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pomfritz Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2014 Posts: 477 Location: Folsom, CA
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:01 pm Post subject: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Been having this very intermittent issue, maybe 2-3 times a year but now it’s becoming more frequent.
When I turn the key there is nothing that happens, just the red lights on the cluster light up. But no cranking or fuel pump whine. Every time though, so far, a few tries later it will start up easily. I figure it’s getting worse and will leave me stranded soon enough.
I have a spare ignition switch and am thinking that might be the cause.
Any suggestions?
Thanks _________________ 83.5 233K. GW 2.3, SS exhaust, My German Frau named her Stefi |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10379 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:09 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all,intermittent |
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Is this a standard transmission bus?
I would clean the connection at black/red wire (50) to starter then try the spare switch. Theres info here on how to swap in a new ignition switch for testing purposes.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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pomfritz Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2014 Posts: 477 Location: Folsom, CA
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Manual transmission. Thanks _________________ 83.5 233K. GW 2.3, SS exhaust, My German Frau named her Stefi |
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bobbyblack Samba Member
Joined: May 21, 2015 Posts: 4351 Location: United States, Iowa
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:21 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all,intermittent |
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Well... Hmm, no fuel pump sound either.. I'd take the fuse/relay cover off and leave the key in the 'on' position, tap around a bit on the relays and see if the fuel pump noise comes on. When it does, give a quick twist on the key to the start position and see if it cranks then.
Otherwise, ya, ignition switch. Always carry a spare or three.. Them R cheep, really _________________ '87 Westy 'Flossie','86 Westy 'R1','86 tintop GL - Subi2.2 'J2','83.5 stock tintop L 'ZoomBus','74 Karmann Ghia, '63 Notch |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10379 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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pomfritz wrote: |
Manual transmission. Thanks |
Ok. Wanted to rule out potential issue at Park/Neutral switch.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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pomfritz Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2014 Posts: 477 Location: Folsom, CA
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:26 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Fyi
When I bought the van 3 yrs ago the ignition switch and fuel pump were just replaced by a mechanic of the POs. I’ve heard the switches can be short lived. _________________ 83.5 233K. GW 2.3, SS exhaust, My German Frau named her Stefi |
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Gauche1968 Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2006 Posts: 1518
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:09 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Do you hear the fuel pump spin or no? _________________ 1984 Vanagon GL
1984 Vanagon Westy |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10379 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:14 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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If you wait for a few minutes then turn the key once from off to ignition on (not to turn starter position), do you hear the fuel pump prime?
This may not apply to Digijet but on my '88 Digifant, if key was turned to ignition on, (not to starter turn position) ignition off, ignition on in quick successions, the fuel pump wouldn't prime each time; it only primed on first turn of key to ignition on or if I waited at least a few seconds between attempts. The engine started fine every time so that pump (ECU) behaviour may be normal.
some ignition switch quality is poor, some is fine.
If the battery connections are clean, and 50 connection at starter and/or ignition switch aren't the issue.....
Bentley shows how to bypass the fuel pump relay to make pump run even if engine is off. That would be my next step.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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?Waldo? Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006 Posts: 9752 Location: Where?
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:17 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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pomfritz wrote: |
Fyi
When I bought the van 3 yrs ago the ignition switch and fuel pump were just replaced by a mechanic of the POs. I’ve heard the switches can be short lived. |
In most (all?) cases when people find the switches to be short lived, it is really an overly worn lock cylinder housing that does not rotate the ignition switch the appropriate amount. After swapping the housing, all of the switches that 'failed' usually work fine with the new housing. |
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Vanagon Nut Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008 Posts: 10379 Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:28 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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?Waldo? wrote: |
In most (all?) cases when people find the switches to be short lived, it is really an overly worn lock cylinder housing that does not rotate the ignition switch the appropriate amount. After swapping the housing, all of the switches that 'failed' usually work fine with the new housing. |
Thats a good tip. Thanks for posting that.
Neil. _________________ 1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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pomfritz Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2014 Posts: 477 Location: Folsom, CA
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:55 am Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Issue hasn’t occurred since I posted about it so that must’ve solved it. 🙂
Currently I’m suffering from the “can’t find the part I bought and need to reorder so it shows up again” syndrome. _________________ 83.5 233K. GW 2.3, SS exhaust, My German Frau named her Stefi |
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?Waldo? Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006 Posts: 9752 Location: Where?
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:20 am Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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pomfritz wrote: |
Currently I’m suffering from the “can’t find the part I bought and need to reorder so it shows up again” syndrome. |
That's an excellent description! It's a perception issue that I can totally relate to and can even explain. The psychological state of 'needing but not having' is mutually exclusive from the state of 'having' and so when you are in the former state of mind then your brain actually filters out any helpful information about the item that you 'need but don't have'. The more you 'need it because you don't have it', the more accurately your brain will filter it from your consciousness. Sometimes the item can actually be right in front of your face but you cannot see it - it is simply filtered out. The reason the initial item 'reappears' once you purchase the second one is because the act of purchasing the second one intrinsically moves you into the 'having' state of mind and so your brain no longer filters the initial item out of your perception. As an alternative to purchasing a 'new one', I've found that taking a moment (or three) to sit quietly with my eyes shut and NOT think about where the item is but instead imagine simply having the item, holding it, touching it, and imagining the thrilling feeling of finding it and then going and doing something else completely off the subject causes it to 'reappear' in short order. |
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pomfritz Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2014 Posts: 477 Location: Folsom, CA
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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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Yes I think we very much need a Vanagon shrink on this forum. 😀 _________________ 83.5 233K. GW 2.3, SS exhaust, My German Frau named her Stefi |
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mikemtnbike Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2015 Posts: 2796 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: No crank, nothing at all, intermittent |
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I find it very helpful to use a flashlight, in broad daylight, when digging through my parts bin or toolbox. My visual and mental focus automatically goes to the point of light and when it shines upon the item- voila! _________________ 1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
2020 GTI SE manual |
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