63 or 65 beetle |
63 |
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81% |
[ 13 ] |
65 |
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12% |
[ 2 ] |
Other (explain) |
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6% |
[ 1 ] |
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Total Votes : 16 |
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hylomatt Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2016 Posts: 378 Location: Florida
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:58 pm Post subject: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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I'm trying to decide between a 63 and a 65. Of course there's many more differences but I wanted some other people's opinions.
63 being the last year of the folding ragtop and 65 being the first year of the folding rear seat. |
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hitest Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2008 Posts: 10296 Location: Prime Meridian, ID
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Your poll does not make comparison sense. Plan on 95% ragtop. _________________
EverettB wrote: |
I wonder what the nut looks like.
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'62 L390 151, '62 L469 117, '63 L380 113, '64 L87 311, '65 L512 265, '65 L31 SO-42, '66 L360 251, '68 L30k 141, '71 L12 113, '74 ORG 181
FU#5 |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69733 Location: Phoenix Metro
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mukluk Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012 Posts: 6985 Location: Clyde, TX
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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You're going to have to explain the folding rear seat thing. Last time I checked, the rear seat back folded down on Bugs long before 1965. _________________ 1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga" |
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hylomatt Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2016 Posts: 378 Location: Florida
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:26 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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@hitest, @mukluk, I've never owned either of those beetles nor have I ever dug around in one of those years. I got that information from here. http://www.vw-resource.com/years.html
Maybe I'm not understanding what it did prior to "folding flat". Could someone explain?
@hitest why doesn't the comparison makes sense?
Last edited by hylomatt on Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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hylomatt Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2016 Posts: 378 Location: Florida
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:36 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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@EverettB, I was thinking more along the lines of ragtop versus increased storage space. But it looks like I might be corrected by some other people of a misunderstanding on my part. |
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Sharp64 Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015 Posts: 5305 Location: Central Florida
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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EverettB wrote: |
Ragtop by a million miles |
X 2 million. _________________ 1960 Indigo Blue Ragtop (Blue Barry)
1967 Ghia
1985 Westy Money Pit
“...some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.” - Michael Caine |
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hylomatt Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2016 Posts: 378 Location: Florida
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Is a rag top that much fun to own? The only beetle I ever owned was the 73 super so I really wouldn't know. |
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Bryan67 Samba Member
Joined: January 01, 2003 Posts: 2933 Location: Fresno, Ca.
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:57 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Bug back seats have never folded totally flat. Only Squarebacks. _________________ If you`re going to do something, do it right. |
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mukluk Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012 Posts: 6985 Location: Clyde, TX
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:12 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Starting with the '65 model the rear seat back got a strap that could be hooked under the seat bottom rail and cinched down, but the real gain in storage capacity would be negligible.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/61_65bug_replacement/page20.jpg
Notable differences on the '65 that could be considered actual improvements would be the increased size windows for better visibility (and cheaper pop out quarters), sun visors that can be swiveled to the side instead of just shading straight ahead, and slightly better stock brakes.
If you live someplace that's usually rainy or cold, the ragtop may not be good for you. But, where the weather is decent the ragtop is the next best thing to having a convertible due to its large opening. _________________ 1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga" |
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Keith Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005 Posts: 3635 Location: Brodheadsville, PA
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Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:37 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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hylomatt wrote: |
@hitest, @mukluk, I've never owned either of those beetles nor have I ever dug around in one of those years. I got that information from here. http://www.vw-resource.com/years.html
Maybe I'm not understanding what it did prior to "folding flat". Could someone explain?
@hitest why doesn't the comparison makes sense? |
As others have mentioned, the seats have folded since the beginning.
All I can say to your link is wow there is so much wrong with their info.
I will give a few examples of the errors I have seen.
They don’t even mention the MAJOR change in ‘55 with Aug ‘55 beginning the Aug previous year to July current year production.
They don’t have Aug-July production starting until the ‘61 model year and even then they have it going from Aug ‘60 to July ‘62!!!
They fail to mention the few changes for the ‘55 models through out the Jan- July production, in fact they barely mention anything for ‘55.
They mention ‘55 having a “dished steering wheel”??!!! That didn’t start until ‘60!
They also don’t say that ‘65 was the first year for a folding rear seat, they simply state it “folds flat”. Which is something it barely does, but it does fold a little flatter than the previous years.
What exactly are you trying to haul that the seat folding is even a concern? I think I have folded my rear seats in all my bugs maybe 4 times in the 24 years I have owned them. _________________ Formerly known in the forums as "OVALTEEN"
"I firmly believe that some villagers from Botswana could probably build a better road than PennDot."- Splitty
"If you do anything to your car someone will hate on you for it. People absolutely love to complain and find fault with others. Don't let it bother you. Just live and have fun."- Lind
Last edited by Keith on Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Sharp64 Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015 Posts: 5305 Location: Central Florida
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Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:12 am Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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hylomatt wrote: |
Is a rag top that much fun to own? The only beetle I ever owned was the 73 super so I really wouldn't know. |
“Fun” is subjective. But look at the prices of comparable condition 65’s and any ragtop and you’ll see a significantly higher price for the ragtop. I think most people would find your question very odd. I don’t think most people really care whether the back seat folds or not and using it as a determiner for which car to buy even more bizarre.
With any said, why rely on others to make your choices? Figure out what’s important to you and party on. Good luck in your search. _________________ 1960 Indigo Blue Ragtop (Blue Barry)
1967 Ghia
1985 Westy Money Pit
“...some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.” - Michael Caine |
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hylomatt Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2016 Posts: 378 Location: Florida
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Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:24 am Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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@Keith, @Sharp64 - good points, good info. In my 73 super, i used the folding back seat to carry a large Kustom amp and cabinet along with my bass guitar. that folding seat was a huge benefit.
i can see the oddity of comparing the two though. maybe that was silly.
@Sharp64, the prices for a ragtop are definitely higher. I'm looking at a 65 hard vs 63 rag right now. trying to decide. there's ~ $3k diff between the two. |
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hitest Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2008 Posts: 10296 Location: Prime Meridian, ID
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Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 7:44 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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hylomatt wrote: |
@Keith, @Sharp64 - good points, good info. In my 73 super, i used the folding back seat to carry a large Kustom amp and cabinet along with my bass guitar. that folding seat was a huge benefit.
i can see the oddity of comparing the two though. maybe that was silly.
@Sharp64, the prices for a ragtop are definitely higher. I'm looking at a 65 hard vs 63 rag right now. trying to decide. there's ~ $3k diff between the two. |
If your comparing ANY '65 to that creamy POS '63 ragtop- I'll change my answer to '65. That '63 discussed in your other thread will soon be forgotten.
But really- you're miles ahead and way better served to seek references on VWs right here at this site. TheSamba appeals to many of us because production changes, progressive refinements and opinions are discussed in detail. Every one here has a favorite year (mine is '63) so I never miss a thread about them. The pool of resources is great here- so you'll find the best answers regarding original equipment, why something was done this way, why the motor is that way, etc. You might also notice we don't let each other get away with too much false information. There's healthy peer pressure here to help discern a car well.
I'd visit the galleries using the search feature and the forums doing the same. Ragtop headaches are discussed right along with the pennies from heaven you enjoy when owning one. Visit the bodywork forums to learn more about what REALLY happened to that '63 ragtop.
Most importantly for me- rust is my enemy. I am not a welder and if I had to only choose a car from a rusty corner of the state- I'd drive a little further and buy one from further west.
I would not recommend settling for a car just out of convenience. Folks who do this might find they don't like the extra work involved and it might make an otherwise cool VWer not like VWs anymore. I've seen it happen. take your time and buy the best car you can. We'll continue to nitpick any you come across. _________________
EverettB wrote: |
I wonder what the nut looks like.
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'62 L390 151, '62 L469 117, '63 L380 113, '64 L87 311, '65 L512 265, '65 L31 SO-42, '66 L360 251, '68 L30k 141, '71 L12 113, '74 ORG 181
FU#5 |
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glutamodo The Android
Joined: July 13, 2004 Posts: 26299 Location: Douglas, WY
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Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:59 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Go Ragtop.
Who needs a folding rear seat. Just take it out and build a cargo bay like I did with my Baja Ragtop.
_________________ Andy T.
IMAGE NOTE: It has been noted that Chrome based browsers may have issues in displaying my vast image library, which use non-secure links and are on an FTP server. Images should still be viewable if the link is clicked though.
I do not know how to fix this. All I can say is it all works fine for me with what I use, Firefox. |
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my59 Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2003 Posts: 3781 Location: connecting the dots
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Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Ragtop for sure. Seat may not fold down flat, but if Lindbergh could sleep in his, surely enough storage room.
Only issue with ragtop is without pop out rear windows, there can be reverberation from wind pressure that can hammer your ears. Adjusting how open the top is can fix it. With the rag open, the car will be slower and mileage decreased because of the drag.
Mine has only leaked closed when driving in torrential rain with a nasty cross wind. Parked outside it has never leaked. _________________ my59: Well son, my grandfather died before I got to drive it, so does that answer your question?
our79: sunroof bus w/camper interior and 2.0 FI
Other:'12 Jetta, '77 Benz 300D, and a 74 MG Midget. |
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12815 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:07 pm Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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A ragtop would make it easier to get your large amp & equipment into the back seat. _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Gary Haberman Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2013 Posts: 69 Location: Farmingdale, NY
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Posted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 4:50 am Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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I own a '62 ragtop and a '66 sedan. They each have their uses (that's why I have two). The '66 back seat does fold down FLAT. I volunteer to do construction work and lug around saws and drills and such and I wouldn't dare put my stuff on my pretty ragtop's back seat (which I replaced recently). I replaced the ragtop with one from WW and never experienced a leak though to be honest, I avoid driving the car in the rain (it lives in a heated garage). But to honest, while I think the ragtop looks nicer and has a bit more value, from a practical standpoint, other than venting it quickly on a hot day, I really wish I had purchased a convertible. So there.... _________________ '62 T1 rag top.
I repair radios and dispense free advice on their repair. |
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Sharp64 Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015 Posts: 5305 Location: Central Florida
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Posted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 6:30 am Post subject: Re: Ragtop vs folding rear seat |
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Gary Haberman wrote: |
I own a '62 ragtop and a '66 sedan. They each have their uses (that's why I have two). The '66 back seat does fold down FLAT. I volunteer to do construction work and lug around saws and drills and such and I wouldn't dare put my stuff on my pretty ragtop's back seat (which I replaced recently). I replaced the ragtop with one from WW and never experienced a leak though to be honest, I avoid driving the car in the rain (it lives in a heated garage). But to honest, while I think the ragtop looks nicer and has a bit more value, from a practical standpoint, other than venting it quickly on a hot day, I really wish I had purchased a convertible. So there.... |
Funny story. Friend and I were heading to a show recently. He has a vert and I have a ragtop. We got about 2 miles down the road and it started raining. HARD. I twisted the handle and slid my top shut. We had to pull of to the side of the road and pull his boot off, put the top up and latch and snap all the snaps. Then it stopped raining. Convertibles are nice except for ease of closure. _________________ 1960 Indigo Blue Ragtop (Blue Barry)
1967 Ghia
1985 Westy Money Pit
“...some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.” - Michael Caine |
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