...About the 'good ol days' - Vans in the 80s-90s

[Wildthings]

A Vanagon with 80,000 miles on the clock was pretty much a give away as the head gaskets needed replacing which cost more than most people were willing to spend. By then all the coolant had likely blown out of the system 2 or 3 times and the oil at least once on some cold day. There would have been a whole list of other failures like the headlight switch, rear heater leaks, and trying to figure out how to overcome what would become known as Vanagon syndrome. Drive until the mileage got up to around 160k and you would be rewarded with low oil pressure and a thrown rod if you didn't heed the low oil pressure, plus a bunch more engineering blunders that would leave the engine coolant strewn along the highway. Go another few thousand miles and now you were buying a new tranny to replace the one that just imploded because of a cracked 3-4 slider.

Not a lot of time between the major repairs to be thinking about personalizing the rig.

[AZ Landshaper]

I hated vanagons in the 90s. I was a bay window only driver/ camper. We bought a handful of bays and parked them in the back yard in my college crash pad. Rented them by the night to passers by while we swapped motors and trannys from one to another. You could buy a bay for 500-1500 and the splitts could be had even cheaper. No one wanted a new looking vanagon in 1993. There wasnt enough nostalgia built into them yet. And yes the p[arts were way more pricey on everything and dropped valve seats were the bane of my existence.

These things were chick magnets.
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Support Small Business.

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85 Weekender w/ EJ22
Previously
64, 71, 72, 73, 76, 81, 84, 85 & 87 Campmobiles and Westfalias
and a 67 bug.

[jlrftype7]

[shagginwagon83]

So many great responses!! I really appreciate everyone's stories/insights. I really didn't think about how technology (internet) impacted the community. I mean Howesight learned about KEP adapters through Hot VW's magazine. $3800 for a running syncro sounds like a dream. If I recall correctly, the 4wd 'upgrade' wasn't but like $2000-3000 right?

Thank you all!
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Brandon
"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
Instagram @joannthevan

[danfromsyr]

it was a few more $$ than that

from this Vanagon New Car Window Stickers thread.. which can slightly correlate with the good old days vibe;
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8690498

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[Zeitgeist 13]

Almost no depreciation in 27 years ^^^
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Casey--

'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik?

[silversync]

In 1989 we bought a new Blue Star Vanagon for the family (my wife's daily driver, I had something else). It was our family car for 10 years. We did lots of camping trips, touring the southwest, and especially memorable was school field trips because 5 little kids could sit in the back, with the table and rear facing jump seats, and they loved it.

There were 2 notable modifications:
- carry an extra water jug for the head gasket (rubber) leak
- carry a broom stick handle for the sagging rear hatch.
Ha. Ha. Meaning, we saw it as a throw away vehicle, not much point in maintaining it too much. Now I wish we still had it.
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Roland: '89 Syncro, '02 911 C4S, '10 Audi A4 Avant

[Abscate]

Those EPA ratings were fiction- everyone knows you can get 35 mpg out of a gas Vanagon if you know how to drive.

After a lot of Bays and Westies, my first T3 was a diesel NA tiptop which was a dream. It was the first VW where I could see modern manufacturing methods and QC coming into play.

Heat in Ithaca NY was greatly appreciated.

[82westyrabbit]

As we talk about these vans we have to remember the national speed limit in the US was 55mph in those days. So the power was not that big of a deal. I drove my 73 bus from Vermont to Seattle and back. I crossed the passes at 45ish in third gear, and I wasn’t the slowest vehicle on the road. We have come to expect so much from our vehicles.

As for maintenance these van were always high maintenance, and the aftermarket was slow to start making aftermarket parts.

For example when my first fuel tank went bad in the late 80s a new tank was $500 or more. I had paid $1000 for the van so that was not going to happen.

I was a VW mechanic in those days, and these vans in the Northeast would come in with leaking heads and a rotted out exsust that was going to cost more than $2000 to fix. So we wouldn’t recommend that people buy them.

I bought every diesel van I could (not that many 4) and converted them to gas in line 4 engines with Bosch CIS fuel injection. They were just less trouble to deal with.

With the availablilty of aftermarket support most of known problems are fairly easy to deal with now. Over time the WXB engine has proven its self better than any one would have expected (I am still running an inline 4)and with the cult following it is a whole new ballgame. John

[djkeev]

"Back in the day" I absolutely hated the Vanagon!

I was an aircooled guy, my first car was a 60 Beetle. Honestly I disliked the Air Cooled Vanagon too.

It was big, it was heavy, it sucked up gas and it was horribly underpowered.

I remember when VW was only producing air cooled units and new 60's era Beetles and Buses glistened on the showroom floor.

In 1987 I purchased a brand new vehicle..... a Dodge minivan. Passed right over the horrible Vanagon!

That Minivan is LONG gone to the scrapyard.

Looking back, I should have gotten that ugly VW Van! It has proven itself to far more durable and wanted than any Dodge Minivan ever was!

Dave
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Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos

Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473

Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537

Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[OrangeZA]

In 1980 my parent’s bought an 18 month old T2 Devon ‘Moonraker’ a couple of months before my fourth birthday. They paid £4000 for it then. They saw it advertised in a local newspaper and were really hoping it would be the new shape Transporter rather than the old shape (no photos with ads in those days). They loved when they went to see it and bought it anyway. I’m really glad I got to grow up with a bay window.

My brother and I standing next to our old T2 on the Isle of Skye in 1982. We were on holiday with my parents and my grandparents on my dad's side.

In the UK the new shape Transporter was just another van, day to day I probably saw more panel vans than minibuses along with the odd pick-up truck. I read somewhere that 80% of VW Transporters sold in Europe were commercial vehicles. A lot of the industry in the UK was public owned at the time and all of the commercial vehicles ran by these companies were all British built, Leylands, Commers (later Dodge), Fords and Bedfords (General Motors UK commercial devision). In the early ‘80s, the companies that ran VW Transporters in the UK tended to be sole traders or small businesses.

As I said earlier, I can’t recall seeing many T3 Buses, later renamed Caravelle, people with big families in the UK tended to buy big French estate cars such as the magnificently avant garde [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_CX#Estate/Wagon/Break]Citroen CX Safari Familiale[/url]

(My dear departed uncle Joe had one of those big Citroëns and I was fortunate enough to drive it; I don’t think I have ever driven anything that could devour the undulating and twisting back roads of South Ayrshire and Galloway quite like his hydropneumatically suspended, DIRAVI equipped CX Safari.)
Or the more conventional Peugoet 505 Familiale

and later of course the Matra designed and built Renault Espace which was launched onto the UK market in 1985. The VW didn’t really seem to compete, but I think that was mainly because Volkswagen in the UK didn’t put much effort into promoting the T3 in that sector. T3s were commercial vehicles and you had to go to a VW Commercial Vehicle Centre to buy one here (unless you bought a motor caravan). Not all VW dealers in the UK could sell the commercial vehicle range, but we had quite a big dealership where I grew up, they could deal with Caddys, Transporters, LTs and the bigger G-series trucks that were built in collaboration with MAN.

I don’t remember seeing any adverts for the T3 in the regular car press, but VW did place adverts in motorcaravan magazines in the UK. Like this one:

I remember another one which featured a T3 camper powering past a [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_Acadiane]Citroen Acadiane van[url] on a mountain pass, I thought that one was pretty cool, but unfortunately I can’t find a copy of it to show you. Obviously that ad must have featured the lusty 78PS model rather than the standard issue 60PS model, we didn’t get the exotic Digijet 1.9 here in the UK and had to wait until 1987 to get the 112PS ‘DJ’ motor. Neither of them showed a Westfalia because they were generally unavailable here (I think a handful of RHD Westfalia T3s were built). The ad above features an Autohomes ‘Kamper’, which was one of the conversions officially approved by VW.

My dad started buying motorcaravan magazines in the late ‘70s when he was thinking about buying a camper. I used to enjoy reading them as a kid, I liked seeing all the different interior layouts and learning how the different vans compared. One of the magazines called Motorcaravan Motorhome Monthly (more commonly known as MMM) often featured articles written by people who had travelled into Eastern Europe, Asia and Africa in their VWs. Eventually I started to pester my mum to buy them when I forced to traipse around the shops with her after school. The above advert was featured in this magazine dated June 1986 so I must have got this one around my 10th birthday!

The vehicle featured in the main cover photo is Elddis Autocirrus, a first generation FIAT Ducato, one of the SEVEL vans built in Italy. SEVEL stands for "Società Europea Veicoli Leggeri" or “Société Européenne de Véhicules Légers” if you are French, it was a joint venture between FIAT, PSA and I think originally the then independent Alfa Romeo. Most of these early SEVEL vans sold in the UK were badged as the Talbot Express and sold through Peugeot dealers, the Talbot mark was only used in the UK as PSA badged their versions as the Peugeot J5 and Citroën C25 elsewhere. The SEVEL vans proved to be very popular and no doubt had a big influence on VW deciding to make the T4 Transporter front engined, front wheel drive and semi-forward control. The modern incarnation of these SEVEL vans is sold in North America as the Ram Promaster.

Starting from the left, the little black and white photos feature a Pilot R700, (French conversion based on the Talbot Express, 1971cc petrol, 78bhp); a Romahome based on a [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citroën_C15]Citroën C15 van[/url] (itself derived from the Citroën Visa, 1769cc, 60bhp); next is a Holdsworth Romance based on Renault Trafic (the one featured in the magazine has the more powerful 1647cc engine developing 64bhp, the standard engine was a 1397cc engine developing 47 and a half bhp. A “CT” engined T3 would eat it for breakfast!); then we have a Devon “Moonraker” based on the new shape VW Transporter (more on this later); lastly we have an Auto-Sleeper Clubman, with a coachbuilt body designed by William Towns, it’s based on a Bedford CF fitted with a 2.3 litre, slant-4 petrol motor developing around 80 bhp

The day my mum bought this magazine was the day that I saw my very first T3 Syncro and I can remember the very moment. My brother and I were sitting the back of our T2 camper, traveling back from Stirling to Falkirk and I was reading this article:

My younger brother, who was 8 at the time (and now owns a T3 California), says to me that “There is one of those behind us”, so I turn around and sure enough there is a T3 directly behind us and it has “Syncro 4x4” emblazoned on it just below the windscreen and I say to him “Wow, it’s one of those new Syncro Transporters!”. Then I notice that the registration plate reads “C787RGM”, it’s the very same Syncro that is featured in the magazine!! My brother and I are amazed at this coincidence and excitedly shout to our mum, “Mum! Mum! The VW in the magazine is behind us!”, “Sure boys, whatever”, by this time my brother and I have clambered over the backrest of the rear seat and have the magazine pressed hard up against the back window, waving to the driver of the Syncro and pointing to the photos in the magazine! The driver is laughing at us and waves back, while our mum is shouting to us to get back into our seats! Eventually we parted ways at a roundabout but we got a cheery wave goodbye.

I just checked on the DVLA’s Vehicle Lookup Service, but C787RGM hasn’t been taxed since 2005,

Here’s some more photos from this same magazine:

Mmmm, Tischer XN

You can see just how popular the Transporter was as a base in this photo:

I’ll try to name them from the left front:
The solid sided elevating roof looks like a Holdsworth Villa, the red one is probably an Autohomes “Karisma”, then an air-cooled Autohomes (probably CI rather than Autohomes when it was made) “Kamper’ (same interior as the “Karisma”), in blue we have an “Xplorer” converted by Motorhomes International with it’s distinctive “Spacemaker” elevating roof (it could sleep 6), next looks like a brown Devon “Moonraker”, after that I’m struggling a bit. On the right we start off with a couple of Renault Traffics, a Freight-Rover Sherpa, behind it an earlier Leyland Sherpa, then a couple of Bedford CFs (Incidentally, the former GM factory that built these Bedford CFs in the town of Luton and now builds the Renault Trafic and its clones, the Vauxhall/Opel Vivaro, FIAT Talento and Nissan Primastar, who knows what it will build in the future following Brexit and the takeover of GM Europe by Groupe PSA, maybe Bedford CFs?)

The campers in the above photo are generally what we would meet on the roads or camping in our T2 Devon “Moonraker”, we wouldn’t wave to any of them! Not because we were rude, but because they would never wave back! T2 drivers always waved, right from day we came home with our 18 month old T2. T3 camper drivers tended to be owned by older, retired couples. ’86 was also the first year that I saw a T1 Transporter, we were camped near the beach at Dornoch on the north east coast of Scotland, my brother and I were walking across the Machair to the beach when we came across a family with this weird looking dark blue VW with a divided windscreen, a V-shaped front and a huge VW badge on the front, the mother in the family looked as though she was preparing something to eat at the camp table while dad was chasing two little blonde haired girls who were running around squealing with delight across the sand. We were too shy to go and say hello. I was 10 and had never seen a VW Transporter like it before, I remember it having an E-suffix on the registration plate with would have made it a ’67, so I guessed that they made those before the old Transporters with the low mounted indicators. I think this highlights how rare old cars were on the roads of Scotland, the climate is really punishing on metal here, so salty and damp. I only see T3s during the summer now when they come to stay on the local campsite.

Oh yeah, remember the 6 berth “Xplorer” conversion above with the “Spacemaker” roof? Well Motorhomes International fitted that roof to another van that was a very common sight on European campsites in the ‘80s, the diminutive, rear engined FIAT 900.

It could sleep 5. My uncle Joe had one, he was 6’4” tall, he took my auntie Elaine, my Papa and Elaine’s dad all the way from Scotland to the Munich Oktoberfest in it. It was awesome.

Ok, back to the magazine from June 1986 and a road test of a second hand 1981 Devon “Moonraker”, the new version of our own T2 camper, it has the same Fellows made cooker hob with grill that seems to have been fitted to almost every British built camper until relatively recently. This new shape Transporter is fitted with the 50bhp air-cooled 1584cc ‘CT’ engine, it’s “a willing horse”.

I’m fairly hopeful UWD301X is still around, it’s MOT only ran out 3 years ago. I notice that “willing horse” has been replaced by a virile stallion! Why did someone change the colour to green? What exactly is wrong with orange!?

Above is an advert for Motorhomes International, see that in addition to their Spacemaker roof, they also offered a solid-sided elevating roof. The solid-sided roofs were very popular with UK converters in the ‘80s, later Devon “Moonrakers” were also offered with them, they were promoted as being warmer and less noisy than the roofs with fabric sides. I don’t think I have ever seen a T5 or T6 Transporter conversion with a solid sided elevating roof. Notice the unusual slide out cooker unit on this “Galaxy” model.

Here’s an advert by one of our more local Motor Caravan Dealers, see they are listing that many of the new VWs are fitted with the optional, higher output 78bhp motor, I guess that white manual Hi-Top is fitted with the standard fit 60bhp 1.9. Notice the advert says that they are an Official VW Motorcaravan Dealer, you had to visit one of these if you wanted to buy a brand new Transporter based VW approved motorcaravan, I never saw a brand new motorcaravan for sale at my local dealership though the '80s and '90s.

Later on in the ‘80s I realised there were some magazines that concentrated solely on VW group vehicles, so occasionally I spent my money on these instead. The first one I came across was “Volkswagen/Audi Car”, they generally concentrated on the new models, but occasionally had articles on the history of the company and older models. It survives today as two separate titles “Volkswagen Driver” and “Audi Driver”.

I discovered “VW Motoring” in an aftermarket VW parts place my dad visited one time, it was a while before it started to turn up in the local newsagents. Here’s the March 1989 issue, I would have been 12 when I bought this.

Oh, facelift for the factory approved UK conversions, fancy square headlamps and bumpers! You can tell from the rear side windows that this Auto-Sleeper conversion originally left the factory as a panel van, must have been cheaper than converting a seatless Kombi. Most of the UK conversions started off as panel vans, the Devon “Moonraker” was a Kombi based exception (the original Devon company went bust in the late ’80s, but the trade name survives to this day).

Hey wait a minute, what do they call the VW Transporter in the US? A Vanawhat?? That’s crazy! All Type 2s, T1s, 2s and 3s were “vans” in the UK, probably because when someone mentions VW Transporter you immediately think of a commercial vehicle. “VW Motoring” was quite a serious publication that featured an interesting mix of features on new and old VW/Audi models. Here’s an article on how VW commercial vehicles were used by municipal authorities in Germany and Austria Proper hardworking vehicles.

Not so keen on vehicles with beam axles and cart springs, but I can't help admiring that VW LT 4x4.

Our high school Minibus was a maroon Type 28 VW LT, the colour matched the school uniform.

Remember how I told you earlier that in the early ‘80s Transporters were usually bought by small companies or sold traders? Well by the late ‘80s things had changed somewhat, my municipal authority for example had a fleet of Syncro Transporters! In bright yellow! Panel vans and pick-up trucks! Water authorities liked them too. Our local electrician, in his early ‘70s now (drives a T5 4motion panel van) was wiring up my workshop where my South African Syncro lives and commented “Ah we used to run these when I worked for the council years ago, amazing vehicles, we used to use them to rescue the Land Rovers when they got stuck!”

In 1990 it was pretty obvious that the new shape Transporter was about to be replaced by a newer shaped Transporter, my dad told me it was going to have its engine at the front “where it belongs” he said (my dad has always been misguided, mum actually bought the T2). I told him he was wrong because I’d had a dream about the new Transporter and it was rear engined and why on earth would VW change such a great formula, man was I disappointed!

Slowly through the ’90s the hard working commercial Transporters disappeared from our streets, but they still tended to outlive their competitors. The T3 campers began to be owned by younger families (T3 drivers started waving back!), especially as T2s suddenly went up in value.

I visited South Africa in 1997, that was amazing, not just because it is stunningly beautiful country full of interesting and friendly people, but because T3s were everywhere and most of them were emitting a 5 cylinder rumble! I went to watch the British and Irish Lions play the Springboks in Durban, on leaving the match I walked through a grassy field that acted as a makeshift car park, it was filled with T3 Microbuses and Caravelles, full of friends and families, many of them already sat around braais cooking and drinking beer. At one point during my trip I drove an Isuzu KB from Durban to Cape Town, I was cruising flat out at 140kph (2.5 litre normally aspirated diesel), when I could see this T3 Microbus approaching fast from behind me, it passed the Isuzu like it was standing still. I could see the “2.3” badge as it passed so it wasn’t even the full fat 2.6 litre version, oh and it was hauling a twin axle box trailer! I picked up a T3 brochure from a VW Dealer, but I was too shy to ask for a test drive, I was only 20.

Currently I live over looking a campsite on a remote Scottish Highland peninsula. I’d say about 95% of the campers that visit the site that are over 25 years old are Volkswagens and a good third of them have travelled from outwith the UK. Easily the most common modern medium sized panel van conversion I see on the campsite is the T5 and T6 Transporter.

[mikemtnbike]

Wow- thank you so for much for the effort of making your post, OrangeZA.

As the caretaker of a collection of Mother Earth News from issue 1 in 1970 through it's first sale in 1986, I really appreciate the information contained in older periodicals.
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1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
2020 GTI SE manual

[Buggeee]

I drove my rusty Bay Bus to the VW dealer looking for parts, and spent some time wandering around the showroom. Brand new Westy Vanagon on the showroom floor, top up, doors open. It was so... Square! At that time the angular lines seemed "modern." Must be a VW for rich people is what I thought. They can have their sanitized angular world. I didn't like the look or the message it carried - Seriousness. What about the happy go lucky curves of the people's car?

Now, however, all the cars are curvy! Its the angular crisp science-conquers-all "modern" look that makes a Vanagon what it is - a time capsule. I think it belongs roving across the moon. And... I finally have one. Now to scrounge up some parachute pants at the Goodwill. Lol.
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1966 Sportsmobile Camper https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
72 Super Duper http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=672387
(adopted out) 61 Turkis Pile https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=728764

[outcaststudios]

[nemobuscaptain]

[Love My Westy]

I had always wanted a VW bus since I fell in love with a red and white splitty that was brand new in the showroom of Strong VW in Salt Lake City in 1968. Before I could get one though, I owned a variety of cars including a 1966 1300 Beetle, a 1965 Austin Healey 3000, a 1960 Bugeye Sprite, a 1964 Beetle, a 1976 VW Dasher, a 1980 Subaru, and a 1984 Subaru.

In 1986, after having a bad experience camping on the ground, I decided I wanted to finally get a VW van so we didn't have to sleep on the ground anymore (I was doing a lot of river running and ended up at river put-ins usually around midnight) A VW Van would be perfect.

I looked at and drove an '84 diesel, but I didn't like it because the PO had let his kids remove the outer layer of surface from the back cabinets, plus it was noisey and slow.

I was looking at new ones at the dealer but they were too expensive. I wanted a GL Westfalia. Then one day the the dealer had a "Basic Camper" without the kitchen and only a small electric fridge, and was trying to get it off the floor (it was the end of November and it was his last '86 model) It had a $2000 Rebate which I could use as a down payment. I drove home and got my wife to look at it to see if she could live without the kitchen. The rest is history, I put $500 down and asked if I could pick it up on Monday, but the dealer said no, it had to be off his floor that day, so we drove it home. I refinanced it through my Credit Union and to get the payment down to where I could afford it I had a balloon payment at the end (which I paid off early).

I told my wife it was only going to be used for camping trips and that it was going to live in the garage, and I would not drive it in the winters because they salt the roads in Salt Lake City, To this day, I still park it in the garage in November and take it out to use in May. I save money by only carrying comprehensive insurance on it in the winter and suspending all the other coverage.

As far as mods, the first major mod I did was after almost getting blown off the road by a sudden gust of wind on a trip to the San Juan Islands (i had a canoe strapped on top). I read an article in Hot VW magazine about how to make a van handle better in the wind. It recommended three things; 1. KYB Shocks, 2. General Grabber Tires 27 x 850 x 14, and 3) heavy duty sway bars. I ended up with the shocks, Bridgestone Desert Dueler Tires, and front and rear sway bars I found in a JC Whitney catalog. What a difference it made. It turns out the sway bars were none other than Addco's which are a mod a lot of people have done.

I can't believe how many people are still runnin that skinny front sway bar on their vans.

I have to cut this off and contine later...Sorry!

[Steve M.]

Dam...I'm going to have to open the computer...too much to read on the cell phone!
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[Abscate]

[Ahwahnee]

[jimf909]

Great thread.

After discovering the benefits of a van with a GMC one-ton van (moved to Seattle in it with two motorcycles, two cats, one girlfriend and everything else needed in live packed inside) and then a '69 Bay I bought my first Vanagon in 1997.

My primary sources of information were http://foreignaideabq.com/about/ in Albuquerque, NM and http://Westfalia.org. Westfalia.org was full of helpful information and I diagnosed a number of problems with assistance from the folks there.

As for mods, Captain Mike (RIP) ran the website and he made it clear that he was not in favor of bigger wheels and tires. In other words, some of the sentiment was that mods like that were for fools. Capt. Mike was also a tremendous resource for the community and helped hundreds if not thousands of folks keep their Vanagons running.

I bought the '85 with 135K on the odometer and the motor had been replaced. I then put over 100,000 miles on it (before I overheated it and killed the motor) with surprisingly few problems . It was only towed once.

And yes, I have no idea how people can arrive at a camping destination by car and sleep on the ground. That's downright uncivilized.
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- Jim