Syncro: Driving with an axle removed...

[tjet]

Is it possible to remove a front or rear axle on a Syncro and still operate it? If so, how would you do it and what parts and tools would be needed?

This would be for a field repair / limp home situation. I'm building a recovery kit to keep in my van.

Cheers.

[nsmal]

Front axle... yes I believe it wouldn't cause any driveability issues, but getting them out physically would be a huge pain on the side of the road. You have to blow apart the suspension components to get them out (I think).

Rear axle... maybe if you engaged the rear locker and drove it very gently. I haven't removed the rear axles yet so I can't speak to the tools required there.

[candyman]

Rear axle no problem, ive done it. The front however, you will need at least the outer cv house to keep the wheel bearing hub intact. I have an old junk front outer cv joint housing for just this purpose that i carry in my spare parts

[nsmal]

candyman.. did you lock the rear diff?

I just had a thought on the front diff. If you only pull one then there’s a chance the one side would just spin the side gears inside the differential mechanism instead of the whole assembly, which is not ideal. It would probably be fine for a short distance but I wouldn’t want to drive like that continuously at freeway speeds.

[davideric9]

I've driven 85 miles on the freeway with only one rear axle installed. Locked the rear and it was fine. I had a decoupler and solid shaft at the time. So I could choose between front or rear wheel drive. Front wheel drive: unlock the rear and engage the decoupler. Opposite for rear wheel drive. I could feel the difference in handling between the two. Front felt more stable than one wheel drive in the rear. No damage to the drive train (that I know of).
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1987 Syncro Westfalia, stock (bought 1994)
1986 Syncro Westfalia SVX, 3 knob (bought 2008)
1987 Westfalia (bought 2010)
1988 Wolfsburg GL (bought 2012)

[bsrad]

I'll try and not make this a too long of a story, but last year we were down screwing around in SE Utah and I (made a bad choice) snapped one of my rear axles. Had a cheapy flaps replacement with us and threw in on. But the CV failed in 80 miles and destroyed the shaft in the process.

It was Memorial day weekend so we had no luck finding another cheap replacement, so we pointed it North as we had to be back to work on Tuesday. For 1000 miles I alternated from running the locker in the rear, to coupled w/o rear locker, to coupled w/ rear locked. Checked the temps (by hand) every 150 miles or so and all seemed good.

The only thing I noticed was that when I ran with only the rear locked, the output seal started to weep transmission oil on the side that the axle was still driving from. All I could figure was there must have been some kind of unbalanced torque that was being put on/in the transmission. You certainly can feel that unbalanced torque under acceleration. Once the new axle was installed, it has never shown any more signs of an oil weep.
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Bill

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1987 Syncro Westy
1967 OG Single Cab
1976 FJ40

[hans j]

[candyman]

[tjet]

Candyman, maybe the front diff alone was moving your van along to get you home? Seems like the coupling would activate in your scenario, right? Even without lockers... I broke the right rear outer CV in my '77 bus. The van would not move - lots of noise though. I initially thought I broke the transmission. Glad it was only a CV joint.

I do have a couple of old syncro outer CV's for the front. I think I will keep one (with my Sodo hub tool) in my kit.

[Sodo]

Print this pic and put it in your Bentley in sec 40.23

You can see how if you drove the van with no front CV axle, the bearing/hub would just "fall apart" in a short distance. I'm thinking like within 5 feet. Especially if you turned or went over a bump. You could put a large bolt in there, but keep in mind the original "bolt" (the stub axle) is torqued to 258 ft-lbs to hold the bearing together.

On both hubs (front and rear) the stub axle and nut holds the bearing together. The rear axle unbolts from the stub axle, but it takes a lot of effort and special tools to separate the front stub from the drive axle.

You could carry a used front stub axle.

Probably better to just carry a complete front CV axle cuz wherever you busted a front axle, you[re really stuck now and may need it to get out.

Here's a diagram of the rear hub too.

I drew these for Samba discussions. I drew the rear hub 'cuz we were discussing the myth of "rear bearing hub preload".
The myth "came about" in spite of the rear hub diagram (in the Bentley).

They are not "complete" and there could be errors.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[tjet]

Sodo, I posted a question to Candyman above, but I'd like to hear your input as well

If you broke (or removed) a rear axle or CV, will the VC detect this as a traction issue and activate the front diff (even a non-locker Syncro)?

[Sodo]

[tjet]

So, that's something a stock Syncro can do that a Jeep can't do (with open diffs).

[Steve M.]

If the cage breaks and all the ball bearings fall out leaving only the inner race on the shaft you can drive it. The inner race is protecting the splines on the shaft and the outer race keeps the axle in place...makes some noise, but a lot less noise then you would think driving with the locker engaged on the rear. In fact, around town no noise 90% of the time.
Not something I would do at freeway speeds, but low speed on a trail or around town it does work.
Sounds blasphemous, but it is do-able if you do not have the tools or place the safely change it out right away.
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This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.

There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them.

[candyman]

[Steve M.]

[Sodo]

[tjet]

So, in a nutshell, in a non-locker Syncro, you can remove up to 2 axle assemblies and still operate it (Both front or both rear), or a locker or Peloquin equipped Syncro, (front-rear-both) you can remove 3 axles depending on locker location in a worst-case scenario and still limp it home. Nice.

[pbrown]

[mackaymanx]

You can cut down an old outer front CV to make it easier to carry for front shaft removal.

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