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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:10 pm Post subject: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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Happy New Year!
My bus has been sitting for months due to not being registered or insured. I regularly turn it over in the drive way and let it run some. I have driven it up the country lane I live on a couple of times in the past few weeks just to get it moving and it has done great. However, I wanted to do this the last few days and I just cannot get it into gear. When I push the clutch I can hear a light grinding noise, louder than usual. I can get it into reverse, but having no luck with 1st. Any suggestions?
Thanks in advance all. _________________ 1970, Deluxe, 1600cc, Type 1 Dual Port
[url=http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate2-35638.png]Click to view image[/URL] |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50334
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:20 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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One of the worst things you can do for your engine is to run it a little bit here and there. Either don't start the engine or get it out on the road and get it fully hot is you do start it.
Maybe you transmission ground cable isn't conducting electricity well and some of your starter current has been running through your clutch cable causing it o stretch. The clutch cable could just be fraying from age as well. |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:26 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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I did not know that Wildthings, thanks for letting me know. Unfortunately I've not been able to drive it for some time so I just thought running it might keep it alive.
Re the clutch cable...is this a simple replacement? _________________ 1970, Deluxe, 1600cc, Type 1 Dual Port
[url=http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate2-35638.png]Click to view image[/URL] |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50334
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:38 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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tunnvar wrote: |
I did not know that Wildthings, thanks for letting me know. Unfortunately I've not been able to drive it for some time so I just thought running it might keep it alive.
Re the clutch cable...is this a simple replacement? |
The clutch cable is a simple replacement, buy a clutch cable kit for your year. Sadly not all clutch cables are the length they should be, but are often too long. You might also want to have a replacement lever for the front end of the cable on hand in case yours is excessively worn.
Do remove, clean, and inspect the tranny ground strap and replace it if it is in less than A-one condition, they don't cost much. Use dielectric grease on the contact surfaces when reinstalling. |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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can you put it into 1st when the engine is off? _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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60vwnewengland Twin #2
Joined: June 25, 2003 Posts: 1784 Location: District of Columbia & Cape Cod
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:32 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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sounds like the clutch disc might be stuck on the input shaft splines?
try this:
With the car not running, put it in 4th gear. Put your foot down on the clutch and get your wife, partner, kids, buddy, or whoever to get behind the bus and push it forward (like you're push starting the bus). As they push forward, slowly let out the clutch and tell your helper to keep pushing the bus forward, while it's in fourth gear only for a few feet. If the clutch is stuck on the input shaft, this will get it unstuck.
Now push in the clutch pedal, start the bus, and see if you can get it in first, and see if it goes.
If this doesn't work, you can rule out stuck clutch disc. Then it might be a worn out shift cupler or throw-out bearing. _________________ 77 Westy - Cape Cod Sage
LLAP |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:28 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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Excellent idea, I will do this tonight! It is freezing cold right now, so this may be a factor too. Thank you for this advice. _________________ 1970, Deluxe, 1600cc, Type 1 Dual Port
[url=http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate2-35638.png]Click to view image[/URL] |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:00 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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60vwnewengland wrote: |
sounds like the clutch disc might be stuck on the input shaft splines?
try this:
With the car not running, put it in 4th gear. Put your foot down on the clutch and get your wife, partner, kids, buddy, or whoever to get behind the bus and push it forward (like you're push starting the bus). As they push forward, slowly let out the clutch and tell your helper to keep pushing the bus forward, while it's in fourth gear only for a few feet. If the clutch is stuck on the input shaft, this will get it unstuck.
Now push in the clutch pedal, start the bus, and see if you can get it in first, and see if it goes.
X2
could be pilot bearing too or clutch disc stuck. If the above doesn't get it, pull engine and check pilot bearing. Other than time, an inexpensive repair if you fix it now.
If this doesn't work, you can rule out stuck clutch disc. Then it might be a worn out shift cupler or throw-out bearing. |
_________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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Alan Brase Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 4532 Location: Cedar Falls, Iowa
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:01 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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You might just try tightening the clutch adjustment up a few turns. Usually when the cable is fraying/ breaking this will help but relief will not last.
If you change the cable you will be tightening this cable anyway. Might as well practice. _________________ Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
Vanagons:
80 P27 Westy JUL 1979, 3rd oldest known US
83 1.6TD Vanagon, 87 Wolfie Westy daily driver, swap meet home |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:04 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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Alan Brase wrote: |
You might just try tightening the clutch adjustment up a few turns. Usually when the cable is fraying/ breaking this will help but relief will not last.
If you change the cable you will be tightening this cable anyway. Might as well practice. |
check the freeplay before you change any adjustments on the cable. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:31 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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SGKent wrote: |
60vwnewengland wrote: |
sounds like the clutch disc might be stuck on the input shaft splines?
try this:
With the car not running, put it in 4th gear. Put your foot down on the clutch and get your wife, partner, kids, buddy, or whoever to get behind the bus and push it forward (like you're push starting the bus). As they push forward, slowly let out the clutch and tell your helper to keep pushing the bus forward, while it's in fourth gear only for a few feet. If the clutch is stuck on the input shaft, this will get it unstuck.
Now push in the clutch pedal, start the bus, and see if you can get it in first, and see if it goes.
X2
could be pilot bearing too or clutch disc stuck. If the above doesn't get it, pull engine and check pilot bearing. Other than time, an inexpensive repair if you fix it now.
If this doesn't work, you can rule out stuck clutch disc. Then it might be a worn out shift cupler or throw-out bearing. |
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OK, NO LUCK HERE UNFORTUNATELY. Crazy thing is now, when I try to get it in gear whilst running...it is trying to creep forward with the clutch down fully. If I try to put it in reverse...it jolts backwards, again with the clutch down fully.
Baffled. _________________ 1970, Deluxe, 1600cc, Type 1 Dual Port
[url=http://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate2-35638.png]Click to view image[/URL] |
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Zed999 Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018 Posts: 1244 Location: UK
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:13 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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So the clutch suddenly isn't quite doing it's job?
It's just a hunch, but look under the left side in front of the rear wheel. There is a steel conduit leading to a semi flexible tube on the side of the gearbox. The steel conduit should be fixed to the torsion tube. They can break away.
Also other end of flexible conduit on the gearbox is a bracket. The short bolts attaching it to the gearbox are prone to stripping.
Or some strands of the cable have broken.
Or something that needs engine out which is all the encouragement you should need to take a close look at the clutch cable. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50334
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:57 am Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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Once a clutch cable starts to fray it will keep on getting longer and longer with use. Do remove, check, clean, and/or replace your tranny ground strap as a bad strap will kill your new clutch cable. A very soft feeling pedal is a sign of a fraying cable. |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16956 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:45 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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You should be thrilled at finding the cause. Now change the cable and clean the tranny ground strap connections _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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tunnvar Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2011 Posts: 261 Location: Austin, Texas
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50334
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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tunnvar wrote: |
Does't look promising: |
Easy side of the road fix assuming you carry a spare cable and a few tools with you. Remember to look at the little lever at the front of the cable before ordering parts they are all getting badly worn at this point in time. Buy a kits that includes the clevis pin and if in doubt about the condition of the bowden tube buy a kit that contains a new one of those as well.
Even the best of these parts aren't very expensive so don't go trying to save money here, but buy the best you can get. Go ahead and order a new tranny ground strap as they are another inexpensive part that is more than likely due for replacement no matter what. You local NAPA will also have ground straps. |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:38 pm Post subject: Re: Cannot Get My '70 into Gear! |
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30 minute fix, awesome. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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