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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:10 pm Post subject: VW rally cars |
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I have been entering my Karmann Ghia in several rallycrosses & came in third in class in our first time out.
This has however, piqued my interest in longer distance rallies & the VWs that have competed in them. Tonight, when I went to get parts at a local air cooled specialist, I was thrilled to get to see in person, Ed & Janet Howle’s 1967 Beetle that has competed in many long distance (Around the world) rallies.
Here’s an article on some of their exploits.
http://1967beetle.com/ed-janet-howle/
And then there is Patrick & Christine Sommers’ sweet 1966 Karmann Ghia that sort of became an inspiration for my Ghia build when I first started looking for examples of lifted Ghias.
http://rallykarmann.blogspot.com/?m=1
If anyone else has any examples, please post them here with links to any articles, videos, or history. _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Mos6502 Samba Member
Joined: December 30, 2015 Posts: 725
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:25 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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For a variety of reasons, Beetles were not good choices for rallies. Volkswagen, so far as I know, didn't provide official support for rally drivers, so the Beetles that did enter were private entries that never really had much chance against cars on teams, or with factory backing.
The other issue was the VW's relatively large engine, but low power meant it was often classed with cars much larger, more powerful, and far faster than it was. The famous Mini Cooper for example, which won the Monte Carlo rally several times, had a smaller engine and nearly twice as much power as the Beetle (and also was more maneuverable, lighter, and had much, much, much better handling). The SAAB 96, also driven to multiple Monte Carlo victories with is 850cc engine wasn't much more powerful than the VW, but its tiny displacement put it in a lower class, which with the handicapping system of the time gave it a great advantage over cars with larger engines, and so on.
That doesn't mean people didn't enter VWs, just that they were relatively rare, and usually didn't place very high in the rankings. One notable exception would be the Beetle entered in the 1956 Monte Carlo which earned 5th place overall, or when a Volkswagen won the Mobilgas Round Australia rally in 1957. A VW also won the production two wheel drive class in the Mexican 1000 in 1967.
Some pics:
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:17 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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Yes, both of these examples are more current rally participants, I would like to see how many other vintage VWs are being campaigned in rally/historic events. _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Mos6502 Samba Member
Joined: December 30, 2015 Posts: 725
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owdlvr Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2008 Posts: 684 Location: Squampton BC
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Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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Full build thread for my Rally Bug:
https://www.germanlook.net/forums/showthread.php?t=11341
_________________ ---
Instagram: @DaveHord
1971 1302s - Salzburg Tribute the #RallyBug
1958 Beetle
1975 Beetle
1973 Super Beetle
1993 C3500 with Cummins swap
1967 MGB
1963 MG Midget |
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Flush_Gordon337 Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2012 Posts: 86 Location: Cincinnati Ohio
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:26 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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From the late 80s early 90s. Chillicothe Ohio. Sun Riser rally I think. _________________ I like to sit in my barn and play with my Thing!!!
1974 Type 181
Berrien 902 |
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Chad1376 Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2005 Posts: 1435 Location: Henderson, Nevada
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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Oooh - SCCA Rallycross in a Ghia? Please post more.
We're trying to get that program going out here in Las Vegas. If we find a location, it'll likely just be sliding around on a dirt lot, rather than that nice turf that it appears you have.
If..if.. I ever finish my AX Superbeetle, and we get Rallycross up and running, I think it would make a great rallycrosser, with the right tires and suspension adjustments.
I'm sure you've seen Doug Leibman's Rallycross Super. If not, look it up.
https://www.scca.com/articles/2008402-winners-crow...ampionship _________________ My never ending 1302 Autocross Project:
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&a...02b8f83f22 |
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:24 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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I was originally building a Baja bug but the Ghiapet found me. After looking at what I wanted to do with the car, the lower center of gravity of a Ghia was really appealing. I raised it 5” & I have 12” of clearance & it still has a lower roof line than a beetle that had been lowered.
In fact, here it is between an Aston Martin & a Corvette.
_________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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CPDoug Samba Member
Joined: September 22, 2012 Posts: 4 Location: Nebraska
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Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 7:52 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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We do a little RallyCross with the SCCA in our 72 Super
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:10 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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Nice! We have someone campaigning a yellow Super Beetle in the local SCCA rallycrosses also.
Link
_________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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ImAddicted Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2012 Posts: 1195 Location: Unorganized Territory, Maine
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Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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There's this one from the Beetle forum:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=353217
_________________ 1979 Transporter (sold)
KC1MUR
strfish7 wrote: |
Original condition, which means something different on this forum than anywhere else! |
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APPLEGREENVW Samba Member
Joined: November 30, 2003 Posts: 2387 Location: Seekonk,Massachusetts USA
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maclaren65 Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2011 Posts: 58 Location: Mountain View, CA
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Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:04 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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What size wheels and tires (brand) are people running on their VW rally car? |
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:24 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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I’m running 205/75/15 General Grabber on VW Marathon wheels:
Link
Link
_________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it.
Last edited by TDCTDI on Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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EasternNotch Samba Member
Joined: January 19, 2006 Posts: 633 Location: Boston Metro West
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maclaren65 Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2011 Posts: 58 Location: Mountain View, CA
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Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:52 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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CPDoug wrote: |
We do a little RallyCross with the SCCA in our 72 Super
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@CPDoug
What tires (brand, model, and size) tires are you running for RallyCross? Is your SB at the factory ride height or adjusted? Thanks. |
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maclaren65 Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2011 Posts: 58 Location: Mountain View, CA
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Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:58 pm Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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TDCTDI wrote: |
I’m running 205/75/15 General Grabber on VW Marathon wheels:
Link
Link
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@TDCTDI
Did you need to modify your suspension to accommodate the 205/75/15 tires? The General Grabbers must be good on the dirt. How do they perform on the pavement? |
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12846 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:36 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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maclaren65 wrote: |
@TDCTDI
Did you need to modify your suspension to accommodate the 205/75/15 tires? The General Grabbers must be good on the dirt. How do they perform on the pavement? |
I raised the car a total of six inches. I re-indexed & notched the rear spring plates on the rear & installed a Thing beam & spindles (which added roughly 3.5”) and then added adjusters to the beam so I could raise it another inch. The tires added roughly 1.5”.
The tires are great on the asphalt but they aren’t as sticky as most car tires. They do start talking back & warning you before they let go though, unless you’re on wet roads. I eliminated the front sway bar for articulation reasons when off-road, this got rid of the car’s tendency to push in a corner, it does however, make the rear tend to rotate easier, especially if you come off throttle. All you have to do is counter steer a bit & give it a bit of gas & she straightens back up. _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Frederik Samba Member
Joined: August 18, 2007 Posts: 578 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:45 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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Just thought this video was nice
Link
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johnnyvw164 Samba Member
Joined: July 27, 2020 Posts: 572 Location: South of Raleigh
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:31 am Post subject: Re: VW rally cars |
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I think that's from a Finnish air cooled rally series? |
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