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90weekender Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2015 Posts: 183
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 4:31 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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That i8 motor above is for the front axle only. |
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markswagen Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018 Posts: 1038 Location: san diego
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:01 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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i believe EV west in vista california are working on a vanagon kit, i know they bought a vanagon so they could build a kit for them, there's nothing on their site about it yet, so they've not finished it yet.
https://evwest.com/catalog/ _________________ markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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pinetreeporsche Samba Member
Joined: June 11, 2009 Posts: 752 Location: Falls Church, VA
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:12 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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markswagen wrote: |
i believe EV west in vista california are working on a vanagon kit, i know they bought a vanagon so they could build a kit for them, there's nothing on their site about it yet, so they've not finished it yet.
https://evwest.com/catalog/ |
One of their pages lists 4 or 5 VW models they already make kits for- incl. vans from the 50s to '79. So- anyone who lives near them: stop in on them and give them a bit of encouragmnt. We're ready! |
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90weekender Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2015 Posts: 183
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:19 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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I drive an i3 with the range extender and feel the best retrofitted drive train for an adventure van that travels long ranges will ultimately be more like the i8. Under 45mph its all electric but when you get on the highway above 45mph the high efficiency combustion engine kicks in to carry you at high speeds. This allows us to have a relatively smaller (light weight and inexpensive) battery than a fully electric vehicle, which is cost prohibitive for most retrofitters. |
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90weekender Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2015 Posts: 183
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:36 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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I personally would like to see a bolt-on electrification of the font axel in an after market kit that leaves the original engine and transmission in place. With the vast array of pick up truck lift kits that employ simple welded steel tubes and brackets, I would gues a bolt on kit is achievable with flipped audio rear diffs. Batteries and electronics would be easily handled by the like of EV West. |
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markswagen Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018 Posts: 1038 Location: san diego
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Posted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:44 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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i have two customers in the same street, as one of the guys who works there, maybe even he's the owner, i've not talked to him, i tagged his split bus crewcab, several times with my business card, until i realized that he worked there.
i have a few vans in vista also, but by the time i'm usually done working, i need to head home, so i don't have time to go have a look see.
pinetreeporsche wrote: |
One of their pages lists 4 or 5 VW models they already make kits for- incl. vans from the 50s to '79. So- anyone who lives near them: stop in on them and give them a bit of encouragmnt. We're ready! |
_________________ markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22668 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 1:11 am Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Abscate wrote: |
The holy grail is a high energy density battery, but that’s been chased for a long time, and abandoned by GM , Tesla, and the rest for currents technology.
That’s why ten years from now, mass EV will be “only 5 years away” |
Another 2 years, and mass EV is 5 years away. Maybe more now with Covid stopping is for two years _________________ .ssS! |
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wesitarz Samba Member
Joined: August 20, 2012 Posts: 1491 Location: Victoria,B.C.Canada
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MuzzcoVW Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2018 Posts: 1474 Location: Westfield, MA.
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Posted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:28 am Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Personally I hope not. I would have no interest in any of my classic VWs if they were electric...but that's just me |
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DuncanS Samba Member
Joined: October 17, 2013 Posts: 4583 Location: New Hampshire
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Posted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 6:28 am Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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United--Understand, but after we're gone, I expect our kids or grandchildren won't be permitted to drive them unless they have been converted, so it doesn't hurt to keep abreast of developments.
Personally, I would love to have an EV T3.
If this doesn't look like the chassis of a T3, i don't know what does.
So I don't see any real change other than the lack of noise, fumes and all the thousands of Vanagon Syndrome and related issues.
And how 'bout all the storage where the engine used to be? |
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pnwkayaker Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2008 Posts: 920 Location: Sammamish, WA
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Posted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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I truly love my Syncro (much more with the Suby conversion), however, I'm seeing the signs in the road and I truly believe in 10 yrs or less the majority of the cars in the market will be electric. As such, I'm starting to do some research on EV conversions. I won't pull the trigger at the current prices, but in 10 yrs (?) very likely if technology continues improving at the current rate and prices keep falling.
My dream setup is a 1,000 mile range (even if it takes a couple days to recharge). Why 1,000 mile? Because I believe that's how much I'd need to comfortable travel to the Arctic Circle via Alaska and don't have to constantly worry about recharging options.
If people haven't watched the video of the T3SLA posted earlier, I strongly suggest you do, that' a very smooth ride!
Also, the following pic posted by DuncanS truly intrigued me a lot, and after some research, I learned about 2 new EV developments that I was not aware of (things are moving fast in the EV world!).
1 - REE Auto (https://ree.auto) which proposes a very novel and interesting EV platform (the picture is from their platform)
2 - Zero Labs (https://www.zerolabs.com) who takes a different approach: bring the body of your classic car (a Syncro in my case) and they match if with a new electric platform. The following article in MotorTrend explains it much better https://www.motortrend.com/news/zero-labs-launches-modular-electric-platform-classic-cars/
Very interesting times we're living right now, I can not imagine what the next 10 yrs will bring.
_________________ 87 Syncro Westy EJ25 ("Tardis")
Seattle Meetup at Marymoor (link)
A collection of Simple Useful Mods (SUM) (link) |
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Mac_Daddy_Westy Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2011 Posts: 154 Location: San Antonio, Tx
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Posted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:46 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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https://www.canoo.com/
with Norway, predominately going towards EVs, the battery range in cold climate will improve more and more in the near future, Solid State and Graphene battery technology in fast improving as well as the fast charging stations being implement world-wide.
it is a matter of time that an EV conversion company, will create a bolt on kit for T3 Vanagons, its the perfect candidate.
the link above, showcase CANOO, a soon to in production has the right idea with their skateboard platform and Drive-by-wire steering technology to bring a perhaps new EVs Van to market,
but I still like to tinker with my ICE Westfalia for now...but knowing what's coming with EVs chatter is interesting.... _________________ '87 Westy with 2.5 Subi (auto trans) |
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VicVan Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2015 Posts: 1845 Location: Vancouver Island, BC
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Posted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:01 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Here's a (maybe not so) crazy idea: a removable on-board gas generator for long trips.
Most of the trips I do with my van are short-distance (granted, I live on an Island). It's either commuting, hauling stuff around town, or going camping 100 or 200 km away. Something EV cars do perfectly, and that an EV Vanagon would do perfectly.
For the once a year long-haul-more-than-1000 km-road-trip, you install a compact generator on the bikerack or wherever, and it charges your battery as you go (that's how the Prius works, the onboard gas engine is only here to recharge the battery, it's not connected to the wheels).
It may seem weird, but to me it makes sense rationally. You're not buying superfancy 1000 km autonomy batteries that you'll use only a few weeks a year.
all in all, you're decreasing your emissions by maybe 90%, while not making any compromise on the fun and travel range. Sounds like a good deal to me. _________________ '90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH) |
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RoryGirl Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2016 Posts: 784 Location: WestWorld Nanaimo BC
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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This is a bolt-in kit for a Land Rover...but there's a Westy in the background - so maybe there's a kit on the way for us too?
Link
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dabaron Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018 Posts: 2561 Location: Philly, mang
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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VicVan wrote: |
For the once a year long-haul-more-than-1000 km-road-trip, you install a compact generator...and it charges your battery as you go |
good luck with that. you will need a 10k generator (not compact) and you would drink gas with the system under load.
the ICE in the Prius hybrid platform is driving the wheels and has an electric motor/generator between the ICE and the transmission. the electric motor operates the Prius at low speeds from the battery, then adds assist under heavy loads, typically accelerations. a Prius is an "electric-assist" vehicle at highway speed. under braking the motor switches to generator mode and charges the battery. the ICE is mechanically connected to the transmission.
a diesel electric locomotive has a prime mover (the diesel engine) which drives an alternator. this is then regulated by a silicon rectifier which is controlled by the engineer's throttle lever. the electricity is sent to traction motor which are connected by fixed gearing on each axle (4 or 6 axle units are the most common in the US). the ICE is electrically connected to the axles.
while not completely like a diesel-electric locomotive, the Chevy Volt comes pretty close, it is a series/parallel hybrid design. it has an ICE that turns a generator which feeds a charger and then goes to a convertor and then the electric motor which drives an electric transmission to power the wheels. the battery is connected to the power lines between the charger and convertor. the Volt will operate from the batteries until they go below a voltage threshold. the ICE will then operate the generator and power the electric motor, any excess power is feed to the battery. the ICE is electrically connected to the transmission.
the ICE in the Volt is an inline 4 cylinder, 1.4L which makes 84hp at 4800rpm. the battery range is 53 miles, the ICE range is 420 miles. the Chevy Volt is how we should be building automobiles.
200 kilometers is 125 miles. that gets me almost to the mountains where i enjoy camping. i can't imagine listening to a generator run while i wait for enough charge to get me closer to my destination in the forest.
basically, this plan is a non-starter for the majority of Mid-Atlantic region Vanagon owners. it's a non-starter as an in-motion primer mover as well.
can you tell it's raining here today _________________ 1991 Vanagon GL Camper
i had no idea i wanted to be a mechanic
"burnin oil and cookin coils" -- Destructo
BiWerks Design, LLC |
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DuncanS Samba Member
Joined: October 17, 2013 Posts: 4583 Location: New Hampshire
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Pretty impressive. 450 HP?? I wonder what would be appropriate for a T3? I'm OK with the 2.1 WBX, but a little more might be nice. The question is what HP do you need so running at a 2.1 + performance level would give the most range. No O2 green shielded wire issue, no throttle body, no idle speed control, no anything to speak of. What a lot of sense this makes. Batteries where the fuel tank is, over the tranny spot and under the floor. I can't imagine 225 miles wouldn't be possible without being a lead foot.
Noticed the Westy in the background of the video had a patch welded over the fuel cap. Maybe this one is in the process of being converted.
Cost? Never came up, but has to be north of 20. How much is an FAS gen 5?
Want one.
Duncan |
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davideric9 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2009 Posts: 1001 Location: Oakland CA
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 5:24 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Electric Motor mounted to syncro transaxle. It's not mine, but I did have the opportunity to drive it. I had to tell the owner that gas is now over $6 a gallon, he didn't know.
_________________ 1987 Syncro Westfalia, stock (bought 1994)
1986 Syncro Westfalia SVX, 3 knob (bought 2008)
1987 Westfalia (bought 2010)
1988 Wolfsburg GL (bought 2012) |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22668 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 6:03 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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Abscate wrote: |
Abscate wrote: |
The holy grail is a high energy density battery, but that’s been chased for a long time, and abandoned by GM , Tesla, and the rest for currents technology.
That’s why ten years from now, mass EV will be “only 5 years away” |
Another 2 years, and mass EV is 5 years away. Maybe more now with Covid stopping is for two years |
Another 2 years and mass EV is 5 years away. _________________ .ssS! |
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MsTaboo Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006 Posts: 4096 Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 6:21 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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davideric9 wrote: |
Electric Motor mounted to syncro transaxle. It's not mine, but I did have the opportunity to drive it. I had to tell the owner that gas is now over $6 a gallon, he didn't know.
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This is something I would like to know - will electric conversions still rely on the stock $yncro transaxle - or is there a way to eliminate? It seems on the Land Rover they kept the stock transmission and diff? _________________ Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
Help the fight against Truth Decay.
Defend democracy, support Ukraine. |
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dabaron Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018 Posts: 2561 Location: Philly, mang
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2022 9:47 pm Post subject: Re: Electric conversions-- on the way? |
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MsTaboo wrote: |
This is something I would like to know - will electric conversions still rely on the stock $yncro transaxle - or is there a way to eliminate? It seems on the Land Rover they kept the stock transmission and diff? |
connecting to the existing transmission saves building a differential. _________________ 1991 Vanagon GL Camper
i had no idea i wanted to be a mechanic
"burnin oil and cookin coils" -- Destructo
BiWerks Design, LLC |
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