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Everything needed for an AHU conversion
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OldBlueSyncro
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 10:02 pm    Post subject: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

I know there's a lot of topics on these conversions, but I can't seem to find one that lists all parts needed for a AHU conversion.

If anyone could post a link to a thread on it, that would be greatly appreciated!
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:13 am    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

At the top of the vanagon forum, there is a FAQ thread. There is some information on diesel conversions, but there is not an exact thread for the AHU conversion. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=402326
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?Waldo?
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:31 am    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

That's too broad of a question. There are many ways to do many parts of the conversion with upsides/downsides to each.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:31 am    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

I notice your username has the word syncro in it. Are you asking about installing a diesel into a syncro? That is a more unique install vs converting a 2wd.
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tjet Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

I plan on doing a M-TDI swap in my syncro down the road. I bought a AHU swap take-out from a 1984 van, which consisted of a complete '96 Passat TDI engine, and all the specific parts off an original 1.6 Vanagon diesel (bellhousing, oil pump and pan, carrier bars, etc). The only unusual part is the exhaust manifold. It's off a Canadian AAZ diesel.

There a 2 ways to mount the AHU, at a 50 deg angle or 15 degree. I chose the 50 deg - same as a factory US spec vanagon diesel.

What I need to get is a special syncro only fuel tank, power steering pump, all the hoses and small parts, longer trans input shaft, and finally a modified M-TDI pump from a range rover.

I'm sure I will discover that I'm missing a bunch of other things once I start my conversion...

Note, you also need to budget in a transmission regear to match the TDI powerband. This would include swapping in a longer transmission input shaft.

FYI - this conversion will cost $7000 & up depending on your skill level.
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?Waldo?
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
...What I need to get is a... longer trans input shaft, and finally a modified M-TDI pump from a range rover.


The diesel input shaft is shorter than the gas one.

To run the Land Rover 300TDI injection pump on an AHU, the AHU pump bracket needs to be modified. The pump doesn't really need any modification other than very minor exterior details like mounting the accelerator cable.
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OldBlueSyncro
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

I realize now how broad of a question that is. Sorry about that. I just dumped a quick question on here before bed so that I would hopefully wake up to some responses.

I'll ask a few more precise questions:

1) If I sourced a stock diesel vanagon, the cradle bar/engine mounts would work for a 1.6d but will they work for all the td/tdi diesel engines? AAZ, AHU, ALH?

2) Since there's not many diesel syncro tanks out there, what options do I have with my stock gas tank? Would the kennedy 50deg bellhousing with that tdi starter adapter plate clear the tank?

3) How difficult is it to find one of these mtdi injection pump candidates? Do some of them require internal modifications?

At the moment I'm thinking of pulling the 1.6d out of my golf and putting it into my syncro since I'm having difficulty getting the wbx in there right now to even run right due to the PO's hack and slash job on the wiring. Then down the road I'll find a AAZ or AHU and put it in there.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

I also realize how slow the 1.6d will be in a syncro, but I'm never in a rush when driving.

Reliability > Fuel Efficiency > Speed

I'm especially not in a rush when on a road trip and driving through some awesome scenery.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

You need to ask yourself why you are doing the swap. Each of the engines you listed have their own pros & cons. The AHU & AAZ can be installed like the original diesel, but the AHU is more efficient from my understanding. The ALH is even more efficient, but is the most complex swap.

I do think your idea of finding a diesel donor van is a good idea, but not a requirement.
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OldBlueSyncro
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
You need to ask yourself why you are doing the swap. Each of the engines you listed have their own pros & cons. The AHU & AAZ can be installed like the original diesel, but the AHU is more efficient from my understanding. The ALH is even more efficient, but is the most complex swap.

I do think your idea of finding a diesel donor van is a good idea, but not a requirement.


I'm looking for a more simple, more reliable, and more efficient engine. I also just prefer diesels for some reason. Must be because I grew up with them.

The AHU seems like the conversion with the most "bang for your buck". At least it does to me. The "buck" being money, effort, time, and sanity.

I don't have the required skills and tools to fabricate my own engine cradle. If I can't find a donor van, who can I look to for this part of the conversion?
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

OldBlueSyncro wrote:
1) If I sourced a stock diesel vanagon, the cradle bar/engine mounts would work for a 1.6d but will they work for all the td/tdi diesel engines? AAZ, AHU, ALH?


They will work for the 1.6, 1.6TD, 1.9TD(AAZ), and the mk3 TDI engines (1Z/AHU/AFN). They will not work with the ALH unless you do a lot of custom work, most notably making a custom oil pan, custom oil pickup tube, modifying for A/C compressor, etc...

Note, though, that the syncro diesel carrier bars are a bit different. They allow the engine to mount lower to match the rest of the syncro drive train. I think you'd have some modification to do to use the 2WD bars in a syncro. I haven't done that personally, though, so I'll refrain from further comment.

Quote:
2) Since there's not many diesel syncro tanks out there, what options do I have with my stock gas tank? Would the kennedy 50deg bellhousing with that tdi starter adapter plate clear the tank?


It seems like you're confusing things a bit. The stock vanagon diesel installs the engine at 50° using the stock diesel vanagon bell housing. Kennedy makes and adapter plate that installs the engine at either 15° (stock golf/jetta angle) or at 50°. The Kennedy adapter plate will allow the use of the stock gas syncro fuel tank. You would then want to use a TDI starter and a starter adapter from Westyventures.

Quote:
3) How difficult is it to find one of these mtdi injection pump candidates? Do some of them require internal modifications?


The LR300TDI injection pumps are available new or rebuilt from several online vendors. There are always several available used on Ebay.UK. The LR300TDI does not require any internal modifications and will give better performance than a stock eTDI. Some folks (myself included) have built mTDI injection pumps to run the VW TDI engines using other base pumps that did require internal modifications. I have built quite a few from Cummins 4BTA pumps. Some people use AAZ pumps for the base pump but IMO they are a poor base pump to start with.

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At the moment I'm thinking of pulling the 1.6d out of my golf and putting it into my syncro since I'm having difficulty getting the wbx in there right now to even run right due to the PO's hack and slash job on the wiring. Then down the road I'll find a AAZ or AHU and put it in there.


I wouldn't. Sounds like a waste of time to me. The 1.6 non turbo vanagon has terrible performance even in a 2WD with super-short gearing. Add the rest of the syncro drive train and taller gearing and you'd have a bunch of time into building a rig that would be painful to drive.
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tjet Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

Quote:
I'm looking for a more simple, more reliable, and more efficient engine

Quote:
who can I look to for this part of the conversion?



IMO, it will be an expensive conversion if you have a shop do it. The simplest option is leaving in your current 2.1 wbx gasser. The diesels can be more reliable than a gas engine, but they do break.

My $7000 estimate is based on you doing the heavy lifting.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
Quote:
I'm looking for a more simple, more reliable, and more efficient engine

Quote:
who can I look to for this part of the conversion?



IMO, it will be an expensive conversion if you have a shop do it. The simplest option is leaving in your current 2.1 wbx gasser. The diesels can be more reliable than a gas engine, but they do break.

My $7000 estimate is based on you doing the heavy lifting.


I'd definitely do the install myself, I have those tools and skills but I just don't have a welder and I don't think I have enough experience/faith in myself to fabricate something that won't break and leave me stranded. Is there anyone who has designed something that is just a bolt in for a diesel conversion? Does FAS do the AHU?
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

If you get a donor van & go with a AHU, it's just of a matter of swapping things (exhaust may need some welding). The carrier bars may be an issue for a syncro as noted above.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

You could do the whole swap without any welding aside from the exhaust which you could have done at an exhaust shop.
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OldBlueSyncro
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

?Waldo? wrote:
You could do the whole swap without any welding aside from the exhaust which you could have done at an exhaust shop.


I'd just have to find some diesel syncro carrier bars?
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

If you can't find the parts elsewhere for less, Quality German in Montclair probably has the syncro bars and even the syncro diesel fuel tank if you want to go that route.

Or if you prefer new, you can get them here: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1861806
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Everything needed for an AHU conversion Reply with quote

Look in the classifieds. There is a member making replica carrier bars including for the syncro. He also fabricates adapters for hydraulic mounts. If you want a syncro diesel tank, put a wtb add in the classifieds. That's how I got one for my project.
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