Motor code confusion

[hawaii65Eedge]

Aloha!

(I'm continuing to post to this thread as my wife, 7yo daughter and I work our way through this project)

We recently purchased a 76 Bay Window Bus and trying to confirm what motor we have.

Casing has a riveted number plate that reads 5573 AP 902156.

I don't see any match on the sambas motor number guide but did find the AP designation on this website.

https://projects.davidplanella.org/vw-bus/engine-codes

From the maintenance records, it says that the motor was changed out. The mechanic mentions that it use to be fuel injected but AP designation says dual carbs on that website. It also says Automatic for the transmission but our van is manual, if that makes a difference?

Any help pointing me in the right direction would be appreciated.

Work Done so far starting from 6/20/18

-Replaced dipstick oil boot
-Replaced all shocks
-Tightened CV joint bolts (All were loose with some only held in by boot. PO missed a step when putting the engine back in. It was being driven like that!

[Davydomes]

Is this any help?

http://www.thegoldenbug.com/en/vw_technical_articles/d86/engine_1800_ap
_________________
I only went to look at it!

"Mum, Dad ………. I'm Bay"

Patience is bitter, but its fruit is sweet. Jean-Jaques Rousseau

[SGKent]

look at the sticker on the back of the engine lid to see if it is a car that came to North America - either the USA or Canada. If so should be a flat engine GD or GE. If it is a North American car, and the engine is an upright then it lost its original engine and someone put in an upright engine. If it is a European bus then an upright would be normal.
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[Wildthings]

If it is a Type 4 engine it could have been built up to any of the three stock sizes or several custom sizes. Without tearing it down it is hard to know what crank and pistons are inside. If there is something wrong inside, don't buy parts until you have torn in deep enough to see what you have.

For now assuming the engine isn't worn out or damaged in some way, just drive and enjoy.

[furgo]

Welcome to The Samba!

A picture or two of your engine would greatly help those who are trying to give you a hand.

• If it's a '76 bus I assume it's not been modified to retrofit a Type 1 engine, thus you have a Type 4 engine, correct?
• The Samba engine codes guide does not include European engine codes, that's why yours is not there. AP is an European engine code (see snapshot below).
• In that regard, if that is indeed your engine code, the two linked websites are correct. Also in the fact that it originally had dual carbs.
• It might be possible that the carbs were swapped for FI at some point, but from what I've heard it was more common for folks to do the conversion the other way around.
• The riveted number plate is confusing though. The engine codes are usually stamped on the case itself, not on a plate. And they don't have the four leading numbers (5573).
• Is there no code stamped just below the oil breather box?

In summary, I would guess you might have a US/CDN bus with a transplanted European Type 4 engine, 1.8 l if it's not been modified. Nothing wrong with that

That said, I'd listen to Wildthings' advice. You won't know what engine you have until you've digged deeper into it.

European bus engine codes. No need to translate from German, I assume the figures and units speak for themselves.
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'79 Westy, P22 interior, FI 2.0 l Federal, GE engine (hydraulic lifters)

Decode your M-Plate

[Tcash]

Let's see what you have.
Code:
M-Plate Location

VIN, Chassis, Engine number locations

[hawaii65Eedge]

Thanks All

I don't have motor pics at the moment but provided M Plate and Motor Code below. Yes its a type 4 pancake motor.

To sum it up from all the comments/links it appears we have a US bus that was refitted with a European motor. All great comments and useful links provided!

Thanks Tcash for the link; Decoded link here, http://www.vw-mplate.com/mcode.php?lang=EN&id=34828

Destination said USA, Washington D.C.

[hawaii65Eedge]

The state of the motor is yet to be determined.
It's drivable but it does pop out of 1st and there is a lag or weakness for the first 10 or so minutes running. It has just one carburetor with an electric choke.

We're going to do a basic tune up, hopefully solve the oil leak in the process, and see how it feels.

If anyone can point out some good diagrams for this motor and bus components I would be thankful.

We have a Bentley manual and the How to keep your VW alive book. I cant seem to get a good feel for our motor from the diagrams. Could it be because it is a European motor?

And what's under the bus? It looks like a radiator!! I know I'm just at that initial phase where it all looks foreign. But its a VW, it's just a matter of time and then it will all come together.

[Wildthings]

What is under the bus is likely the condenser for the AC. You should have a Type 4 engine which were used in US spec buses from '72-79 and 80-83 Vanagons. The Bentley stupidly refers to them as "dual carburetor engines". You can get all the pictures you want of the engine by going to the gallery and searching for "Type 4" or Type IV" engine.

[furgo]

Thanks for the pics, much better than guessing. I'd never seen this riveted plate on a case! Someone with more experience might want to chip in, but if I were to guess, it wouldn't seem it was VW who put it there.

It seems that the original stamped engine code was erased by machining it off, or it might still be underneath the plate.

I still don't know what the leading 5573 digits mean, though.

Most importantly, and on second thoughts... that AP 902156 figure... seems unusually high. It would mean that that year they would have produced one million bus engines in that configuration, which I don't think was common. In short, I don't think 902156 is your engine serial number. The AP two-letter code might still apply.

So, whether the plate really means it's an AP 1.8 liter engine, you'll have to double-check. Perhaps an easy (but not definitive) way of telling without having to split the case or remove the heads might be to open the valve covers and look at the cylinder head part numbers, if they're still VW parts.

Looking at your decoded M-Plate:
http://www.vw-mplate.com/mcode.php?lang=EN&id=34828

Type 4 (GD) - 1970cc, 51 kW (70 bhp DIN)

It seems this US bus had originally a 2.0 liter GD engine, with fuel injection, which is long gone. That was probably what your mechanic was referring to.

You might also want to post pictures of:

• the code stamped on the fan shroud
• the sticker on the back of the engine lid

[VeeDubWolf]

Can't tell for certain with the dirt on the left end of the plate, but it looks like a VEGE/ATK rebuild, I have such a case myself! See here- https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=698028&highlight=vege
_________________
Two Bugs-
'70 rust-bucket sunroof sedan
'69 PO hack-job special
-Plus a wide assortment of various parts'n'junk

[SGKent]

photo looks like a type 4 case. The plate is over the original serial number. There should also be a number on the shroud.
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[Tcash]

Welcome to TheSamba, Bay Window Bus Forum!

73-79 NEWBIE

[hawaii65Eedge]

As always, thanks for the replies.

I'll post some pics over the weekend.

I wiped clean the motor tag and it was blank.

The number on the shroud is missing. Maybe it was machined off.

Were planning checking the valve clearances so will look for part numbers.

[Tcash]

Nice looking Bus.

Check if have Hydraulic or Solid lifters?
Click on link
Lifters Hydraulic or Solid ?

Aloha
Tcash

[hawaii65Eedge]

Here's the lid sticker. Since the motor was swapped i guess it's historical info only.

[hawaii65Eedge]

Head and Case Numbers

Came home and wife had already pulled out the push rods and tubes. And she drinks more beer than me....

[Wildthings]

You still have at least one VW head. The head was likely off not to long ago, compare the varnish on the nuts and washers with the varnish on the metal of the head.

You may also have a loose valve guide on the right hand exhaust valve, note the staining.

[Xevin]

[Angus II]