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vwhammer
Samba Member
Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 998
Location: Boulder CO.
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 Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 9:12 am Post subject: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Seriously I have been searching for this info for 2 days and I can't seem to get any concrete answer for what I need to make this work.
What I want is one of the 36mm gear oil pumps with a pickup tube for a VW inline 4 cylinder in Vanagon mounted at 50 degrees.
I have a 2.0 gas engine from a 96 Jetta to start with (AKA the ABA)
Every time I find a thread that shows some promise people start throwing around engine codes and other jibberish that I know nothing about.
I need years and types of cars so I can look up the parts not engine codes.
Heck a part number would be just fine.
I have been through most of the threads on here that cover a lot of this but as I said people start talking like everyone is VW engine code expert and I get lost.
Can anyone help me sort this out ? |
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vanagonjr
Samba Member
Joined: October 07, 2010
Posts: 3431
Location: Dartmouth, Mass.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 9:44 am Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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I believe you will be forced to put two pumps together- I.e. Use the Diesel pick-up tube assembled to the in-line 4 (ABA if a 2.0L) oil pump.
At least that's what I was assembling before passing on my own in-line 4 using diesel mounting bars/bell housing (50 deg install)
John
_________________
John - 86 Wolfsburg Westfalia "Weekender"
Flint reversed 1.8T W/Passat 5-Speed
LiMBO (late model bus club) www.limbobus.org
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FAQ thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=525798 |
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vwhammer
Samba Member
Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 998
Location: Boulder CO.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 9:52 am Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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| Yeah that definitely seems to be the thing that people are doing I am.just not sure what pumps they are buying to get all the parts |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:43 am Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Adjustments I made to the pump housing aside, here's what I did.
Bought new Febi diesel Vanagon oil pump. Attached the new diesel pick up tube from that pump to the used ABA 2.0 (jetta/golf) oil pump gears/gear housing. I'd guess at least one of our vendors will have stock of that pump.
Some folks re use a used diesel pump pick up tube but the risk there is that the relief valve can be sticky or stuck. Especially if the pump was sourced from a used Vanagon 1.6 NA engine. At minimum, would suggest thoroughly cleaning the mesh screen if using a used diesel pump. Some folks have polished up the relief valve piston to make sure it moves well. There are threads here on that detail. Key word search 'prime', 'primes', 'I4' may help find those threads.
Neil.
images of used diesel pick up tube I was going to use
looking down inside pickup tube to screen
some of the crud that came off screen
diesel pump PN
_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 11:49 am Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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My preferred approach is to buy a new diesel pump and then press out and swap the diesel drive shaft for the gasser version.
_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 17155
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:05 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Casey, I was going to post the same thing, but I think he wants the taller gears for the hydraulic lifter cylinder head. I wasn't sure if the shaft would be long enough with the taller gears.
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?Waldo?
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 9752
Location: Where?
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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All the new diesel Vanagon oil pumps have the 36mm tall gears which is as tall as the gasser ones.
I haven't ever pressed the shaft out/into the gears but I imagine that would work. The alternative is, of course, to buy two new pumps, one for the gasser 2.0 and the other for the diesel vanagon. Then swap the diesel vanagon pickup onto the gasser pump. You can then swap the gasser pickup onto the new diesel vanagon pump which will result in a complete brand new golf/jetta mk1-mk3 diesel pump. |
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vwhammer
Samba Member
Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 998
Location: Boulder CO.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Yes ?waldo? I read your reply in one of the other post about this and it was the closest I got to the answer.
I was still a little confused.
So you are suggesting that I might be able to buy a new pump for a old diesel vanagon and just swap the shaft.
This would net me a pump with the 36mm gears and a 50 degree pickup that will bolt onto my 96 2.0 gas engine? |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 1:15 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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The gasser shaft will work with the new 36mm diesel pumps. At least the ones I've done this with in the past. The gears press on/off quite easily with a shop press.
_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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?Waldo?
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 9752
Location: Where?
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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| What part of it seems confusing? |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Adjustments I made to the pump housing aside, here's what I did.
Bought new Febi diesel Vanagon oil pump. Attached the new diesel pick up tube from that pump to the used ABA 2.0 (jetta/golf) oil pump gears/gear housing.
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From what I've read, the gears don't wear that much. IMO, no real harm in re using the 2.0 pump housing and gears unless they have really high miles and/or excessive lash play.
I did notice however, that the bushing in the pump gear housing can develop lateral wear and that might exacerbate amount of gear lash measured. (cause a somewhat false reading)
Neil.
_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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vwhammer
Samba Member
Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 998
Location: Boulder CO.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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| ?Waldo? wrote: |
| What part of it seems confusing? |
Well I guess what I was assuming was that when people referred to the 36mm diesel pumps they were talking about a newer TDI pump.
If I buy a new oil pump for a Vanagon diesel that is mounted at 50 degrees does it have the 36mm gears?
Does the pump in my 96 ABA engine have the 36mm gears?
Obviously I need a diesel vanagon oil pump for the pick up tube but I swear that I saw some that appeared to have the tube cast into the pump
I was curisous how people were putting these tubes on the 36mm pumps.
of course there is also this one which clearly has a bolt on tube that could be swapped.
This is where my confusion lies.
However, If I can just buy a Vanagon 50 degree diesel oil pump and it has the 36mm gears then there is no more confusion.
I will simply swap the shaft from my ABA pump to the van diesel pump and we are good to go. |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 8:05 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Yes, new Vanagon diesel pumps come with 36mm gears, so you can just swap the shafts.
_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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?Waldo?
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 9752
Location: Where?
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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| ?Waldo? wrote: |
| All the new diesel Vanagon oil pumps have the 36mm tall gears which is as tall as the gasser ones. |
In other markets the vanagon came with the JX 1.6TD engine and the KY 1.7L engine. The oil pump for the JX (and I believe the KY also) had 36mm gears. Because the 36mm gear pump works fine for the 1.6 non-turbo engine, the 36mm diesel Vanagon pump superseded the earlier 30mm pump and for more than a decade (maybe two) ALL of the replacement diesel vanagon oil pumps have had 36mm gears.
| vwhammer wrote: |
| If I buy a new oil pump for a Vanagon diesel that is mounted at 50 degrees does it have the 36mm gears? |
Yes, unless of course, you buy an NOS original pump that someone has had hidden in their basement for 20 years.
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| Does the pump in my 96 ABA engine have the 36mm gears? |
Yes.
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Obviously I need a diesel vanagon oil pump for the pick up tube but I swear that I saw some that appeared to have the tube cast into the pump
I was curisous how people were putting these tubes on the 36mm pumps. |
The diesel vanagon oil pump pickup tube includes the tube, pressure control valve and pump lid all as part of the casting. That entire assembly is bolted to the body of the pump with two m6 bolts.
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of course there is also this one which clearly has a bolt on tube that could be swapped.
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The golf/jetta 15° pumps have the pump lid and pressure control valve as an aluminum casting and then have the bolt-on pickup tube. See the two m6 allen head bolts that are parallel to the pump shaft? Unbolt those and the pump lid, pressure control valve, and the bolted on pickup tube will come off that pump. Swap the diesel one on and Bob's your uncle.
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This is where my confusion lies.
However, If I can just buy a Vanagon 50 degree diesel oil pump and it has the 36mm gears then there is no more confusion.
I will simply swap the shaft from my ABA pump to the van diesel pump and we are good to go. |
One of the pump gears is pressed onto the pump shaft. I think that it would be unwise to swap the gasser shaft and gear into the new diesel vanagon oil pump, but if you have a shop press then swapping the new diesel gear onto the used gasser shaft seems quite doable. |
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vwhammer
Samba Member
Joined: May 20, 2006
Posts: 998
Location: Boulder CO.
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| Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2018 11:16 pm Post subject: Re: 50 Degree ABA Vanagon Oil Pump |
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Yes. I would totally just press my old ABA shaft into the new 50 degree vanagon diesel pump gear and be all set.
I will source all the parts and make sure it all works.
Then I will post up part numbers.
I think we have come to the conclusion that I was looking for.
Thanks for all the clarification everyone. |
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