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Neil's 52 Zwitter
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VW_Jimbo Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 6:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

No worries! I was just having fun! Thought about sending a text, but thought it more fun to move your thread to the top, once again!

Hoping all is well over your way! Hoping the Bug parts are fixing themselves!
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TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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nshaddox
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:08 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

ha, wouldn't that be nice!? Last venture out into the garage everything was the same as I'd left it, so doesn't appear as though things are fixing themselves out there. I do have a couple little jobs I can do in the basement, but have to prioritize some house stuff first.

thanks for checking in; it does help motivate me knowing folks are looking for updates. Nice work on the ragtop graft, also. I've been following along.
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mandraks
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:29 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

i should be working on my 53, but i find it much easier to watch what everybody else is doing Shocked
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'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:39 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Long overdue update. Been spending the last few days on front beam assembly. Haven’t had big blocks of time, just an hour here and there.

Got all the bushings/roller bearings installed with my original vw273a factory drift. Had to swap one roller bearing due to it being damaged during removal.
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Powder coat on the beam has been flaking off wherever the shop that did the job allowed grease to leak out of it in the oven. Pretty frustrating, but I keep reminding myself that I’m planning to drive this thing eventually and that it will become imperfect anyways as a result of that. I’ll have to just do some touch up painting here and there to protect the bare spots.

Made this little tool to help clean the old grease/grit out of the beam and torsion arms. You fold up a rag and thread it through the needle. I used acetone to clean stuff up but you have to be careful because it will wipe the powdercoat right off. Mount it to an extender and drill.
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Beam with new leaf springs and replated hardware. Torsion arms installed, new zerk fittings, new seals, and greased up. One of my lower torsion arms is the early flat style. Didn’t grease that tube yet because I may look for another late style one to run instead. Mismatched stuff kinda bugs me.
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Also found an early style round dimmer switch recently to replace my crusty original one in a recent part stash. Hooray! Not sure if the early connector block will be useful on this car too? Wiring seems so far off I haven’t even started worrying about it yet.
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mandraks
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 1:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

aah, the good old german "Lüsterklemme". beats the socks off "wirenuts" in my book.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Nice to read an update!

Based off your experience, maybe I will just stick to paint. I was considering having the front beam and arms powder coated, but maybe not now.

Looks like forward progress. Keep chipping away!
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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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Isbrand52
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Three wire connecter is used for horn and brake light switch. It is directly below 6 fuse panel in truck beside gas tank
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Awesome, that bit of info will help me out in the future I’m sure. While we are on the topic of wiring, might as well get into some forensics and ask the experts out there what I need to track down eventually for a standard Zwitter. Car did come with some interesting bits to help prove that it’s a standard, but leaves some questions about the 5mo only parts for me.

Question number one right now is do standards have any of those door switches for the interior light or no? Correct me if I’m wrong but I think if they did there would be some holes in the rectangular recess on the A pillar where there clearly haven’t ever been?
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So then follow up question is would this thing still have the 3 position switch under the dash for the speedo/interior lights or would it not need that many positions? Maybe this is a dumb question; I haven’t reviewed a wiring diagram yet. The metal parts of my 3 way switch are in the parts stash, but no Bakelite or harness remains to help with the guess. Also, would the 3 way switch if it is indeed a 3 way switch for this car have a brown knob to match the other dark knobs? See headlight switch, turn signal, and shifter which I believe are all OG?
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Also as luck would have it, the 3 terminal wire block happens to be the only one that I actually had with the stash of original parts. One that I found with the dimmer is nicer though so that’s fine. What other blocks do I need to wire this car up? And is the 6 terminal fuse block unique to Zwitter a or what? Mine is clearly F’ed as they say. Don’t early split buses have 6 fuses? Same fuse block?

Also, I think my turn signal arm is slightly bent. Can anyone confirm that they are supposed to be straight or angled some way?

Pedal pads I think should be big logo, but one of these two nice originals came with the parts stash for this car and the other came from a 60 I cut up a few years back. Thinking I’ll probably just run them. Hmm I wonder if I ever put pads on the bubble car pedals? Might be a better home for them. I’d just kinda like for good original stuff to get put to use...

I think I’m just gonna clean all the original interior stuff up rather than make it all shiny and new and perfect. Paint isn’t all that bad and it’s only original once, right?
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2021 8:25 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

BTW: In case you haven't thought of this already, soak the terminal block and the fuse block in white vinegar for a couple of days. You will be amazed at how they come out.

Also how did that klassic fab A pillar base work? I used the Autocraft one on the passenger side and it took days of reshaping to get it to fit. On the drivers side I have a Virtanen one and it is going to be a beast to get it to fit too.

Don
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Neil Great work on your car My Zwitter is deluxe so not sure of some of your car. The fact that A piller has no hole punched for door switch tells me it never had them You will need three connectors- two three and one one Three by six fuse panel, three in engine compartment for tail/brake lights and a one by four fuse panel by speedo. Yes my turn signal handle has a small bend in it Don't know if they're supposed to. My toggle switch is three position Left (manual interior light) Centre (Door control interior light) Right (Night time illumination in Speedo) Not sure why they didn't wire speedo to headlight switch but that's the way the wiring diagrams show If your using Bentley manual for wiring diagrams make sure you pick the correct one. With no door control my guess would be Centre is neutral Fuse panel 6 Fuse Pt# 111 937-031 was used until Always checking your progress Bob Jan 54 Six fuse Type 2 is same part number Keep going Bob
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 1:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

more forensics and more parts.

I'm pretty sure now that zwitter interior light 3 way switch is the same as a barndoor bus semaphore switch. at least they appear the same. But I haven't done a continuity test yet. This is good news because I thought the black knob would be impossible to find, but it was pretty easy. What's left of my original switch is on the bottom-I thought this was some sort of aftermarket toggle switch since there were a couple bonus holes in the dash that seemed to be the right size for it-good thing I didn't throw them out immediately. At this point I don't think they would have thrown a unique switch on even if they didn't have the door switches. Makes a lot more sense that they'd just grab something already available from the bus parts bin.
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Also, per previous remarks, I would typically soak the fusebox to clean it up, but I believe mine is beyond repair. I should have a good 4 fuse block some where in my collection of parts since I've parted out like 5 60 bugs, but will have to look for one of these.
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@sunroof, A-pillar metal was ok, but I did separate all the pieces and make some modifications, you can look back through the thread for specifics. minor reshaping and weld flange gap adjustment still needed, but overall happy with them.

In other news, while I was digging for the remnants of the interior switch, I confirmed I am missing ribbed door vent window pivots. I've picked up some 53-55 vent window frames with crappy chrome. I assume this car would have had painted vent window frames and divider bar originally, but does anyone know? Hoffman zwitter standard-maybe impossible to answer?

Picked up a vent window pivot off the classifieds and I'm planning to repop them. any idea whether there is a market? Doesn't seem like there is much in the way of hardware available for ribbed doors.

No garage time lately, hopefully soon.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Doesn’t look like much but I’m 5 more hours into rust repair on the air vents today. Had to repair 3 of the vents on the inner panel before welding in the repair piece I made last fall. That needed some minor reshaping once it was tacked in. Removed what was left of the old deck lid holders as well but decided that was a good stopping point. Probably going to fabricate a new deck lid spring holder too. This one is quite crusty and thin. A lot of effort to get this rear window area nice again.
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Did some research in the oval forum, posting here for reference. Shiny vent window pivot is 54-55, crusty one is 52-54. Have to decide what I’d like to reproduce. Thinking I’m gonna go for the later style, it looks better engineered to me. Also earlier bracket looks harder to fabricate and fiber washer looks harder to replicate.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 3:39 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Probably 13 hrs into vent repair now but happy to say it’s 95% there now. Just a bit more time needed to clean it up some more with hammers/dolly/files/dremel/sand paper.

Cleaned up the decklid hangers and even though no one will be able to tell swapped the square projection weld nuts for the more 52 correct tabbed style.
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Made a new spring holder. Mine was super crusty and thin in the back from water (acid rain) coming through the vents?
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Spot welded on and noticed more asymmetry in the vent panel profile on either side of the center rib. Gotta love the imperfections on these early cars.
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And some overall shots with everything in place. It’s almost ready to go back into the car.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 3:49 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Really, really nice work and attention to detail.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 4:47 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Quote:
Cleaned up the decklid hangers and even though no one will be able to tell swapped the square projection weld nuts for the more 52 correct tabbed style.
I think your photo of the hangers is the very first time I've seen a specific photo of the inner structure in 30+ years in the hobby. I'm impressed by your fab skills with the rot repair sections and the spring mount.
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Quote:
aah, the good old german "Lüsterklemme"
I think mandraks and I would be amused at the mispronunciation of this word by most non-German speaking people... the closest would be "LISTER clem-meh".
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 6:15 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Even after all the fab work I did on my car I'm still pretty impressed by this little spring perch. Well done.

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Also: @nshaddox it would be nice if thesamba adopted the tagging convention that BaT uses.

Also also: Hot damn I could have used a set of these:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2421147

What I went through shouldn't happen to a dog.

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Don
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 9:32 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

Neil. Are those the hinge supports I sent to you? They worked out well, regardless.

Nice work!
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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

@esde, thanks for the props

@Rome, this is the first time I've had to see how these hinge supports were constructed too, with my 20yrs in the hobby. always nice to know there is more to learn, but doubt I will ever take on a car this bad again. probably?

@sunroof, I was quite pleased with the spring perch, wish it had a bit more of a radius at the bends but I can live with it. It looks like a little dog or something, it was making me chuckle sitting on the bench. I wish you'd been able to use the hinges I made too, it would be nice to recoup more of the cost I have in those.

@everett, maybe you can take the tagging feedback?

@jimbo, yea these are the supports you sent me from the 59 clip you used on your 54. Many thanks for the props, literally this time. (get it, hood props? maybe a stretch...) Sorry meant to give you a shout out for them the first time around!

-Neil
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

nshaddox wrote:
@jimbo, yea these are the supports you sent me from the 59 clip you used on your 54. Many thanks for the props, literally this time. (get it, hood props? maybe a stretch...) Sorry meant to give you a shout out for them the first time around!


All good! No shout out required. I just did not recognize them. I thought that the pair I sent you were in rougher shape than those in the picture. Super glad they found a home!

Keep it moving! I love reading your updates!
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TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:57 am    Post subject: Re: Neil's 52 Zwitter Reply with quote

couple more hours in on Tuesday.

final patch on inner vent complete. just have to punch some holes for spot welding and this piece is done. 20 hours total maybe-thats why its better not to count. debating on welding this in now or during paint stage?
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either way, had to finish up package tray upper lip repair. corners weren't done before, just kinda tight clearance in there. ended up busting out the old MIG to get it done. made it pretty quick and easy. so inner vents are basically ready to go in now. may clean up the backside of the seam a bit more with the TIG, but maybe not since the interior side is finished out pretty well now.
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kinda crappy photo, but there were 6 holes in the package tray down near the firewall, not sure what they were drilled for but they didn't seem original since some went through the ribs and some went through the flats. while I had the MIG going I made them disappear.
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I might remove the half moon piece next to repair it. whoever cut out the package tray in the past sort of hacked it up in the process. I think its repairable though.

In Fiat news, had that thing cranking over a couple weeks ago. gonna try starting it again tonight. I think compression test is in order. 600 motor with 850 crank in it required .040" of material removal between pistons and head to '0' deck (minus head gasket thickness). didn't really cc chambers but I am afraid compression ratio is in excess of what the starter can handle. high torque starters maybe available in europe, for about what I paid for the car. such a stupid little car. stick with the german stuff folks, italian stuff is 4x the price and 4x the headaches.
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