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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:56 am Post subject: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Im having a Great Experience with my First Automatic 1968 type 34
they are so many unique parts and found out theres 3 different design and sizes of AUTOMATIC emblems and Extra wires more than what I ever seen comparing
with the rest Early type 3s and type 34s stick shift
I had Notice there's NO wiring diagram for specific 1968 Models ONLY
In 1968 MANY changes and Options with Warning Lights and Dummy lights
NOT found in one Diagram,
so I had to used 3 different diagrams and Separate by sections and focus on specific item
Most diagrams are title 68 - and Later
every YEAR change by adding Options or Deleted
ALL Automatic Owners are Welcome to Ask or Post and
learn MORE about it , I realize will be a small group since NOT to many Owners but we can solving Problems and keep going forward on our restorations
I wont have ALL your Answers but we can help each other HERE
Thanks for your support _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22356 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Just be glad you don't have FI to go with that AT Pedro.
I would have thought Jack might have been some help with it, or am I thinking of Bob, as I thought 1 of them had a 68 with AT.
There's not much that the AT adds as far as wiring goes. There's the kick down wiring with the throttle switch and fuse holder in the engine compartment, but the rest of the wiring is inside the car.
The reverse light switch and the neutral safety switch are built into the shifter, and those wires run along the floor/tunnel thru a grommet in the battery tray and out to the starter and reverse light "T". If I remember right, the 2 front contacts (up and down) on the shifter are for the reverse lights, while the rear set (up and down) are the neutral safety switch contacts. I've slept since then, so I might have them backwards. But, those are the only wires that I know of for the AT.
I hope this helps.
P.S. Doesn't the T-34 Meister Lee have a 68 or 69 AT T-34? _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Slow 1200 Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2004 Posts: 2103
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:34 am Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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71 auto euro-fastback here,
I'm pretty sure I have a (photocopy of a) factory auto trans manual that if I recall correctly is from '68, so it has all the 68-only oddities, now, where did I put it? |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 7:44 am Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Typically.....injection differences wise with the AT....just off the top of my head....of course the AAR is the electric one....but thats not just Auto after a certain point in time right?
And....on cars with decel valves was there a change to the electric decel valve versus vacuum?
Also trans kick down switch on type 3.....cant remember how D-jet on type 3 did it....whether it had a throttle switch in the back or one under the accel pedal like type 4.
There were.....I think....two differences in wiring to the shifter mounted ignition start lockout/neutral safety switch as well. Ray |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:00 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Bobnotch wrote: |
Just be glad you don't have FI to go with that AT Pedro.
I would have thought Jack might have been some help with it, or am I thinking of Bob, as I thought 1 of them had a 68 with AT.
There's not much that the AT adds as far as wiring goes. There's the kick down wiring with the throttle switch and fuse holder in the engine compartment, but the rest of the wiring is inside the car.
The reverse light switch and the neutral safety switch are built into the shifter, and those wires run along the floor/tunnel thru a grommet in the battery tray and out to the starter and reverse light "T". If I remember right, the 2 front contacts (up and down) on the shifter are for the reverse lights, while the rear set (up and down) are the neutral safety switch contacts. I've slept since then, so I might have them backwards. But, those are the only wires that I know of for the AT.
I hope this helps.
P.S. Doesn't the T-34 Meister Lee have a 68 or 69 AT T-34? |
Hello Bob
Yes I always have Jack and Lee in my mind all the time
NOT everyone have these Great Amigos near as I do just miles away
you know I always like to announce or post improvements or upgrades
and Not keep them to my self
what you just posted Bob just made my point
not everyone knows
im Happy is stated Here thanks _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:02 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
Typically.....injection differences wise with the AT....just off the top of my head....of course the AAR is the electric one....but thats not just Auto after a certain point in time right?
And....on cars with decel valves was there a change to the electric decel valve versus vacuum?
Also trans kick down switch on type 3.....cant remember how D-jet on type 3 did it....whether it had a throttle switch in the back or one under the accel pedal like type 4.
There were.....I think....two differences in wiring to the shifter mounted ignition start lockout/neutral safety switch as well. Ray |
Hello Ray
thanks for your time
any of your experience is so Value in this Thread
thanks _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
The Truth is Out There |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:04 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Slow 1200 wrote: |
71 auto euro-fastback here,
I'm pretty sure I have a (photocopy of a) factory auto trans manual that if I recall correctly is from '68, so it has all the 68-only oddities, now, where did I put it? |
hello Slow
that would be Nice to posted here
if you find it
thanks _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
The Truth is Out There |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22356 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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I think the AT wiring is also in the Brown Bentley. My copy of it is out in the garage, since I've got a 69 Square out there getting some work done on it. But then I'd still need to scan it. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:55 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Bobnotch wrote: |
I think the AT wiring is also in the Brown Bentley. My copy of it is out in the garage, since I've got a 69 Square out there getting some work done on it. But then I'd still need to scan it. |
Awesome
can't wait to see it
thanks for your support _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22697 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Here's the supplement you're looking for, Pedro.
This is from 1970 model year but the only difference between this and 1968 is the placement of the reverse lamps.
The other differences for the entire production run are that the first true 1968 automatics had the legend "PR0321" on the shifter and 1969 on had "PRND21". The other difference was that in 1973 the shifters were (finally!) wired with a safety switch that would allow the cars to be started in "P" as well as "N".
That's it. All wiring for the Automatic electronics was black.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/type3_8_69_additional_usa.jpg
The electric AAR that appeared on Type 3 automatics only started in model year 1970 second design cars, and was considered as part of the chassis wiring (it's that "red wire to nowhere" a lot of posters ask about in the forum here that's in the wrap with the coil and oil sender wires) and that's why they don't show it in the supplement.
Hope this helps.
And Ray, Type 3 never had a floor mounted kickdown. They're all at the engine throttle end of the cable. I've often wondered if a retrofit of the floor switch is workable. _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 7:30 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Tram wrote: |
Here's the supplement you're looking for, Pedro.
This is from 1970 model year but the only difference between this and 1968 is the placement of the reverse lamps.
The other differences for the entire production run are that the first true 1968 automatics had the legend "PR0321" on the shifter and 1969 on had "PRND21". The other difference was that in 1973 the shifters were (finally!) wired with a safety switch that would allow the cars to be started in "P" as well as "N".
That's it. All wiring for the Automatic electronics was black.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/type3_8_69_additional_usa.jpg
The electric AAR that appeared on Type 3 automatics only started in model year 1970 second design cars, and was considered as part of the chassis wiring (it's that "red wire to nowhere" a lot of posters ask about in the forum here that's in the wrap with the coil and oil sender wires) and that's why they don't show it in the supplement.
Hope this helps.
And Ray, Type 3 never had a floor mounted kickdown. They're all at the engine throttle end of the cable. I've often wondered if a retrofit of the floor switch is workable. |
Great Info Compadre
thanks for your time
im gathering anything related on Automatic in this thread
I learn and know information on paper get LOST
and Great VW people leave this World
thanks again Tram _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:01 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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here's a picture for those don't know what are you missing
with out the spring won't work properly _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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here's another interesting feature
you might have a PLUG or NOT
if NOT
these Altitude Balancers screws IN
there's a left and a Right for a Reason
so when you rebuilt them look for the stamp _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22697 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 9:08 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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pedro sainz wrote: |
here's a picture for those don't know what are you missing
with out the spring won't work properly |
So where's your switch? _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 10:55 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Tram wrote: |
Here's the supplement you're looking for, Pedro.
This is from 1970 model year but the only difference between this and 1968 is the placement of the reverse lamps.
The other differences for the entire production run are that the first true 1968 automatics had the legend "PR0321" on the shifter and 1969 on had "PRND21". The other difference was that in 1973 the shifters were (finally!) wired with a safety switch that would allow the cars to be started in "P" as well as "N".
That's it. All wiring for the Automatic electronics was black.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/type3_8_69_additional_usa.jpg
The electric AAR that appeared on Type 3 automatics only started in model year 1970 second design cars, and was considered as part of the chassis wiring (it's that "red wire to nowhere" a lot of posters ask about in the forum here that's in the wrap with the coil and oil sender wires) and that's why they don't show it in the supplement.
Hope this helps.
And Ray, Type 3 never had a floor mounted kickdown. They're all at the engine throttle end of the cable. I've often wondered if a retrofit of the floor switch is workable. |
Yep....thanks for verification on the floor/pedal mounted kickdown. Though....in reality if type 3 did have one.....I would probably have a pile of them because I would have robbed them from every type 3 I found one in....so I should have known better!
Not sure if the pedal kick down would fit a type 3. The type 4 (411/412) gas pedal is very similar. Let me look in the book. It may very well be a type 3 part.
The shifter switch that allowed starting in park. I "think" that is the same one that the type 4 cars used as well...71 and on 411 through 412....all started in park or neutral. One more ource you guys might steal from if you find a 412. Pretty sure it was all type 3 part #s. Ray |
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22697 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:41 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
Tram wrote: |
Here's the supplement you're looking for, Pedro.
This is from 1970 model year but the only difference between this and 1968 is the placement of the reverse lamps.
The other differences for the entire production run are that the first true 1968 automatics had the legend "PR0321" on the shifter and 1969 on had "PRND21". The other difference was that in 1973 the shifters were (finally!) wired with a safety switch that would allow the cars to be started in "P" as well as "N".
That's it. All wiring for the Automatic electronics was black.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/type3_8_69_additional_usa.jpg
The electric AAR that appeared on Type 3 automatics only started in model year 1970 second design cars, and was considered as part of the chassis wiring (it's that "red wire to nowhere" a lot of posters ask about in the forum here that's in the wrap with the coil and oil sender wires) and that's why they don't show it in the supplement.
Hope this helps.
And Ray, Type 3 never had a floor mounted kickdown. They're all at the engine throttle end of the cable. I've often wondered if a retrofit of the floor switch is workable. |
Yep....thanks for verification on the floor/pedal mounted kickdown. Though....in reality if type 3 did have one.....I would probably have a pile of them because I would have robbed them from every type 3 I found one in....so I should have known better!
Not sure if the pedal kick down would fit a type 3. The type 4 (411/412) gas pedal is very similar. Let me look in the book. It may very well be a type 3 part.
The shifter switch that allowed starting in park. I "think" that is the same one that the type 4 cars used as well...71 and on 411 through 412....all started in park or neutral. One more ource you guys might steal from if you find a 412. Pretty sure it was all type 3 part #s. Ray |
The floor mounted switch would likely be mounted under the pedal panel somehow. You'd still need the spring loaded throttle linkage back on the engine. Not sure how the "push through" to engage the kickdown on a Type 4 worked. _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2018 12:03 am Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Here's the Kick down switch
hard to see from TOP view picture
is located under the spring and is attach by 2 screws
this Kick Down switch is Unique
they are TWO styles similar shape but just a little different
_________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
The Truth is Out There
Last edited by pedro sainz on Sat Nov 24, 2018 12:40 am; edited 2 times in total |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2018 12:11 am Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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this Picture shows you how the fuel line is HOLD by the bracket _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
N.O.N.A member #3
The Truth is Out There |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2018 11:48 am Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Tram wrote: |
raygreenwood wrote: |
Tram wrote: |
Here's the supplement you're looking for, Pedro.
This is from 1970 model year but the only difference between this and 1968 is the placement of the reverse lamps.
The other differences for the entire production run are that the first true 1968 automatics had the legend "PR0321" on the shifter and 1969 on had "PRND21". The other difference was that in 1973 the shifters were (finally!) wired with a safety switch that would allow the cars to be started in "P" as well as "N".
That's it. All wiring for the Automatic electronics was black.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/type3_8_69_additional_usa.jpg
The electric AAR that appeared on Type 3 automatics only started in model year 1970 second design cars, and was considered as part of the chassis wiring (it's that "red wire to nowhere" a lot of posters ask about in the forum here that's in the wrap with the coil and oil sender wires) and that's why they don't show it in the supplement.
Hope this helps.
And Ray, Type 3 never had a floor mounted kickdown. They're all at the engine throttle end of the cable. I've often wondered if a retrofit of the floor switch is workable. |
Yep....thanks for verification on the floor/pedal mounted kickdown. Though....in reality if type 3 did have one.....I would probably have a pile of them because I would have robbed them from every type 3 I found one in....so I should have known better!
Not sure if the pedal kick down would fit a type 3. The type 4 (411/412) gas pedal is very similar. Let me look in the book. It may very well be a type 3 part.
The shifter switch that allowed starting in park. I "think" that is the same one that the type 4 cars used as well...71 and on 411 through 412....all started in park or neutral. One more ource you guys might steal from if you find a 412. Pretty sure it was all type 3 part #s. Ray |
The floor mounted switch would likely be mounted under the pedal panel somehow. You'd still need the spring loaded throttle linkage back on the engine. Not sure how the "push through" to engage the kickdown on a Type 4 worked. |
Yes....and checking the books...I am stunned...not a type 3 part in it..even though I could swear that the pedal itself is virtually identical to type 3.
Its a little pedestal/steel box under the pedal. If memory serves its held to the floor with two 6mm phillips head screws ...that as you can imagine almost always are rusted to the deck.
There are two parts. One for the 004 manual trans....with no switch inside the housing...and one for the 003 trans automatic that has a plastic cover on the top end that hides a fairly common single pole lever type micro switch.
The manual trans model with no kick down switch is part # 17 un the diagram and the auto model with kick down switch is part # 26. Outside of the little metal pedestal/box...its a pretty similar little lever that operates a throttle cable that is pretty damn similar to a type 3.
For those of you "parts hags"...who feel the need to steal parts from an even rarer car than yours ...dont feel bad really...I dont!...I steal parts from from type 3 wrecks whenever I can....parts is parts!....here is the type 4 automatic shifter unit and its parts number list. Note the huge number of type 3 part numbers. Happy picking!
Ray |
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pedro sainz Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2005 Posts: 1429
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Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2018 3:24 pm Post subject: Re: Official Thread for Automatics Models ONLY |
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Here’s 3 designs of Emblems
Smaller emblem 8.25 inches is for Type 34s _________________ 68 T34 1600 Automatic
62 T34 Cabriolet Prototype
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