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thom
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Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5943
Location: Sacramento
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 Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:33 am Post subject: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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At the SOTO meet this weekend, in the broiling 70° sun, the most happening spots were at the buses with tents. I have one of the repo westfalia tents and have toyed with the idea of installing the roof mounts on my 23-window so I could provision some shade when needed. I use this tent on the panel and it's awesome. My idea is to install the root mounts with welded nuts underneath, so I don't have to worry about access through the headliner.
Thoughts? Has anyone ever done this on a roof-window bus?
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-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Mercedes Westfalia single cab
1963 Unimog 404
1965 E-Type
Last edited by thom on Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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srfndoc
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Joined: August 21, 2010
Posts: 3274
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:43 am Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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Westfalia used plain old screws on most of the smaller mounts (minus the foward mount) so you don't need access to other side for those. Seen here:
For the front mount you could use a rivnut (http://rivetnuts.com) if you didn't have access to the back side or just secure it with screws as well like Westfalia did on buses with a headliner (SO22 here):
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thom
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5943
Location: Sacramento
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:21 am Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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So what would happen if you removed one of those screws? Is there a nut on the other side? IIRC, on my '55 Westfalia there was.
_________________
-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Mercedes Westfalia single cab
1963 Unimog 404
1965 E-Type
Last edited by thom on Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19672
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:31 am Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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Self tapping screws go through the rear mount , through the roof and through a backing plate.
The front mount uses carriage bolts or the same screws as the rear mount.
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Your Vanagon sucks, Stop waving at me.
| HamburgerBrad wrote: |
I slept on crofty's tent once. I passed out drunk from two bottles of Everett's brother's wine. |
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notchboy
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Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 22445
Location: Escondido CA
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:56 am Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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Why not. It gives you that option to remove the brackets if needed - except for the bolt holes and what ever you decide to cap the holes with.
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| t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
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npbusguy
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Joined: February 08, 2006
Posts: 1658
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:09 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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| crofty wrote: |
Self tapping screws go through the rear mount , through the roof and through a backing plate.
The front mount uses carriage bolts or the same screws as the rear mount. |
The rear mount on my '60 SO23 uses carriage bolts, just like the front mount. |
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19672
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:11 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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| npbusguy wrote: |
| crofty wrote: |
Self tapping screws go through the rear mount , through the roof and through a backing plate.
The front mount uses carriage bolts or the same screws as the rear mount. |
The rear mount on my '60 SO23 uses carriage bolts, just like the front mount. |
hmm. backing plate?
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Your Vanagon sucks, Stop waving at me.
| HamburgerBrad wrote: |
I slept on crofty's tent once. I passed out drunk from two bottles of Everett's brother's wine. |
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srfndoc
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Joined: August 21, 2010
Posts: 3274
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:35 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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Never seen a backing plate used, just bolts:
No way Westfalia could have got to the back side of a bus with a headliner like an SO22 so I'm guessing they just rocked the screws by themselves.
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thom
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5943
Location: Sacramento
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:46 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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Unless the mounts went in before the headliner, or someone very carefully removed said headliner to install the mount (is that even possible?)
| srfndoc wrote: |
| No way Westfalia could have got to the back side of a bus with a headliner like an SO22 so I'm guessing they just rocked the screws by themselves. |
_________________
-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Mercedes Westfalia single cab
1963 Unimog 404
1965 E-Type |
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srfndoc
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Joined: August 21, 2010
Posts: 3274
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:51 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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| thom wrote: |
Unless the mounts went in before the headliner, or someone very carefully removed said headliner to install the mount (is that even possible?)
| srfndoc wrote: |
| No way Westfalia could have got to the back side of a bus with a headliner like an SO22 so I'm guessing they just rocked the screws by themselves. |
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Certainly possible. I would love to see a pic of the backing plate Crofty mentioned as I've never seen one. It would definitely provide for additional holding strength if normal self tapping screws were used.
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Braukuche
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Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 10997
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:58 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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| srfndoc wrote: |
| thom wrote: |
Unless the mounts went in before the headliner, or someone very carefully removed said headliner to install the mount (is that even possible?)
| srfndoc wrote: |
| No way Westfalia could have got to the back side of a bus with a headliner like an SO22 so I'm guessing they just rocked the screws by themselves. |
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Certainly possible. I would love to see a pic of the backing plate Crofty mentioned as I've never seen one. It would definitely provide for additional holding strength if normal self tapping screws were used. |
I wonder if there was a difference between the six vs four mounting hole brackets.
My '62 SO22 had the mounts missing, and the six holes for both were welded up so no idea if they used carriage bolts for both, like on my 59 SO23, or if they used metal screws. The holes were pretty damn small indicating screws but can't say for sure.
I don't think they would mess with headliner installation, that wasn't their thing and removing the headliner to install the rear would be very difficult to do without damaging the headliner.
There has to be someone out there with a mosaic or 22 who should know.
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Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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easy e
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Joined: May 28, 2008
Posts: 3931
Location: 1 hr north of Santa Barbara
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:09 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacriligious idea I had |
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| srfndoc wrote: |
| I would love to see a pic of the backing plate Crofty mentioned as I've never seen one. It would definitely provide for additional holding strength if normal self tapping screws were used. |
NOS rear roof mounts (only pic I've taken of them):
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Spreadsheet for Bus RPM, based on gearing & tire size (Excel format)
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Last edited by easy e on Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:13 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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notchboy
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easy e
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srfndoc
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:29 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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Evan to the rescue (thanks for the pic). I wonder if that is something that was an early or late thing.
Not much help for Thom and I'm still curious what they did on a headliner bus. I'm sure Greg or Clara could add more knowledge to this discussion.
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hitest
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Joined: September 30, 2008
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Location: Prime Meridian, ID
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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As long as everybody's comfortable with sacrilege and all...
Could a guy get creative using two of the skylight windows? I mean, getting two cut/molded in Plexiglas and run bolts and brackets through those? That's definitely what I would do in your shoes. Zero affect to body.
Along those lines, thin, stainless bases could be arched to match the windows- then inserted under the rubber lip to support welded-on brackets. Think of the metal louvers from every hatchback car in the 80s. They were held by brackets you shoved under the rubber window seal. Very quickly removed and replaced- but protects everything.
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| EverettB wrote: |
I wonder what the nut looks like.
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'62 L390 151, '62 L469 117, '63 L380 113, '64 L87 311, '65 L512 265, '65 L31 SO-42, '66 L360 251, '68 L30k 141, '71 L12 113, '74 ORG 181
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easy e
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notchboy
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Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 22445
Location: Escondido CA
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:37 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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I love it when people cringe at the idea of drill a hole in your VW. God forbid you accessorize it  And yeah, yeah, I don't need to hear the reasons why y'all wouldnt do it.
I still like the welded capture nut idea. But then again why would you take the brackets off? You will always have the holes.  Then that lends itself to just installing them now while the bus is in primer. It is in primer, yes?
After all that, there is this.
https://www.busdepot.com/A9013
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| t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
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ryans65
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Joined: February 16, 2016
Posts: 1259
Location: Yulee FL
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:19 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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| What about attaching the mounts to a large magnet like you would find on one of those magnetic tool dish things? I think a decent magnet would be plenty strong enough to hold on some tent brackets. |
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smoothfinishes
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Joined: March 28, 2008
Posts: 186
Location: Southern Oregon
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| Posted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Another sacrilegious idea I had |
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Not a bad idea to use magnets.
But if you want the mounts somehwat permanent and the headliner is in place.
Use some rivets, no welding, backing to mess with etc.
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