kopf
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| Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:14 am Post subject: Re: Knocking from rear end |
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The "clunk, clunk clunk" of the cv joint hitting the stub axle flange on the wheel side is usually a result of the fact that the cv joint has binded and isn't flexing and keeping "constant velocity" as is its name sake. As the axle rotates, the end of the axle strikes the flange every few rotations as a result. Better that its happening on the wheel side here instead of at the transmission side, because when this happens on the transmission side, it puts a hole in the flange seal and causes a leak. Anyway, don't try to drive it out of town very far because if allowed to continue, eventually the inner cage if the CV joint will break, and the van will not be able to move under its own power. The sensible thing to do in your situation is to remove BOTH axles, disassemble, clean, regrease, reassemble, and install the axles on the opposite side of the transmission from their original location. * edit, the prior sentence applies ONLY to manual vans, as automatic transmission vans have 2 different length axles.* This puts the ball bearings on a new track and restarts the wear cycle all over again like new. From your post, I can tell you may not be up to that task quite yet, so the best course of action would be to purchase a new cv joint shaft assy and have it installed at a shop in town to get you on your way. Keep your old shaft as was said previously. Rebuilding it is a great task to learn to accomplish because you will have this same problem again someday if you continue to drive a vanagon.
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Last edited by t3 kopf on Tue Mar 20, 2018 12:37 am; edited 1 time in total |
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