Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Strange VW beetle hesitation
Page: 1, 2  Next
Forum Index -> Beetle - Late Model/Super - 1968-up Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:05 am    Post subject: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Hi there,
My 71 beetle has recently been experiencing severe hesitation ( sometimes so much that it stalls at traffic lights) when I try to pull away. I have real trouble getting it into 1st and 2nd as the engine misfires unless I push the pedal down harder and rev it up real good and power shift. Also I've been pumping the gas pedal slightly when driving off to prevent myself from stalling. I've done valve clearances done point gap, it's timed correctly and I've also checked for exhaust leaks and haven't found one (when I cup my hand over carb, engine dies immediately). Oh and also it's not the carb to my knowledge as that has recently had an overhaul :s So what on earth could it be? I thought it might be the fuel pump but surely the engine wouldn't run at all? It idles sweet and once you get it up to 4th it goes okay.

Here's one more baffling fact, the problem is intermittent, usually when I set off it doesn't hesitate at all, only after a while of driving it gets bad!

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hotsam
Samba Member


Joined: December 02, 2015
Posts: 366
Location: Ashburn, VA
hotsam is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Could be a vacuum leak, a bad condenser, or the distributer not advancing properly.
_________________
1968 Beetle
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sb001
Samba Member


Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 10406
Location: NW Arkansas
sb001 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:25 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

If it's only happening after the engine is warmed up, you might check that the fuel pump pushrod guide sleeve is not expanding inside the pump stand causing the rod to catch on it.


Link



Link

_________________
I'm the humblest guy on this board.

1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sb001
Samba Member


Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 10406
Location: NW Arkansas
sb001 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:31 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Also you said the carburetor had recently been overhauled, please also check to make sure the float hinge pin inside the float bowl was oriented correctly- the curved part of the pin faces the FRONT of the car.
_________________
I'm the humblest guy on this board.

1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Uberchin
Samba Member


Joined: April 07, 2018
Posts: 26
Location: San Antonio, Florida
Uberchin is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

When you say the carb was 'overhauled', who did it, was it the basic kit? Ensure the throttle shaft isn't leaking vacuum at the bushings. Use starter fluid to spray around the carb and manifold seals to check for leaks. Also, was the accerator pump passages cleaned out; required by removing the two small BBs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:46 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sb001 wrote:
Also you said the carburetor had recently been overhauled, please also check to make sure the float hinge pin inside the float bowl was oriented correctly- the curved part of the pin faces the FRONT of the car.



Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Is this what you are talking about being the right way round?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:49 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

hotsam wrote:
Could be a vacuum leak, a bad condenser, or the distributer not advancing properly.


I've checked for this by sucking air through the vacuum line to the distributor and the distributor does move and stays how it should and I've also replaced the condenser with no change - but how would one know if the distributor is not advancing properly? I don't want to just buy another distributor to find out if you see what I mean.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sb001
Samba Member


Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 10406
Location: NW Arkansas
sb001 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:33 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:
Is this what you are talking about being the right way round?


Yes, that positioning is correct.
_________________
I'm the humblest guy on this board.

1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
ashman40
Samba Member


Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15985
Location: North Florida, USA
ashman40 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Please ID your carb make/model# and your distributor model#?
Also confirm your ignition timing?

Could it be the "infamous" 34Pict + "009" combo? Confused

This "mash up" is often the cause of massive hesitation on acceleration from idle. In many cases it is NOT possible to "tune" the problem away since these two were never meant to work together.... just saying Cool
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Mark Evans Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: April 21, 2004
Posts: 1931
Location: Alsea,Oregon
Mark Evans is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 2:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:
hotsam wrote:
Could be a vacuum leak, a bad condenser, or the distributer not advancing properly.


I've checked for this by sucking air through the vacuum line to the distributor and the distributor does move and stays how it should and I've also replaced the condenser with no change - but how would one know if the distributor is not advancing properly? I don't want to just buy another distributor to find out if you see what I mean.
Using a timing light, watch for your advance as you rev it up.
_________________
'63 Ragtop
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Starbucket
Samba Member


Joined: April 30, 2007
Posts: 4025
Location: WA
Starbucket is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Check (with motor off) by looking down carb bore and slowly open the throttle, the accelerator pump should start squirting gas as soon as you start and continue till open. If it starts late, move the adjuster on linkage toward +.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

ashman40 wrote:
Please ID your carb make/model# and your distributor model#?
Also confirm your ignition timing?

Could it be the "infamous" 34Pict + "009" combo? Confused

This "mash up" is often the cause of massive hesitation on acceleration from idle. In many cases it is NOT possible to "tune" the problem away since these two were never meant to work together.... just saying Cool



I have heard of this combo and thankfully I don't have an 009 as I've heard they have horrible flat spots. I've got an original distributor from the 1200 engine with part number 043 905 205 K - couldn't find a lot about this distributor online but from what I've found I take it to be the 'stock' distributor VW put on their 1200 engines during '71. I've static timed it to 10BTDC. My carb is a Solex H30/31 PICT.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Starbucket wrote:
Check (with motor off) by looking down carb bore and slowly open the throttle, the accelerator pump should start squirting gas as soon as you start and continue till open. If it starts late, move the adjuster on linkage toward +.


Ah thanks I haven't tried this, what adjuster do you mean? (Don't know the names of the parts of the carb)

Thank you
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Starbucket
Samba Member


Joined: April 30, 2007
Posts: 4025
Location: WA
Starbucket is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:
Starbucket wrote:
Check (with motor off) by looking down carb bore and slowly open the throttle, the accelerator pump should start squirting gas as soon as you start and continue till open. If it starts late, move the adjuster on linkage toward +.


Ah thanks I haven't tried this, what adjuster do you mean? (Don't know the names of the parts of the carb)

Thank you


Follow the linkage down to the throttle shaft. On yours I think it's under the bowl.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
ashman40
Samba Member


Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15985
Location: North Florida, USA
ashman40 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 8:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:
I have heard of this combo and thankfully I don't have an 009 as I've heard they have horrible flat spots.

I've got an original distributor from the 1200 engine with part number 043 905 205 K - couldn't find a lot about this distributor online but from what I've found I take it to be the 'stock' distributor VW put on their 1200 engines during '71. I've static timed it to 10BTDC. My carb is a Solex H30/31 PICT.

I found it listed in the Tune Up parts list (near the bottom of the first page):
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/Bosch_Tune_Up_Parts/Bosch_Tune_Up_Parts.pdf
Quote:
0 231 170 186 | 043905205K | 1970s - 1980s non-US T1

It shows the replacement part#s but no spec for timing.

As suggested above, connect a strobe timing light and make sure the timing advances as the rpms increase. Then, disconnect and plug the vacuum hose and see if it makes a difference as you rev the engine again. If the timing increases ONLY while the vacuum is connected then you have a SVA/SVSA distributor. If the timing still increases while the vacuum hose is disconnected then you have a mechanical advance that increases with engine rpms and your vacuum advance supplements this... you have an SVDA distributor. Another way to check for mechanical advance is to twist the rotor by hand and make sure it springs back.


With your H30/31 carb...
If you have an SVA/SVSA, connect your vacuum advance hose to port "A".
If you have an SVDA, connect your vacuum hose to port "D".
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

See if that makes a difference in off-idle acceleration.
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 6:12 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Starbucket wrote:
Check (with motor off) by looking down carb bore and slowly open the throttle, the accelerator pump should start squirting gas as soon as you start and continue till open. If it starts late, move the adjuster on linkage toward +.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


So are you saying this jet should squirt as soon as I pull the throttle lever and all the way through as I pull the lever? Because it starts squirting after I've pulled the throttle lever out half way!?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sb001
Samba Member


Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 10406
Location: NW Arkansas
sb001 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 6:30 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:


So are you saying this jet should squirt as soon as I pull the throttle lever and all the way through as I pull the lever? Because it starts squirting after I've pulled the throttle lever out half way!?


Yes that nozzle should start to squirt fuel as soon as you pull the throttle arm (or depress the accelerator pedal.)
If there is a lag before it starts squirting, that's probably the accelerator pump linkage needing to be adjusted as mentioned in another post above.

Here you go:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531249
_________________
I'm the humblest guy on this board.

1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
hotsam
Samba Member


Joined: December 02, 2015
Posts: 366
Location: Ashburn, VA
hotsam is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 6:33 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

Quote:
Using a timing light, watch for your advance as you rev it up.


Exactly this.

I was having similar hesitation and backfires - I tried to time it and it just danced all over the place. For a while I thought my timing light was broken.

I put in a refurbished DVDA and it was instantly fixed.
_________________
1968 Beetle
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sebdaneb07
Samba Member


Joined: July 07, 2017
Posts: 30
Location: UK
sebdaneb07 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sb001 wrote:
sebdaneb07 wrote:


So are you saying this jet should squirt as soon as I pull the throttle lever and all the way through as I pull the lever? Because it starts squirting after I've pulled the throttle lever out half way!?


Yes that nozzle should start to squirt fuel as soon as you pull the throttle arm (or depress the accelerator pedal.)
If there is a lag before it starts squirting, that's probably the accelerator pump linkage needing to be adjusted as mentioned in another post above.

Here you go:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531249



Great! Thanks for the help think I've fixed the issue now, it now squirts as soon as I pull the throttle arm Smile while I was at it I also sanded down the fuel pump plastic base a bit as it was stuck in there like it was glued in - now it just slides in Smile better to be safe than sorry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
sb001
Samba Member


Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 10406
Location: NW Arkansas
sb001 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 8:37 am    Post subject: Re: Strange VW beetle hesitation Reply with quote

sebdaneb07 wrote:
sb001 wrote:
sebdaneb07 wrote:


So are you saying this jet should squirt as soon as I pull the throttle lever and all the way through as I pull the lever? Because it starts squirting after I've pulled the throttle lever out half way!?


Yes that nozzle should start to squirt fuel as soon as you pull the throttle arm (or depress the accelerator pedal.)
If there is a lag before it starts squirting, that's probably the accelerator pump linkage needing to be adjusted as mentioned in another post above.

Here you go:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531249



Great! Thanks for the help think I've fixed the issue now, it now squirts as soon as I pull the throttle arm Smile while I was at it I also sanded down the fuel pump plastic base a bit as it was stuck in there like it was glued in - now it just slides in Smile better to be safe than sorry


Hopefully one or both of these helped- take it for a spin and report back!
_________________
I'm the humblest guy on this board.

1969 autostick sedan, family owned since new
1600 SP engine
Solex 30 PICT 3 carburetor
Bosch 113905205AE autostick distributor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Beetle - Late Model/Super - 1968-up All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.