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Chipped valve adjusters
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Mutterranch
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:20 pm    Post subject: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

What can cause this? The motor is brand new (500 miles) and was built by a reputable builder and frequent poster here on the samba. I'm completely stumped. The photos are of #2 & #4 cylinders but the others show similar chips mostly on exhaust valves.

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67rustavenger Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Mutterranch wrote:
What can cause this? The motor is brand new (500 miles) and was built by a reputable builder and frequent poster here on the samba. I'm completely stumped.
[img]https://www.dropbox.com/s/hn3kyvq7gyf2i4p/P1010080.jpg?dl=0[/img][img]https://www.dropbox.com/s/4zd52ugf2af0q1u/P1010090.jpg?dl=0[/img]


I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that the rocker geo is off.
Can you post pics of the rocker at 0 lift?
1/2 lift?
and full lift?

Also what is the cam and rockers?

Good Luck.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Brittle metallurgy, or they might be binding-up.
As suggested, verify proper rocker geometry & try the 911 or Courier type.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

I have never been able to use those without grinding the rocker arm down, it prevents the cup from hitting the base of the rocker arm on the down stroke whether you have geometry right or wrong.

Sorry it is a terrible picture but yo can see the trimming, stock on right, trimmed on left.

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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Yeah it looks like the cup is contacting the rocker arm. It should be back cut to clear.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 4:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

so nobody noticed the rockers were infact clearanced???ON THE RONG FUCKING SIDE!!! they clearanced them on the nut side....you cant fix stupid. "A REPUTABLE BUILDER" SORRY BUT THATS WHAT I SEE.
throw it all away and get some cb rockers&swivel ball feet and set the geo right.prep them all right, do what needs to be done and do it right then send the bill to the repoatable builder.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 4:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Uh! Those chips went somewhere.

Did you by chance do you have a oil screen in place?
I didn't, on my build earlier this year. When I had a major part fail. The aluminum chips caused the engine to loose oil pressure. When the chips got jammed into the oil pump gears.

If not. Is this a full flow build?

Good Luck.
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Last edited by 67rustavenger on Sun Oct 28, 2018 9:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Pull the oil screen, hopefully the pieces didnt go to pump.
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modok
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 6:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

mark tucker wrote:
so nobody noticed the rockers were infact clearanced???ON THE RONG FUCKING SIDE!!! they clearanced them on the nut side....you cant fix stupid.

He's right,
Shocked
yes we can fix stupid. Put the rockers in the Scrap bin, and start over.
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Mutterranch
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Thanks guys. I appreciate the comments. Iíve only had this motor since Oct. so Iím not a real happy camper. I just gave notice to the builder. Now the ball is in his court and weíll see how he handles his warranty.
Iíll post again after we talk.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Nobody mentioned it but the elephant feet adjusters are supposed to be soaked in oil 24 hrs before installed.
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74 Thing
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 10:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1925154

Contact Tabari and get some properly clearanced rockers and some decent adjusters.
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busman78
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:07 am    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Both sides of those rockers needed trimming for that adjuster, rockers are still usable, trim the bottom, there is lots of meat still there.
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raygreenwood
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:24 am    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Having seen it happen numerous times over the years......that damage is exactly caused by not enough clearance for the head/cup of the adjuster underneath the rocker as others have mentioned already.

Yes...as Dave mentioned....these adjusters should be soaked in oil before installing....but what not doing that typically causes is seizure of the ball in the cup and snapping off of ends.

Other issues.....as others have mentioned....in the first picture....the geometry and centering of the adjuster looks like sh*t. These adjusters are NOT a crutch/excuse to not set geometry with proper pushrod length.

Lastly.....are those lash caps I am seeing underneath these adjusters? If so ....they are not onpy totally unnecessary with swivel feet....but stupid....and would also be a direct cause of not enough clearance. Ray
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volksworld
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:48 am    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

hard to see from the pic but i think there's a thread or 2 of the adjuster showing...i think it may be running out of travel and hitting the edge of the adjuster rather than the bottom of the rocker...or both...definately bad geometry....you need to see what it looks like at full lift
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Mutterranch
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:39 am    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Here's pics of #3 exhaust fully open and fully closed. Geometry?
Also, the builder of this $4550 long block just responded to my request for warranty repair with this, "We can send a different style of adjuster, but you'll have to put them in. If this is ok let me know."
What would you do?

I'm having trouble posting the pictures. I'll edit soon.
[img]https://www.dropbox.com/s/v3i3p3wpyytj9lj/P1010094.jpg?dl=0[/img][img]https://www.dropbox.com/s/e1g20f33n7anelt/P1010093.jpg?dl=0[/img]


Last edited by Mutterranch on Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:47 am; edited 1 time in total
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:57 am    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Host the pics here on The Samba, click the 'gallery' tab top centre.

I'd be checking rocker geo. If that's fine then take the rockers, fit them and away you go.
If the geo. is shonky I'd be sending the engine back to the builder. He maybe had an off day and if the back-cutting and pushrod length is out, who knows what else is.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

The adjusters slamming into the rocker arms must have made alot of noise. Hard to believe someone didnt say anything when it was started
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Mutterranch
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

OK, got the pictures into the gallery. Thanks for the tip.
What does the geometry look like to you?
Also, what adjusters would you use if not these?

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74 Thing
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Chipped valve adjusters Reply with quote

Cannot tell without the lift measurements.

Looks like bolt together rocker shafts and HD aluminum pushrods.

What camshaft are you running? What kind of heads and springs?

At the very least you need to take apart those rockers and clearance the ends with a mill or grinder. Clean everything and reassemble and check geometry with the new adjusters.
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