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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:08 am Post subject: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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https://www.jbugs.com/product/3552.html
My daughter's '79 vert has solid pans from the seat pedestal forward it seems. The stuff back from there is...bad. I can't tell if these are long enough to do the trick. Trying to avoid buying full pans if we don't need to but I don't want to order these just to find out they don't fit and we'll need to patch anyway.
I'd almost rather buy full pans and cut to size...but obviously would like to spend less if these will work (there are left and right versions).
Pics of the passenger side pan...haven't uncovered the driver side but I am pretty sure it's similar from looking underneath.
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2017 Posts: 1966 Location: WV
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:51 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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The best advice is to call wherever you are looking to buy from and ask them the specific brand of sheet metal part they will be shipping to you. If they 'don't know' or won't say. I'd pass.
There are decent sheet metal manufactuers and there are terrible ones. Floor pans need to be nice, thick replacements. Most are not OG thickness.
I'd advise shopping around, call jbugs, Wolfsburg west, pierside parts, cip1- ask what brand they have. See if you can get them to weight the part. Heavier = thicker = good.
Also a good comparison thread on the vast differences in thickness, stamping, and metal quality (it's on heater channels, but you get the idea)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=503306&highlight=heater+channel _________________ 1973 Standard Beetle
1600DP AK case
Solex 34PICT3 Carb
Bosch DVDA 205AJ Distributor |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:27 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW wrote: |
The best advice is to call wherever you are looking to buy from and ask them the specific brand of sheet metal part they will be shipping to you. If they 'don't know' or won't say. I'd pass.
There are decent sheet metal manufactuers and there are terrible ones. Floor pans need to be nice, thick replacements. Most are not OG thickness.
I'd advise shopping around, call jbugs, Wolfsburg west, pierside parts, cip1- ask what brand they have. See if you can get them to weight the part. Heavier = thicker = good.
Also a good comparison thread on the vast differences in thickness, stamping, and metal quality (it's on heater channels, but you get the idea)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=503306&highlight=heater+channel |
I have seen that thread before...really good comparison!
I was looking at just "raw" steel sheet-metal to patch with...but all I could find locally was either 22 or 24 gauge or 16 gauge. I bought a small welding kit that supposedly "goes up to 18 gauge thickness"...so I'm trying to stay with 18 gauge. I know that there's not THAT much difference between 16 and 18 but since I've never welding anything in my life up to this point I thought I'd abide by the recommendations if I'm able.
Most of the floor pans I've seen are some thickness between 18 and 20 without specifically calling it out (but stated in "mm" of thickness which lands between those two specifications). I do plan to replace my floor pans completely (in my '71) but I'm not planning to do the complete overhaul of her '79 until after mine is completely done AND she wants to drive hers in the meantime...so patching is the best option currently.
I'll check around...just wondered if anyone has actually tried to use the "quarter pans" in the link I posted in the OP on a '79 (or any Super between '73 - '79). Seems like they will not cover everything I need...but I also haven't found where I can get the exact measurements of those quarter pans. |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:36 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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It appears that the back of that pan has previously been replaced. I just had that rear section done, and I don’t believe that the entire piece goes all the way to the back of the pedestal. Besides, certain areas around your pedestal look suspect also.
I ended up having to replace a portion of the front of the pan, also. This included having to replace the pedestal, too, because the bottom of it was showing substructure rust, as well as the area where it attached to the pan. Fortunately, Cipi1 carries Kaferland pedestals that are exactly the same as the originals. But be careful if you order one because the left side and right are different, and have different order numbers.
Eventually, I would have been better off having the entire pan replaced, but at least I can still say 30% of my pan on the right is original .
Tim _________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6612 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:37 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Check with whom ever you purchase them from. Ask them what gauge. There are quality replacements with the correct gauge made. Tell them you want original thickness. _________________ www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:39 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Tim Donahoe wrote: |
It appears that the back of that pan has previously been replaced. I just had that rear section done, and I don’t believe that the entire piece goes all the way to the back of the pedestal. Besides, certain areas around your pedestal look suspect also. |
Yep...it's definitely been patched already...just poorly and obviously very rusty again.
Tim Donahoe wrote: |
I ended up having to replace a portion of the front of the pan, also. This included having to replace the pedestal, too, because the bottom of it was showing substructure rust, as well as the area where it attached to the pan. Fortunately, Cipi1 carries Kaferland pedestals that are exactly the same as the originals. But be careful if you order one because the left side and right are different, and have different order numbers.
Eventually, I would have been better off having the entire pan replaced, but at least I can still say 30% of my pan on the right is original .
Tim |
Is it possible to replace the floor pans without separating the body from the chassis? I think the body bolts go through part of the pan doesn't it? I'll have to look this up again. |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:40 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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heimlich wrote: |
Check with whom ever you purchase them from. Ask them what gauge. There are quality replacements with the correct gauge made. Tell them you want original thickness. |
Thanks...I'll do my best to make sure this is the case. |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:42 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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I just found an ad on eBay. The rear quarter pan is 26 inches long. 22 gauge.
Tim _________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:47 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Tim Donahoe wrote: |
I just found an ad on eBay. The rear quarter pan is 26 inches long. 22 gauge.
Tim |
Nice! Thanks for that!!
That's too short for what is needed and too thin for my taste/comfort.
I guess I'll look into full pan replacement. I'm pretty sure cpi1 has some decent pans... their stated thickness is right around 18ga iirc. |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:50 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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In case you need one, these a good German pedastals.
Tim
_________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6612 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 11:43 am Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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You can also take a full pan and just cut out the part you need. _________________ www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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H2OSB Samba Member
Joined: April 14, 2013 Posts: 1292 Location: Modesto, CA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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I, personally, like these guys for any sheet metal, pan included www.mtmfg.com. they're not the only ones, but they carry the thickest pans available on the market(wolfsburg west cries the same pans).
H2OSB _________________ (o\_i_/o) I'm not a vegetarian because I love animals, I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants. |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76937 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:34 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Whatever you do it will be better than seeing the battery held up by license plates under it. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:47 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Tim Donahoe wrote: |
In case you need one, these a good German pedastals |
Thanks!
There is some rust-through on the rightmost side of the passenger side pedestal...but overall it seems very solid so I think I can just patch what's there. The patch jobs on both sides of the rear half of the pans is pathetic...I guess it was a good try by someone...and apparently that helped it pass inspection in NJ at some point...but I am going to have to rip it out and replace it with something.
I did notice the rails on the passenger side are rusted to the point they need replaced too...:/
heimlich wrote: |
You can also take a full pan and just cut out the part you need. |
This is probably what I will end up doing...just trying to save her some money.
H2OSB wrote: |
I, personally, like these guys for any sheet metal, pan included www.mtmfg.com. they're not the only ones, but they carry the thickest pans available on the market(wolfsburg west cries the same pans). |
Thanks for the link...I've seen them before in my other part browsing...I'll check them out again.
Glenn wrote: |
Whatever you do it will be better than seeing the battery held up by license plates under it. |
LOL yeah I kinda feel like that's the setup she has now...it's pretty flimsy back there...and on the driver side they didn't even weld...they screwed down some metal into the existing stuff. |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76937 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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beanlover wrote: |
This is probably what I will end up doing...just trying to save her some money. |
Watch out, sometimes trying to save a few dollars will cost more in labor and lost time if you need more metal. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:18 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Glenn wrote: |
Watch out, sometimes trying to save a few dollars will cost more in labor and lost time if you need more metal. |
Agreed...I actually found what I think will be great...but it's not quite as thick as I would like:
https://www.mtmfg.com/part/view/quarter-floor-pan-...95+13+76+4 (thanks for the recommendation H2OSB!! These are perfect-sized!)
There's also one for the driver side. These come with the seat rails which is good for the passenger side...and for the driver side too...but it will make it harder to get the original ones out I think. Hopefully I can join these together well with what is in there. I don't (yet) want to lift the body from the chassis to replace the full pans (future work on this car will include removing the body...but this is just to make it road-worthy asap). |
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BIGMIKEY Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2007 Posts: 1105 Location: North East Pennsylvania
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:30 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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Be aware that the link in your first post is the wrong year pan. '72 and older. You need '73 and newer.
Mike T
Ah, I see you have the link that H2OSB posted. I was researching when you posted. Great. _________________ BIGMIKEY
Deserter Series 1 project.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=787047&highlight=
1973 Beetle Driver, Marina Blue.
Last edited by BIGMIKEY on Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:37 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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The 20 gage is adequate for a section of a floor pan. I wouldn’t want the whole thing in 20, but a section still leaves room for the original 18 gauge.
Basically, I ended up with 20 gauge for the battery area (I mentioned previously that it was 22 gauge, but once I got to thinking about it, it was 20) Then I retained about a foot or so of the original 18 gauge, then, a section of an old (but still good OEM pan), then about a foot or so of the original.
It’s a puzzle, but the parts end up being a solid sum.
If that last pan section you showed is too short, weld in some other metal to make it up. Be certain that the pedestal is solid and on solid metal, though. Remember Fred Flintstone .
Tim _________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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green1303 Samba Member
Joined: February 04, 2014 Posts: 748 Location: Alexandria, VA
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beanlover Samba Member
Joined: December 18, 2018 Posts: 370 Location: PA
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: Anyone have experience with these on late-model supers? |
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BIGMIKEY wrote: |
Be aware that the link in your first post is the wrong year pan. '72 and older. You need '73 and newer.
Mike T
Ah, I see you have the link that H2OSB posted. I was researching when you posted. Great. |
Yeah...thanks for pointing that out anyway!
The write-up on jbugs said folks have reported putting them on newer models with some success...but the link H2OSB posted is really good.
Tim Donahoe wrote: |
The 20 gage is adequate for a section of a floor pan. I wouldn’t want the whole thing in 20, but a section still leaves room for the original 18 gauge.
Basically, I ended up with 20 gauge for the battery area (I mentioned previously that it was 22 gauge, but once I got to thinking about it, it was 20) Then I retained about a foot or so of the original 18 gauge, then, a section of an old (but still good OEM pan), then about a foot or so of the original.
It’s a puzzle, but the parts end up being a solid sum.
If that last pan section you showed is too short, weld in some other metal to make it up. Be certain that the pedestal is solid and on solid metal, though. Remember Fred Flintstone .
Tim |
They were...the ones from mtmfg are plenty long enough...and I do agree that 20 gauge back there should be sufficient...although I would still rather have 18ga...Once we redo the car from the bottom-up I will get better pans.
green1303 wrote: |
Kaeferland is the only manufacturer of 18 gauge floor pan repair sections for 1973-up. I have only seen their full-length pans for sale by shops in the U.S., but Kaeferland does ship to the U.S. |
NICE! Thanks for these...I will save that site to my bookmark folder for bugs. |
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