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Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project
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VW_Jimbo Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:51 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

EVfun wrote:
VW_Jimbo wrote:
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Hey! Don't put Naval Jelly on that. The car might disappear. Laughing


Too funny! But so true. I should have lead with that picture, than the pan missing!

Thanks for the laugh!
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TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Update time. Not too much progress in the “fixing” part. But managed to purchase a few parts this weekend.

Got up at 5:30am on Saturday and drove 294 miles up to Ron Burgundy, to pick up a split case transmission and a few other parts. Got home at 12:45am on Sunday. My truck broke down in Bakersfield. Diesel was pouring out from behind the engine. I tried finding the issue, but did not have the tools to disassemble it on the off ramp. Ended up getting towed to a repair shop, which had told me they worked on a Chevy diesels. But after showing up with my truck, they told me they do not and referred me to another mechanic.

Got the truck back on the tow truck and drove another 5 miles to a shop that works on Chevy diesel trucks. The tow truck driver drove me to a Budget rental truck lot and I rented a 10 person van. I then drove back to my truck and spent an hour unloading the tools and materials into the van. Had to leave my ladders and plumbing hoses, valves and black pipe fittings, but managed to get the rest of it into the van. I was going to call it a day, call Ron and tell him I was driving back home. But that just is not me. Not the way I was raised. I finish what I start. That lesson was beat into me as a kid. And I am thankful for it!

Ron was cool with me showing up later, so I drove the remaining 3 plus hours to his place. Well worth it! Got the transmission I went up for, along with a few other items.....

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Like another 36hp engine, set of heater boxes, front and rear engine tins, fuel pump tin, rear brake drums, seal housings and backing plates. Thank you Ron! By the way, Ron has a huge selection of VW parts. One of the largest stock piles I have seen!

I combed through Ron’s stockpile and wished I had been there earlier. Maybe next time!

Spotted these on my way over to the 5 freeway, on the 152. Looked like a 54 being followed by a 58. Really cool to see out on a highway!

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Today, I disassembled the 36hp engine and found a burnt valve and a flattened lobe on the camshaft. Odd pair of issues. I also cleaned the crude off of the split transmission.

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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

VW_Jimbo wrote:
Going forward, I will always weld in braces!


Wink




Nice going.

This one is moving right along..! Applause
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
VW_Jimbo wrote:
Going forward, I will always weld in braces!


Wink




Nice going.

This one is moving right along..! Applause


Thank you!
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TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Today, I was in the garage, all day. So, I got one of the pans welded in! Feels so nice to make progress, but I also found another item that I will need to address.

So, I knew that there was a mouse that had made a home in the tunnel. I started there, by pulling the seat cushion pieces out of the tunnel. I then vacuumed it out. During this process, I found a shitload more rust! Damn it! Looking like I will need to remove the bottom of the tunnel. I need to run all new steel tubes. They are rusted and I can see several missing segments!

Here’s some pics, as everyone likes looking at progress, including me!

First, since I do not have the space to have a dedicated pan rotisserie, I use saw horses.

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I then cleaned out the tunnel and tried photographing the broken tubing.

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And the big chunks that covered the hose opening.

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After that, I checked the fit of the pan. Fit very well, except for rear tunnel segment, where it rises up. Got to manipulate that a small amount, but it all went smooth.

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Punched out the plug holes and removed the primer from the soon to be welded .

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Set the new pan in place. Triple checked the dimensions. Spot on. Then plug welded the pan to the chassis.

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Ground the high points of the welds down, applied some seam sealer, being sure to inject it down into the joint between the plugs, and then primed it all.

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Then, I started in on the accessories. I removed the jack point, the pedal cluster stop bracket and the seat rail. I then chopped it up into smaller pieces and threw it away.
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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

I wanted to highlight an easy was to remove broken off bolts, which are welded in their threaded tombs.

The pedal bracket bolts were pretty rusted. One of those two bolts came out. The other one sheared off, right at the pan nut. Almost level with it. So, what can one do, in a situation like this? Allow me to explain, one method, which I have used many times and will be abusing during this restoration!

I started to remove the bracket, note the spot welds that have been drilled out, but thought that it would be easier if I first removed the broken bolt.

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First, get a steel nut. Not galvanized, as that when welded is bad to breath.

I sand the top of the broken bolt, so nice fresh steel is available. Then I set the nut on the bolt and twist it on. It does not need to catch the threads, just needs to lock up on whatever is left to grab onto.

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Once it is locked up on the bolt, I take my welder and stick the wire all the way into the nut. I then pull the trigger and keep the gun in the same position, more or less, for several seconds. Long enough to get the nut filled and the bolt red hot.

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Then, using the closet tool around me that fits, I remove the stud.

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Like magic!
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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Had another day to myself! Two days in a row, crazy! Seems like there is always something that needs to be done. And that thing is not the Bug.

But, it is this weekend!

So, onto the passenger side!

Decided to get a peek in the torsion tubes before going to much further. If they were completely rusted out internally, I would cut the car up, sell the parts and buy another Oval. But turns out they are in okay shape. I feel comfortable moving forward!

So, to get a look inside the torsion tube, one has to remove the torsion bar and suspension trailing arm. Not a big deal, but I know that there are many myths about it. I had a guy tell me, at one point, that it could chop your arm off. Yeah, right. He definitely never got his hands dirty.

Removed the cover bolts on both sides.

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Spiders and egg sacks!

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Had to scrap that shit out of there!

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Pull the donuts off and then I wire tied each group to themselves, then into a zip lock bag.

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Then with the big pry bar, I pry the arm out past the stop.

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There it is!

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Before removing the plate and bar from the car, I take the rest position angle, for each side.

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I write the number down on the tube, immediately and snap a picture of it.

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Then I pull the bar and cover.

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I take my alphabet punch set and hit each arm with a R and a L.

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Next up is the passenger side pan.

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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Out of curiosity....does anyone know why the drivers side seat rails are 3/4 of an inch taller on the drivers side? The new rails look like a quality reproduction, but they sent two sets of the same size. The size they sent matches the passenger side perfectly, but is to short for the drivers side.

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Also, the jack points are a little different than the later ones. Just thought I would get it documented.

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And how have you guys addressed the WW pans where the pedal stop bolts weld in? There is a large indentation that gets in the way of placing it.

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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 6:56 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Nice thread to follow and can't wait to see the body metal work starting!

If I can give an advice... start giving the choke cable a good load of your penetrating oil. This damn cable is often stuck, so the longer it can penetrate, the better your chances are, taht you don't have to open the tunnel or install a new cable... you can ask a lot of fellows here on samba for their creative ideas. I ended up with breaking the old tube inside and running a flexible tube through the tunnel.

PS: every early oval deserves to be saved! Although sometimes I asked myself what I'm doing here in the last couple of months when I worked on the 54, my very first car Smile
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:59 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Thanks 56samba! The choke cable was actually easy to pull out. I think that the tubing is missing from the tunnel! Rust!

The next step with this is to R&R the steel tubing within the tunnel. I flipped the pan over last night to have a look. Looks like I need a new tunnel cover, but am unsure where to get one. Hoping someone here has a source and feels like sharing.
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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:20 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Here are the correct jack points

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1315752

Gab-fab made some SWEET tunnel covers for a ghia on FB. He makes panels by hand at $70 per hour
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:07 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

""And how have you guys addressed the WW pans where the pedal stop bolts weld in? There is a large indentation that gets in the way of placing it.""

Must be modified.
Looks like Wolfsburg West sells the same pans for different years.
Only difference are the seat tracks.

The KlassicFab floor pans 53-57 are the correct ones without indentations.
https://www.klassicfab.com/product-category/type-1-beetle/floor-pans-type-1-beetle/

Regards.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:16 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

AlteWagen wrote:
Here are the correct jack points

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1315752

Gab-fab made some SWEET tunnel covers for a ghia on FB. He makes panels by hand at $70 per hour


Thank you! I knew these had to be out in the marketplace somewhere! That price beats manufacturing them myself!
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There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Ovally wrote:
""And how have you guys addressed the WW pans where the pedal stop bolts weld in? There is a large indentation that gets in the way of placing it.""

Must be modified.
Looks like Wolfsburg West sells the same pans for different years.
Only difference are the seat tracks.

The KlasscFab floor pans 53-57 are the correct ones without indentations.
https://www.klassicfab.com/product-category/type-1-beetle/floor-pans-type-1-beetle/

Regards.


Thanks. I did look at the CF pans but wanted to put my money into parts not shipping. WW is a 30 minute drive from me! Super easy!

I did buy the CF heater channels. That was money well spent, as modifying the WW channels was going to consume a ton of my time, plus I was going to have to source the vent opening.

Thank you! Any thought on the bottom tunnel cover? That is the next hurdle.
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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 12:29 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

VW_Jimbo wrote:
Ovally wrote:
""And how have you guys addressed the WW pans where the pedal stop bolts weld in? There is a large indentation that gets in the way of placing it.""

Must be modified.
Looks like Wolfsburg West sells the same pans for different years.
Only difference are the seat tracks.

The KlasscFab floor pans 53-57 are the correct ones without indentations.
https://www.klassicfab.com/product-category/type-1-beetle/floor-pans-type-1-beetle/

Regards.


Thanks. I did look at the CF pans but wanted to put my money into parts not shipping. WW is a 30 minute drive from me! Super easy!

I did buy the CF heater channels. That was money well spent, as modifying the WW channels was going to consume a ton of my time, plus I was going to have to source the vent opening.

Thank you! Any thought on the bottom tunnel cover? That is the next hurdle.


I would try to find a donor chassis to take the tunnel cover from... maybe placing a WTB ad? Can imagine you might need other parts from it too?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 8:28 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

In the past I thought Mika sold the center tunnel repair piece so I sent off an email last night and got this response:

Virtanen wrote:
Hi Tony,

I haven't offered them before, but in 2 weeks I'm making the first test
parts.

regards,
Mika


I would shoot him an email with pics of the section you need to make sure all the details are present.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

AlteWagen wrote:
In the past I thought Mika sold the center tunnel repair piece so I sent off an email last night and got this response:

Virtanen wrote:
Hi Tony,

I haven't offered them before, but in 2 weeks I'm making the first test
parts.

regards,
Mika


I would shoot him an email with pics of the section you need to make sure all the details are present.


Thank you! Thought I was going to have to fab it up myself. That would be days of pounding!
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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:25 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

56samba wrote:
I would try to find a donor chassis to take the tunnel cover from... maybe placing a WTB ad? Can imagine you might need other parts from it too?


I thought about that, but just assumed that I would have to purchase the entire pan. Maybe I will. But seriously considering just fabbing my own. Might be quicker........ I know it will not be cheaper!
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Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:18 am    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

So, yesterday I decided to gain better access to the conduit area of the tunnel. Plus I need to be able to accurately measure the needed lengths of each of the required tubes and their sizes. I was also curious to the condition of the inside of the tunnel and needed to know if it was worth saving.

Spent the morning reviewing different websites showing how each individual had a “ better” approach to replacing the conduit runs. There was a thread on tS that the guy fabricated a cart/jig out of steel I beams, removed the full tunnel cover, fabricated up a new cluster of conduits and then inserted them into the tunnel. He install the original cover! Awesome, but that looks like too much work to me!

I sat and did some thinking, staring at the pan. I have rarely been a follower, and I often times can find a more efficient method or means to the final endpoint. So, I drew up several drawings, verifying with a tape measure, if it was possible. I finally landed on opening up the rear tunnel section. It is a double whammy, as this spot had a few rust through holes on it!

Down the VIN cover plate hole we go........! Well, not really, but it is a great analogy to Alice in Wonderland, and the psychedelic findings!

Got the pan back up on saw horses and did some planning. Decided to start in on the pedal cluster deformation, which required 2 weld nuts instead of the single one.

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Cut a rectangle, well more like a 4 sided polygon, from the previously removed pan. Got to cut and trim it several times, so I could minimize the impact on the stamping.

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Then traced it out, onto the pan.

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Here are my cut to lines.

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And here I am cutting it out! I cut out to the outside of the marker line.

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4 cuts later! Note that I drilled the corners out, to keep the stress down.

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Removed it completely and took that piece over to the old pan. Marked that piece out and cut to the middle of the marker line. That way, this pice is a 1/16th smaller on each side, to allow for easy placement and welding. I then wire wheeled the edges of both parts.

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Took some magnets and set it into place - perfect!

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And, here it is welded in. I started just tacking it in place but had to resort to beads to get better penetration. A little fat on the beads but it penetrated all the way!

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And all ground down flush!

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I then primered it after wiping it down with Vinegar.

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Then, flipped it over to clean up the bottom.

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I did not get nuts welded to the bottom, because I discovered I was out of 8mm nuts. I did have 5/16 nuts, but that would be so wrong. I have plenty of work to do anyways.

Onto interior exploration!
I decided to cut one “X” segment out, to just have a look inside and determine the needs of the project. Cut the steel across the tunnel, just the top layer.

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Then drilled out the spot welds and chiseled it off of the tunnel.

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And the reveal!!!!!!

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Inspected the conduits and decided I needed a better view. Moved on to the steel plate between the rear forks. I noticed it also had a few rust holes in it, so getting two tasks done with one patch! That ain’t going to happen more than one time! Murphy is always running around causing problems - right?

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By the way the steel at this point is a hair greater than 14 gauge. Scraped off the under coating.

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Then cut out another rectangular section.

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Look at the backside rust!

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And the tunnel shots. See those two heater disjointed conduits.

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And then pictures down into the center tunnel section.

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_________________
Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Jimmy V’s 54 Oval Project Reply with quote

Got a few more hours in on the Bug!

Went through and measured all of the cable conduits, so I could order a few new ones.

Clutch cable was first.
Tube outside and inside diameter.

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Heater cable tubes.
Tube outside and inside diameter.

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Fuel line.
Tube outside and inside diameter.

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Choke tubing.
Tube outside and inside diameter.

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Throttle cable tubing.
Tube outside and inside diameter.

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_________________
Jimbo

There is never enough time to do it right the first time, but all the time necessary the second time!

TDCTDI wrote:
Basically, a whole bunch of fuckery to achieve a look.


67rustavenger wrote:
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! Smile
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