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baltik
Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2015
Posts: 440
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 Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:52 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| if you have sufficiently think copper busbar i don't see why you couldnt countersink, again the # of wires (and required thickness) is going to be different across different terminals so prepare to do a lot of trial and error.. |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:04 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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The area under the drivers seat swivel is appx 12.5" x 15" x 3".
The dimensions for the 135Ah set (6 7/8 x 6 1/8 high x <2" )
---->seems feasible to fit four cells flat on a plywood board.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
Last edited by Sodo on Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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dabaron
Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018
Posts: 2561
Location: Philly, mang
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| Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:52 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
The dimensions for the 135Ah set (6 7/8 x 6 1/8 high) appears feasible to fit in the flat configuration. |
how do you intend to keep the cells from bouncing and sliding around?
the resistance in the wire will be greater than the busbar resistance joining the two sets of two and as mentioned could present an issue balancing and also if drawing too much current (resistance will change with heat) it could have a negative effect on the cells. the general rule is to keep the jumpers equal in resistance and current capacity.
_________________
1991 Vanagon GL Camper
i had no idea i wanted to be a mechanic
"burnin oil and cookin coils" -- Destructo
BiWerks Design, LLC |
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ProspectiveOwnergon
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2020
Posts: 211
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:05 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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So I think the dumb question...Does this setup/system REQUIRE solar power generation, or can this be a leisure battery that draws off the alternator and LATER adapted for Solar?
My aux battery won't eclipse 5v, so time to upgrade and install an isolator. But figure, if buying a big battery, why not go 120-150 under the driver seat vs an interstate battery. |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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Solar is not required.
A LiFePo4 battery can suck your alternator dry. To charge from the alternator you’ll need a DC to DC converter to protect your alternator. And it charges the LiFePo4 correctly too.
If you use a 150Ah, it’s something like 6times the size of a 50Ah car battery, so you might be able to just charge it from 120v at home.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:04 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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Uh-oh....things just got serious
The van is no longer just a projects storage space.
Battery is 6 7/8 x 6 1/2 and posts are 1/4" high
150Ah battery posts are 1/4" below the top surface of the battery box.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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dabaron
Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018
Posts: 2561
Location: Philly, mang
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:15 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
Uh-oh....things just got serious. |
dammit, you paid less and got them faster. what the hell!
are you saying they are too tall and will be an issue?
_________________
1991 Vanagon GL Camper
i had no idea i wanted to be a mechanic
"burnin oil and cookin coils" -- Destructo
BiWerks Design, LLC |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:44 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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Saying things got serious..... because batteries in-hand means I have to buy all the rest of the monkeybusiness STAT!
PLUS install them.
There's appx 1/4" space for the buss bars.
ALL GOOD!
I'll check soon if the 150A can fit on a plywood board, forward under the seat. 
If not, I might still order the 135Ah set, then sell the 150Ah set after my Utah trip.
I ordered a used 130A Tribeca alternator (Current EJ25; 95Amp) thats another $90!
I ordered the 120A BMS + Bluetooth dongle on Amazon. (last one?) $125
I ordered the IQ4 module for LiFePo4 so the Iota can charge from 120vAC. $22
I hope this is OK, did I read somewhere that Iota has "other problems?"
Or does the IQ4 LiFePo4 dongle fix everything?
Now onto the DC-DC converter.
Should I choose the Renogy 60A DC-DC converter? $259 more!! That's about half the cost of a Truckfridge.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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ALIKA T3
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Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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ALIKA T3
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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baltik
Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2015
Posts: 440
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:27 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
Saying things got serious..... because batteries in-hand means I have to buy all the rest of the monkeybusiness STAT!
PLUS install them.
There's appx 1/4" space for the buss bars.
ALL GOOD!
I'll check soon if the 150A can fit on a plywood board, forward under the seat.
If not, I might still order the 135Ah set, then sell the 150Ah set after my Utah trip.
I ordered a used 130A Tribeca alternator (Current EJ25; 95Amp) thats another $90!
I ordered the 120A BMS + Bluetooth dongle on Amazon. (last one?) $125
I ordered the IQ4 module for LiFePo4 so the Iota can charge from 120vAC. $22
I hope this is OK, did I read somewhere that Iota has "other problems?"
Or does the IQ4 LiFePo4 dongle fix everything?
Now onto the DC-DC converter.
Should I choose the Renogy 60A DC-DC converter? $259 more!! That's about half the cost of a Truckfridge. |
It doesn't sounds like you are a very heavy user - I bet you'd be fine with 200w solar OR Renogy 20A DC/DC. I don't have first-hand experience, but I suspect 200w solar would actually be the more effective, don't ever have to think about it option. Obviously somewhat dependent on geography... |
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DigiMatrix
Samba Member
Joined: April 20, 2010
Posts: 450
Location: Up North Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:26 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Still waiting for mine - I'm jealous! At least I now have a proper Fedex shipping number that shows my address and not someone else's. Sodo ordered his batteries after me and mine look like they were supposed to ship from the US warehouse on Friday, but were too late for pickup. I hope Fedex picked them up today. |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:10 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| baltik wrote: |
| It doesn't sounds like you are a very heavy user - I bet you'd be fine with 200w solar OR Renogy 20A DC/DC. |
I might put a 50W panel ontop of my rocketbox for 150W total.
But a goal is to leave the rest of the roof "open".
Usage is truckfridge, propex, phones & LED lighting.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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ledogboy 
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2005
Posts: 578
Location: Scappoose, OR / Oakland, CA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:23 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
| baltik wrote: |
| It doesn't sounds like you are a very heavy user - I bet you'd be fine with 200w solar OR Renogy 20A DC/DC. |
I might put a 50W panel ontop of my rocketbox for 150W total.
But a goal is to leave the rest of the roof "open".
Usage is truckfridge, propex, phones & LED lighting. |
I have been doing the above with a 120 AH AGM for the last couple of years (albeit, with significant broken-downtime) with 100 watts of solar and alternator charging. I am going in the 150 AH LiPo4 direction, and will retain the permanent 100 watt solar panel on the roof, I will be adding an easy connection for a 100 watt flexible panel so that I can get sun whilst parked in shade, and the Renogy DC-DC charger/MPPT should take care of the rest. The difference between 120 AH AGM and 150 Lithium is kinda staggering...
_________________
1986 Westy Weekender
Now a full camper
1.8t Syncro conversion
Some people call him Maurice... |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:49 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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Finally had some time to check this out.
There's about 12.25 inches of width, therefore no space for your bus bars etc.
And you'd have to bend your battery-board.
It' ain't gonna work at all.
It does NOT appear feasible to fit four 135Ah batteries FLAT under the seat swivel.
If the van has no swivel this location may be possible.
===== July 4 edit - 4x 140Ah can fit ======
150Ah LiFePo4 flat under driver seat swivelectomy
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
Last edited by Sodo on Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:10 am; edited 2 times in total |
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dhaavers
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7757
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:13 am Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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- Dave
_________________
86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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ALIKA T3
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 12:32 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
Finally had some time to check this out.
There's about 12.25 inches of width, therefore no space for your bus bars etc.
And you'd have to bend your battery-board.
It' ain't gonna work at all.
It does NOT appear feasible to fit four 135Ah batteries FLAT under the seat swivel.
If the van has no swivel this location may be possible. |
What about my comment earlier that you seem to ignore? Can`t you put them on their narrow side in the box? You would have 174mm vertical but no lugs to touch the battery box lid.
_________________
Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:29 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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Ok now I understand- that is a great idea!
+ & - tetminals will be at top facing forward with lots of clearance!
A friend said to cut all the welds on the seat swivel, and make it bolt-on.
So I can put stuff in there such as the DC-DC converter.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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dabaron
Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018
Posts: 2561
Location: Philly, mang
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:32 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| Sodo wrote: |
Ok now I understand- that is a great idea!
+ & - tetminals will be at top facing forward with lots of clearance!
A friend said to cut all the welds on the seat swivel, and make it bolt-on.
So I can put stuff in there such as the DC-DC converter. |
the cells on their side was my next suggestion... i thought that might be the case and picked up an adhesive rubber pad from GW to put over the metal. i was thinking put them with the studs facing the rear and the cells toward the front, so they don't break free if you stop suddenly.
here is the Renogy DCC50S under the seat with the swivel removed. i don't think you can get it under there otherwise.
_________________
1991 Vanagon GL Camper
i had no idea i wanted to be a mechanic
"burnin oil and cookin coils" -- Destructo
BiWerks Design, LLC |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9618
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: New Record? 120 usable Amp Hours under Driver's seat |
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| dabaron wrote: |
| here is the Renogy DCC50S under the seat with the swivel removed. i don't think you can get it under there otherwise. |
OK I see where you cut the welds.
So did you delete the driver swivel?
Or does it bolt on?
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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