Replacement Ground Wire

[lofoxx]

Hey fellow Type 4 fans,

I have searched this board high and low but have not seen a good answer to this question...

I need to replace the thin ground wire with a brown sheath that comes from the floor to the battery (I think). It's pretty corroded. Anyone got an idea what a suitable replacement would be? It's a single-phase ground wire, I believe.

Thanks in advance,
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411

[raygreenwood]

Any stranded wire of the same gauge and insulation thickness will work. Let look in the book. I cant remember what it goes to. Ray

[hulken]

I guess it's for the diagnostic system?

[Lars S]

Agree with Hulken, if the wire is thin and brown it should be for the VW Diagnosis system.
Two diagnostic wires were connected at the battery area:
-One brown at the negative pole
-One brown/white at the earth strap where it is connected to the body, just below the battery.
None of these wires has any meaning any more and can be left out (if you dont happen to have a Bosch VW Diagnosis Computer in your workshop of course )


/Lars S
_________________
Porsche 914 -72, Bahia Red daily driver
VW411 2-d -70, White, sold
VW412 4-d, -73, Gold Metallic, daily driver
Suzuki T500, -69, Candy Gold, sold
Suzuki K50, -77, Black, daily driver
BMW R69S -69, White, sold
Husqvarna 118cc, -47, Black, Sold

[raygreenwood]

One of the wires.....yellow or brown with dashes on it that went to the diagnostic plug...was actually for the little float gauge in the original VW battery that gave a reading of the battery electrolyte level for the dealer diagnostic machine. Ray

[Lars S]

[lofoxx]

Lol. So if the wire is in crap condition I can just remove it and the car will function as intended?

I was concerned the ground wire's poor condition was causing a short, but apparently that isn't the case.

Thanks!!!
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411

[Lars S]

[lofoxx]

Thanks Lars!

So, to thicken the plot:
- Jumped the car. Started right up and idled fine.
- When I went to put the seat back down, the car hiccuped.
- When I got on the seat, the car flat died outright.

I'd taken those ground wires and gathered them together with electrical tape.

I am wondering if there is not a short that's caused when I sit in the seat... All connections appear to be sound. (Pics attached).

_________________
1972 VW 411

[hulken]

There's also a thin wire (red?) connected to the positive terminal. I just moved my batteries up front to install my Porsche seats, and I left it unconnected.

[vwoldbug]

It looks like that red & black wire is shorting on the seat spring .

[lofoxx]

@vwoldbug - so is the answer then to wrap something around the seat spring? I don't know that they're as close as the pic indicates. As well, wouldn't the sheathing on the wires prevent this?

Much obliged,
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411

[Lars S]

[lofoxx]

Holy crap Lars! I do have a plastic cover over the positive terminal, just removed it to take the picture.

Notwithstanding that, do you see anything funky that might be resulting in a similar issue?

Thanks,
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411

[Lars S]

[lofoxx]

It does cover that, though as my buddy Henry put it, "it looks like one of those things you get on a pizza to make sure the pizza doesn't get crushed by the top of the box."

Any idea how I could insulate the top of the battery/put something nonflammable atop it in order to prevent this?

I tried to start it yesterday - started fine, until I put the seat down and sat on it.

Thanks in advance,
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411

[Lars S]

Nothing under the seat should touch the top of the battery when seat down...if something does the small cover at the + terminal should protect it - no need to protect anything else i.e. no need for a top battery cover.
Maybe your battery is to high, mine is about 160mm and goes free even when seat down at its lowest position, how high is yours?

Lars S
_________________
Porsche 914 -72, Bahia Red daily driver
VW411 2-d -70, White, sold
VW412 4-d, -73, Gold Metallic, daily driver
Suzuki T500, -69, Candy Gold, sold
Suzuki K50, -77, Black, daily driver
BMW R69S -69, White, sold
Husqvarna 118cc, -47, Black, Sold

[lofoxx]

I'll measure it. I think I need to get it towed back to my place so I can work on it!
_________________
1972 VW 411

[raygreenwood]

A couple of important things:

Even with the plastic cover on...if the seat springs contact that cover...it bends the wires.

That large red wire with the translucent insulation cover...the one that is burned...burned through from the INSIDE.

That is the wrong type of ring terminal connector.

If that is not a factory style barrel crimp.....meaning its teh kind that you use a normal pair of wire crimpers on that puts a "D" shaped indentation in the barrel....there is not enough metal to wire contact.

As the plastic cover gets squeezed down on top of it...it bends the barrel terminal inside and loosens the crimp because the ring terminal is clamped hard on the bolt and does not turn or give....so it bends the crimped section making it loose. On a smaller gauge wire this would not be a problem.

I will have to check...but if memory serves...and I may be wrong....but I think the proper terminal was a male flag type ring terminal clamped onto teh bolt in that position and the heavy black and red wire had a female insulated terminal on it. This makes it lay down in a lower profile.

My bet is that when you pull that red and black wire terminal loose you find that the crimp inside under that insulating cover is bent and not making tight contact with the red and black wire...so it got hot.

Ray

[lofoxx]

I like your thinking, Ray. I will see what I can find and try to modify this weekend.

Thanks!
Loren
_________________
1972 VW 411