Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
How to track a BD vin number with only a little information
Page: 1, 2  Next
Forum Index -> Split Bus - Barndoor Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 6:01 am    Post subject: How to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

hi folks,

I wonder if it is possible to track the vin number of the BD my granddad's father owned back in the days.


For now I only have little information on it that i collected from the newspaper I have about it and that one picture. But actually in my eyes it must be possible.

Here is what i collected till now:
-It came out factory as a panel(noticable by the 3 vents in the back and the windows that doesn't look factory)
-mirror is faced down
-no handle on the cargo door, only the church key is vissable
-no rear bumper
-it's hard to tell on the black and white pictures but it seems to be a two-tone van
-wiper arms are faced to side passenger
-and this is most important to track the vin i suppose since i noticed that not many BD busses had this option: the bumper and logo look cromed to me.

so my opinion: correct me if i'm wrong, the van needs te be made from end of '52 till end of '53, chassis number between 20-041712 and 20-069409.
and most important option on the panel must be the crome bumper and logo

I have contacted the VW dealer in the netherlands, since i know the full name of my granddad's father and the dealer he must have bought it(must have been the VW dealership in Maastricht) but the don't have any records that go that far back in time.

Also is there no licence plate visable on the pictures so that's also a closed road unfortunately.

Finding back the bus is something i dreamed of my whole life but getting bit older now i realise that the chance is verry minimal. but knowing the vin number and then be able to order the birthcertificate would make me so happy! And i would be able to finish the 1/10 replica i'm making since now i don't even know what color it needs to be.

Thanks guys! I realy hope you could help me out on this.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Last edited by barnelicious on Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:13 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

that report and pic is cool, as is the camper van conversion.
It is great that you are bringing this here and want to find the whereabouts of the van.
some odds are against you though. the panel van was the highest volume model. so there are literally thousands of possible Vins inbetween late 52 and late 53 ( which your observations about the rear bumper and frnt vent wings are correct).
Unfortunately the chromed bumper, VW badge and the two tone paint can't help you with factory specs, as none of them were factory, rather dealer installed or by private party. seeing as the highroof conversion is rarely found on Barndoors, it reminds me of the military observation vans they used in Sweden and possibly Netherlands as well. Unless you have proof that your grand-grandfather bought it new from dealers, there is a good chance that he purchased it second hand as is or had the roof conversion done by a second company. it is also not a factory install.
There is no way for you to search the Wolfsburg archives, as they will only aprove the data and specs on a VIN you can provide. they will not search for the VIN according to dealer or customer name.

I assume that you have already checked barndoor.dk for all registered vans ?

The camper conversion is very unusual though, and I'd say if it still exists or somebody knew of its whereabouts, it is a very recognizable van and info should pop up soon. Good luck !
_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:50 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

hello,

Thanks for your respond, it's a step in the good direction again, I didn't know the fact about the bumper. Maybe it was installed in the dealership of Maastricht indeed. Maybe my next step should be asking if they have a register on witch vans they had installed the the chrome options.

If I can believe my grandmother then it's sure he bought the van new, and then did the conversion himselve.

I looked the barndoor.dk registery a few times over since i'm looking for the van but it's not there, not even a restaured one that looks like it could be it.

My uncle(right in the picture as a kid) always told me the van was white as he remember it well and not two-toned. but as you look at the pictures you can notice the upper half of it being little darker. My suggestion is that he had only the top repainted(and also the part where the new installed windows where) in a slightly other tone of white?

I think i know the army bus you mean, i have a picture of it on my computer. Is there more then one? I know of one but it has much bigger windows in the roof, it wasn't a panel originally and it's RHD. would love to see pics of other existing BD busses!


Last edited by barnelicious on Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:07 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:05 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

Is this the one you were talking about?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


other BD highroof busses i found so far:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:12 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

a 53 panel van was only available from the factory in dove blue or primer. there were no special order colors at that time.
Maybe we are misstaking a two tone paint bumper for chrome ? not sure on the reflections.
If he did that conversion by himself he was either an incredibly talented hobbyist or rather a professional. what was his occupation ?
that top conversion looks to be made in the traditional method of laying alumnium or sheetmetal or even painted canvas over ash framing. the rain gutters above the roof windows seem to be of the nailed on aluminium profile type, as was used on many European prewar and early postwar cars as well as on trucks and coachbuilt vehicles and trailers. the roof glass appears to be straight glass and not plexyglass. also they appear to have sollid rubber seals, there is no trim of any kind visible, holding them to the roof structure. they must have had folded/welded/riveted/nailed (???) openings to mount them. the shape of the corners look real well done.
I think you should investigate the Dutch 'Kemperink' coachbuild shop. they did other conversions ( extended load bed single cabs) for the military.
There is quite a number of dedicated Barndoor people in the Netherlands, so hopefully some of them will chime into this conversation.
_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:14 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

the 2 vans on the Hamburg airport pic are not highroofs. they were just 'ladder' cars, that had some kind of an enclosed container on top to carry long ladders.
_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:48 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

I will ask my uncle if he knows what my grand grandfather did for a living. I realy don't know. I also don't have real proof of him building the roof himselves(accept what my grandmother told me), but in the article he talks about 'laying on the ground of the kitchen floor to know hom long the bed needed to be' so this might meen he sertainly made the interior himselve.
On the pictures here it is indeed not verry clear but on the real pictures themselve you can notice a bit of reflection in the bumper and them being quite simular to the chrome rings from the front lights. I also asked several second opinions at friends showing the pictures and theyall seem to agree that the bumper must be chrome. But it's still hard to tell on those black and white pictures. of only there was a way to bring them back in color:-)

I will take contact with the kemperinck shop, they might have some information if it was build there instead. or at least some information on the roof structure and windows.

the primer color you talk about, is that the L62 they talk about on barndoor.dk? is that the same color ambulances did came with?

Thank you for helping me out! this is actually verry exciting for me:-) It's fun learning more and more bit by bit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:16 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

I love your attitude in research, in just calling a company. please keep that positive attitude! I have to say though. remember this was taking place more than 60 yrs ago. generations have passed away, companies have been closed or reorganized, so chances are very slim to find original records. But you never know, so that is why you better just keep on doing what you do.
There are lots of cases on the Barndoor forum that show how much can be found out even 60 years later.
Who knows, the naswer to your questions might even be somewhere here in TS files. Did you check all of the vintage pic thread ? your grand grandfathers bus might be pictured in there as well in some other paint scheme or whatnot. We are still always searching to find a vintage pic of the actual only known Kohlruss survivor. It might show up just tomorrow !

L62 ivory is really a dirty off white, nowhere close to the og primer ( which is rather dark grey) and I believe the primer never had a color cde number.
If you follow the link to my Barndoor project you will see some latest paint scraping on a spare engien lid and see the huge difference between white ( ivory?) paint and grey primer. to give you a hint, the og primer on my BD chassis remains matches basaltgrau ral 7012. that is not white or ivory at all.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


cheers, Günter.


barnelicious wrote:
I will ask my uncle if he knows what my grand grandfather did for a living. I realy don't know. I also don't have real proof of him building the roof himselves(accept what my grandmother told me), but in the article he talks about 'laying on the ground of the kitchen floor to know hom long the bed needed to be' so this might meen he sertainly made the interior himselve.
On the pictures here it is indeed not verry clear but on the real pictures themselve you can notice a bit of reflection in the bumper and them being quite simular to the chrome rings from the front lights. I also asked several second opinions at friends showing the pictures and theyall seem to agree that the bumper must be chrome. But it's still hard to tell on those black and white pictures. of only there was a way to bring them back in color:-)

I will take contact with the kemperinck shop, they might have some information if it was build there instead. or at least some information on the roof structure and windows.

the primer color you talk about, is that the L62 they talk about on barndoor.dk? is that the same color ambulances did came with?

Thank you for helping me out! this is actually verry exciting for me:-) It's fun learning more and more bit by bit.

_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:26 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

barnelicious wrote:
I will ask my uncle if he knows what my grand grandfather did for a living. I realy don't know.


when I look at him in the newspaper photo, that sure is a mighty man with big arms and wearing what appears to be some kind of a work coat, possibly even smeared with some grease in front. so if he wasn't a butcher, it would pretty much hint at being kind of mechanic, blacksmith or the like.

can you take a more legible scan of the newspaper report, please ?
_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:33 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

BTW just to entertain this thread a bit, here is a chrome bumper BD. It was one of the first transporters delivered to 4711 parfume company in Cologne in primer. custom paint job and chrome bumper added. it is one of my alltime favorite Barndoors

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
exotic plants
Samba Member


Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 298
Location: God's Zoo
exotic plants is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:25 pm    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649308&highlight=coachbuilt

Halfway down the first page is this same picture and article.

Not sure if it helps or not?
_________________
1956 Beetle - Jungle Green.
Parts needed to complete:
Front driver side fender.
Rear driver side fender.
Cash waiting.
------------------------------------------------------------
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2019 7:33 pm    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

You're verry right, it's a long time ago now. But i Always think, asking doesn't hurt. and 2 peaple Always know more then one:-)
i also looked the post on vintage BD pictures a few times, saw verry great stuff but never my grand grandfathers van..
having a picture of it in an other angle would be so helpfull since i would have known the license plate then. I asked the whole family, even all the ones who live in new zealand if they have anything in an old album but no succes till now.
thanks for the update on the colors also, so it seems like it doesn't have the Original color on it at all then i supose? I post some better pictures below so maybe we could start guesing what color it had to be:-)
maybe a fun fact: the picture in the newspaper(the evening post apr 55) is taken in NZ, so that means he's even on vacation in his working clothes:-) must have been a hard working man:-)
I hope you can all read the article now. it's in fact a cool story, have fun reading!
the parfume bus looks great! is that a black and white picture they add the color on? it looks like a bit like a drawing to me. is that a '50 since it hasn't got the upper 3 vents? I love the ones with the old advertisements on them! they have just that more story to tell. those days must have been great! the 25hp doing all that hard work.
to Exotic Plants: cool to see all those coachbuild busses! there where a lot cool creations back in the days! sure everything helps! the pictures where taken from a post we did several year ago asking if someone knew the van. you see, I never give up:-)
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
nzvwfan
Samba Member


Joined: January 07, 2006
Posts: 145
Location: New Zealand
nzvwfan is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:36 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

There was an article about this in a NZ VW history book and it said he left the bus here and the author has no idea where its located and fears it was scrapped
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 3:01 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

hi nzvwfan,
this is some great information! not the fact that it been scrapped, but at least knowing where it went/stayed..
actually i could believe that it stayed in NZ since they had a big amount of trouble getting it there in the first place.
the van came with the dominion monarch to NZ a few months later then my family had arrived(i think it was april '55). they also had some trouble getting the van on the road since they had trouble with some papers and the steering wheel being on the wrong side. I heard the story that at the end they needed to put a NZ licence plate on it to drive it around there.

Is there any chance you could find back the article? Was it a long time ago? That would be so great!

thanks!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
nzvwfan
Samba Member


Joined: January 07, 2006
Posts: 145
Location: New Zealand
nzvwfan is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:13 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

I no longer have the book but there's a few kiwis on this page I'm sure one of them will post it up
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:15 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

that would be great! It's verry exciting knowing there is another article on it we didn't know about! I keep searching on google and even YouTube for NZ vw history books but no results till now. Maybe i should contact a NZ vw club?

Did you read it a long time ago? And do you remember it had pictures of the van in it? And was it a big book or maybe more like a magazine?

I've been thinking this over, it's kind of strange my grandgrandfather left the van just like that after the long and probably expencive build after using it only 4-5 months.

I should ask all the living family in NZ out again for information or maybe come to do research myself and say hi to all the family. unfortunatly many had passed away allready.

to all NZ BD fans: please check out your VW library for the article, would be so great:-)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
djfordmanjack
Samba Member


Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2102
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
djfordmanjack is online now 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:15 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

for your consideration. the black and white newspaper and photo print do not do your color investigation any favor. From my own experience in historic research it is very hard to tell colors from those. The van could easily have been dove blue on the lower portions. it often shows as a very light shade on b&w pics. try searching the vintage photo thread for reference.
Also as your uncle was referring it to as 'white'. I know the van was fairly new back then. but those laquer (baked enamel) paints easily chalk. see my 55 panel before/after, that I just sprayed and cleaned with oil to get back the og doveblue. that is not white paint, that is just chalked and faded og doveblue paint ! Who knows what several months of ship transfer and parking in harbor docks and out in the sun could do to doveblue paint.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Hotrods, Fords, Veedubs and Triumph Twins !
Barndoor + Kohlruss Coachbuilt and Oval afficionado

52 Barndoor DLX Coachbuild project
55 Wolfsburg panel project, og paint Taubenblau L31
62 Dickholmer, custom color Seeblau L360
63 1500 Notch, og paint Rubin Rot L456
67 1500 Käfer, og paint Lotus weiß L282 w/red interior
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:23 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

Wow, crazy how you got back the Original paint!
It's indeed verry hard to tell on the b&w pictures what color it was. I even saw different pictures of for example dove blue vans wich are sometimes dark and sometimes lighter on those pictures. You just can't tell i supose.

After you saw the better pictures, could you agree I see a two-tone in it? and the chrome pumper? or is that just me that want to see that?Smile

And what about the doorhandle on the cargo door? Am I right not seeing any and just seeing a key or is this a kind of hallucination? if i'm not mistaking the earlie ones didn't have one on panels is that right?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
EverettB Premium Member
Administrator


Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69733
Location: Phoenix Metro
EverettB is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:31 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

barnelicious wrote:
And what about the doorhandle on the cargo door? Am I right not seeing any and just seeing a key or is this a kind of hallucination? if i'm not mistaking the earlie ones didn't have one on panels is that right?

Yes, early Panels used a church key - no handle.

It looks like it might be this barndoor church key:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Opening (No handle)
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Facebook Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
barnelicious
Samba Member


Joined: November 16, 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Belgium
barnelicious is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 10:48 am    Post subject: Re: how to track a BD vin number with only a little information Reply with quote

that's some great information everett! Do you know till what year they did this? or chassis number maybe? so maybe i could shorten the vin number list i made:-)
the mirror arm makes it not a verry earlie one from what i learned till now, but the church key makes it an earlie bus again? till now i have end 52 till end 53 on my list.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Split Bus - Barndoor All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.