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Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
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 Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2019 9:35 pm Post subject: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Hey all, looking for a list of the top 3 engine builders with a currently good reputation. specifically in the PNW area of the USA, but flexible if the builder is the known best. the owner is currently completely incapable of rebuilding themselves, and wants a rebuilt motor (doesnt have any issues currently)
Raby is on the list to call.
I will not touch the actual rebuild, just install and final tune.
owner will not be doing any of it.
colin and robbie dont count.
Headflow masters i have not heard good things about lately, despite his great work. it seems to much work has lessened the quality of the builds and id rather not deal with that.
any suggestions? i need like 3 more to call and ask in addition to Raby.
thanks guys!
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Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
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airkooledchris
Samba Member
Joined: January 25, 2005
Posts: 2711
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Stuartzickefoose
Samba Post Whore
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 10350
Location: SoCal for now...
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2019 10:27 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Franklins a suspension shop, and is as wonderful as nate at wagens west, personality wise. Great place for suspension parts but not a engine build.
Averys i know about but havent heard yay or nay on much. Anyone have any recent experience with him?
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Stuart Zickefoose
2011 Jetta Sportwagen TDi 6 speed manual
206-841-7324
[email protected] |
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Xevin 
Samba Member
Joined: January 08, 2014
Posts: 7632
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 2:06 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Raby not in Pacific Norwest nor would I think he would rebuild an existing engine. Could be wrong. What’s the timeline? Something to consider as well.
Maybe Fat performance in SoCal?
https://fatperformance-rimco.com/collections/type-iv-motor-builds
Maybe Ashley’s crew at Always Vdub.
http://always-v-dub.com/
What about House of Ghia in Salem?
I don’t have any feedback on any of them for type 4 rebuilds. Maybe they can suggest some. Maybe noodle around the Porsche forums. Would Bleyseng do it? What about BD? Or Tram? Mike B or Tritessa? If not they probably know where to send it to.
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GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!  |
| Clatter wrote: |
| Damn that Xevin... |
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I respect Xevin and he's a turd  |
| SGKent wrote: |
My God! Xevin and I 100% agree  |
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:15 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Fat and Rimco merged, and some folks have told me of weird results there. The hard part of rebuilding a T4 is getting someone who CONSISTENTLY gets the machine work and parts inspection right EACH time.
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16879
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:57 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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don't bother wasting jake rabys time 
because last I knew...he was about 15-18K for this "rebuild" you are looking for with about a year backlog. and I'm not trying to be an asshole...but if jake read any of your (mis)adventures I am willing to bet he would decline to sell you anything just to save himself the aggravation.
I honestly think that you're looking for something faster and cheaper. JR is a good dude...don't get me wrong. I like him quite a lot and respect the man. why not reach out to roy@mofoco? he is/was doing T4 stuff.
I will say this...I have done a few engines "off season" and finishing up one now before spring hits. these are "filler" "when I get time" jobs...I don't understand how guys make $$ doing these anymore. I have 4 hours setting valve geometry and building solid rocker shafts....these take an epic amount of time to build with the quality of what is offered today...
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
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| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
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[email protected]
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002
Posts: 4394
Location: Brew City
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:27 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| Stuartzickefoose wrote: |
Hey all, looking for a list of the top 3 engine builders with a currently good reputation. specifically in the PNW area of the USA, but flexible if the builder is the known best. the owner is currently completely incapable of rebuilding themselves, and wants a rebuilt motor (doesnt have any issues currently)
Raby is on the list to call.
I will not touch the actual rebuild, just install and final tune.
owner will not be doing any of it.
colin and robbie dont count.
Headflow masters i have not heard good things about lately, despite his great work. it seems to much work has lessened the quality of the builds and id rather not deal with that.
any suggestions? i need like 3 more to call and ask in addition to Raby.
thanks guys! |
We are rebuilding more type 4 engines than ever before. I only do stock rebuilds, maybe add a performance cam and dual carbs on completes but that's it. No stroker cranks, big bore pistons and cylinders, etc. I am not in the PNW and we are not fast BUT we are good. 8-10 weeks and I currently have one perfect core to rebuild that we just took in. Feel free to email [email protected] or call 414-963-1020
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Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:07 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Roy
The questions below are not meant to be adversay. I am trying to determine if your engines are something I could endorse.
Whose cases are you using on T4? How do you know their history?
Who sizes and rebushes the rods?
Who grinds the cranks when needed?
Whose heads do you use?
Pistons and Cylinders are made by? Or just hone and re-ring?
What brand bearings (main, rod, and cam) are you using?
What brand camshaft and lifters are used? New or reground?
Where are you finding aluminum cam gears of varying pitch to be able to do this in quanty?
New or used oil cooler - OEM or aftermarket?
Are you providing a flywheel or surfacing the old one?
Are you replacing rocker shafts or just flipping them over when gauled?
You don't need to give actual company names in each case but something tangible so we can determine the quality of components going into these engines you are building. There is a huge difference between re-manufacturing an engine and just assembling parts - I know you know that. My take is that it is extremely hard to find all the individual components, and machine work to put into a true quality engine.
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“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin
Last edited by SGKent on Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:10 am; edited 3 times in total |
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CarlosZ
Samba Member
Joined: April 23, 2016
Posts: 319
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:08 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| Conemac Precision Machining, Canoga Park, CA. |
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alman72
Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2014
Posts: 2573
Location: MICHIGAN
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 2:12 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| SGKent wrote: |
Roy
The questions below are not meant to be adversay. I am trying to determine if your engines are something I could endorse.
Whose cases are you using on T4? How do you know their history?
Who sizes and rebushes the rods?
Who grinds the cranks when needed?
Whose heads do you use?
Pistons and Cylinders are made by? Or just hone and re-ring?
What brand bearings (main, rod, and cam) are you using?
What brand camshaft and lifters are used? New or reground?
Where are you finding aluminum cam gears of varying pitch to be able to do this in quanty?
New or used oil cooler - OEM or aftermarket?
Are you providing a flywheel or surfacing the old one?
Are you replacing rocker shafts or just flipping them over when gauled?
You don't need to give actual company names in each case but something tangible so we can determine the quality of components going into these engines you are building. There is a huge difference between re-manufacturing an engine and just assembling parts - I know you know that. My take is that it is extremely hard to find all the individual components, and machine work to put into a true quality engine. |
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:57 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Alman - I am of the opinion that anyone who says they have a good product to sell is under an obligation to explain what it is that makes their product special when someone asks. Roy is no exception, and he can answer or not answer those questions if he wishes to. He builds lots of T1 motors for people, and they have plenty of feedback here on them. Quality T4 parts, and T4 machine work are very hard to come by these days - a lot more expensive too. I suspect for him too as much as it is for everyone else here. Enjoy your popcorn.
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Xevin
Samba Member
Joined: January 08, 2014
Posts: 7632
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 4:23 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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Hey Steve. You post fair questions. I’ll be eating popcorn while I wait for answers too. Screw the popcorn. I’m cracking a beer open  I like Roy,even bought type 1 heads from him. Just haven’t heard much about his type 4 stuff.
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Keep on Busin'
| 67rustavenger wrote: |
| GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
| Clatter wrote: |
| Damn that Xevin... |
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| I respect Xevin and he's a turd |
| SGKent wrote: |
| My God! Xevin and I 100% agree |
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orwell84
Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 2539
Location: Plattsburgh, New York
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| SGKent wrote: |
Alman - I am of the opinion that anyone who says they have a good product to sell is under an obligation to explain what it is that makes their product special when someone asks. Roy is no exception, and he can answer or not answer those questions if he wishes to. He builds lots of T1 motors for people, and they have plenty of feedback here on them. Quality T4 parts, and T4 machine work are very hard to come by these days - a lot more expensive too. I suspect for him too as much as it is for everyone else here. Enjoy your popcorn. |
I understand about parts availability, but not why machine work would differ significantly compared to a Type 1, other than maybe heads? Parts seem more expensive, but I don't have the impression that it's that hard to find quality parts, they are just more expensive and there are a lot of cheap low quality parts. The first thing that comes to mind is the oil pump. Quality heads are definitely out there, camshafts, pistons and cylinders. Maybe bearings?
It's just that I hear this all the time and don't quite get what is so hard to find. Is it that it's just hard to find quickly or inexpensively? Is it that these factors cause difficulties for someone building for a customer that are not so much an issue for a home builder?
As I'm not really a car guy and have never built or worked on another engine ever, maybe my Type 4 building experience just seemed normal for lack of comparison. If I were building a small block Chevy, would I be getting good parts at my door overnight for cheap that a one-armed blind machinist could turn to spec with a drill press? No disrespect intended, I just don't quite get it. |
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:14 pm Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| Xevin wrote: |
| Hey Steve. You post fair questions. I’ll be eating popcorn while I wait for answers too. Screw the popcorn. I’m cracking a beer open I like Roy,even bought type 1 heads from him. Just haven’t heard much about his type 4 stuff. |
Enjoy the beer 
Stuart is doing the right thing by trying to find a good quality engine builder.
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alman72
Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2014
Posts: 2573
Location: MICHIGAN
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 3:51 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| I am just exited to hear a response that gives a viable option for those of us that may need a quality engine someday. If I knew they were good, I would buy one and store it today! |
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Bleyseng
Samba Member
Joined: July 03, 2005
Posts: 4752
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:29 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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I'd put one together for him but what does he want? Stock? FI?
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:38 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| alman72 wrote: |
| I am just exited to hear a response that gives a viable option for those of us that may need a quality engine someday. If I knew they were good, I would buy one and store it today! |
a lot of people would but I suspect that the cost of that like new remanufactured engine would be more than most would pay.
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[email protected]
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002
Posts: 4394
Location: Brew City
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:41 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| SGKent wrote: |
Roy
The questions below are not meant to be adversay. I am trying to determine if your engines are something I could endorse.
Whose cases are you using on T4? How do you know their history? OE German case. How does anyone know the history of every case?
Who sizes and rebushes the rods? We rebuild the rods in house.
Who grinds the cranks when needed? We grind the cranks in house.
Whose heads do you use? We either rebuild the heads in house or buy new AMC heads
Pistons and Cylinders are made by? Or just hone and re-ring New AA Piston and Cylinder Sets
What brand bearings (main, rod, and cam) are you using? Silverline Main, rod and cam bearings
What brand camshaft and lifters are used? New or reground? Reground German cam or New Engle Performance with new Brazil lifters
Where are you finding aluminum cam gears of varying pitch to be able to do this in quanty? I have at least 1000 German crank gears if I need to switch them
New or used oil cooler - OEM or aftermarket? Good Used German Oil Cooler
Are you providing a flywheel or surfacing the old one? Resurfaced German Flywheel in house
Are you replacing rocker shafts or just flipping them over when gauled? I have a few thousand rocker arms and shafts so I throw out the junk and only use what's good.
You don't need to give actual company names in each case but something tangible so we can determine the quality of components going into these engines you are building. There is a huge difference between re-manufacturing an engine and just assembling parts - I know you know that. My take is that it is extremely hard to find all the individual components, and machine work to put into a true quality engine. |
Wow, that's some questions. I have no problem answering all of them, nothing to hide here. Funny though that you were all eating popcorn and drinking beer waiting for me to answer as yesterday was one of my two mandatory days off each year and I was at Brewer's Opening Day, eating popcorn and drinking beer.
_________________
Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
https://www.facebook.com/mofoco?ref=ts&fref=ts
www.mofoco.com
Cylinder Head Reference Sheet |
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SGKent
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007
Posts: 41031
Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 9:26 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| [email protected] wrote: |
| SGKent wrote: |
Roy
The questions below are not meant to be adversay. I am trying to determine if your engines are something I could endorse.
Whose cases are you using on T4? How do you know their history? OE German case. How does anyone know the history of every case?
Who sizes and rebushes the rods? We rebuild the rods in house.
Who grinds the cranks when needed? We grind the cranks in house.
Whose heads do you use? We either rebuild the heads in house or buy new AMC heads
Pistons and Cylinders are made by? Or just hone and re-ring New AA Piston and Cylinder Sets
What brand bearings (main, rod, and cam) are you using? Silverline Main, rod and cam bearings
What brand camshaft and lifters are used? New or reground? Reground German cam or New Engle Performance with new Brazil lifters
Where are you finding aluminum cam gears of varying pitch to be able to do this in quanty? I have at least 1000 German crank gears if I need to switch them
New or used oil cooler - OEM or aftermarket? Good Used German Oil Cooler
Are you providing a flywheel or surfacing the old one? Resurfaced German Flywheel in house
Are you replacing rocker shafts or just flipping them over when gauled? I have a few thousand rocker arms and shafts so I throw out the junk and only use what's good.
You don't need to give actual company names in each case but something tangible so we can determine the quality of components going into these engines you are building. There is a huge difference between re-manufacturing an engine and just assembling parts - I know you know that. My take is that it is extremely hard to find all the individual components, and machine work to put into a true quality engine. |
Wow, that's some questions. I have no problem answering all of them, nothing to hide here. Funny though that you were all eating popcorn and drinking beer waiting for me to answer as yesterday was one of my two mandatory days off each year and I was at Brewer's Opening Day, eating popcorn and drinking beer. |
Maybe it was national popcorn and beer day
There is a lot to gain if all the supply line issues on T4 engine parts and machine work can be worked out. Yes - there are a lot of questions and my guess is that some will be an obstacle to answer but if they have been or can be solved, reliable T4 engines upon demand would be the result.
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[email protected]
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002
Posts: 4394
Location: Brew City
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 9:41 am Post subject: Re: Need a Type 4 engine builder |
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| SGKent wrote: |
| [email protected] wrote: |
| SGKent wrote: |
Roy
The questions below are not meant to be adversay. I am trying to determine if your engines are something I could endorse.
Whose cases are you using on T4? How do you know their history? OE German case. How does anyone know the history of every case?
Who sizes and rebushes the rods? We rebuild the rods in house.
Who grinds the cranks when needed? We grind the cranks in house.
Whose heads do you use? We either rebuild the heads in house or buy new AMC heads
Pistons and Cylinders are made by? Or just hone and re-ring New AA Piston and Cylinder Sets
What brand bearings (main, rod, and cam) are you using? Silverline Main, rod and cam bearings
What brand camshaft and lifters are used? New or reground? Reground German cam or New Engle Performance with new Brazil lifters
Where are you finding aluminum cam gears of varying pitch to be able to do this in quanty? I have at least 1000 German crank gears if I need to switch them
New or used oil cooler - OEM or aftermarket? Good Used German Oil Cooler
Are you providing a flywheel or surfacing the old one? Resurfaced German Flywheel in house
Are you replacing rocker shafts or just flipping them over when gauled? I have a few thousand rocker arms and shafts so I throw out the junk and only use what's good.
You don't need to give actual company names in each case but something tangible so we can determine the quality of components going into these engines you are building. There is a huge difference between re-manufacturing an engine and just assembling parts - I know you know that. My take is that it is extremely hard to find all the individual components, and machine work to put into a true quality engine. |
Wow, that's some questions. I have no problem answering all of them, nothing to hide here. Funny though that you were all eating popcorn and drinking beer waiting for me to answer as yesterday was one of my two mandatory days off each year and I was at Brewer's Opening Day, eating popcorn and drinking beer. |
Maybe it was national popcorn and beer day
There is a lot to gain if all the supply line issues on T4 engine parts and machine work can be worked out. Yes - there are a lot of questions and my guess is that some will be an obstacle to answer but if they have been or can be solved, reliable T4 engines upon demand would be the result. |
Well, let me know what you think of my answers above and if you have any other questions.
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Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
https://www.facebook.com/mofoco?ref=ts&fref=ts
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