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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 9654
Location: Pearl River, NY
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 Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 10:19 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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That engine tarboard set which Marcdeb linked- I would jump on it. Your '59 seems to be missing the large pieces to the rear of the wheelwell humps, which the FS set has. Those cover up the large openings outboard of the engine compartment side trays, where you access your taillamps and their connections. Unless you had removed them many pages and months back. The FS set also has at least the right large piece's cardboard backer. The tarboards for those large areas rest against the cardboard pieces so that the tar/bitumen-based insulation does not soften from engine heat and fold inwards into that large hole. There should be a matching cardboard piece for the left large piece. But if missing, you can make one using the right one as pattern, using some thick posterboard or other easily obtainable material. Both the cardboard backer and the tarboard large pieces are held in place by those metal tabs welded to the body.
I had a set removed from a '70 parts Ghia for decades, and sent it to a friend who was restoring a '69 Ghia Coupe down in SC only a few years ago. Before I sent them, I cleaned them up well using SimpleGreen and a soft bristle kitchen scrubbing brush.
Also, you can use the large firewall piece from the FS set to cut out small sections and patch them into your car. On yours, the firewall piece is from a much later Ghia. The open areas on the left where you see body color are for the diagnostic plug (> ~ '71), and the long narrow slot to the lower left would be for the altitude compensation device. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12861
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 10:31 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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Hell, look on the inside under the carpet & see if the tarboard insulation is on the wheel tubs & firewall, if not, I can send you some not-so-period-correct ones out of the infamous Ghiapet. Possibly some of the nicest parts that were part of the car.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:00 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Rome wrote: |
That engine tarboard set which Marcdeb linked- I would jump on it. Your '59 seems to be missing the large pieces to the rear of the wheelwell humps, which the FS set has. Those cover up the large openings outboard of the engine compartment side trays, where you access your taillamps and their connections. Unless you had removed them many pages and months back. The FS set also has at least the right large piece's cardboard backer. The tarboards for those large areas rest against the cardboard pieces so that the tar/bitumen-based insulation does not soften from engine heat and fold inwards into that large hole. There should be a matching cardboard piece for the left large piece. But if missing, you can make one using the right one as pattern, using some thick posterboard or other easily obtainable material. Both the cardboard backer and the tarboard large pieces are held in place by those metal tabs welded to the body.
I had a set removed from a '70 parts Ghia for decades, and sent it to a friend who was restoring a '69 Ghia Coupe down in SC only a few years ago. Before I sent them, I cleaned them up well using SimpleGreen and a soft bristle kitchen scrubbing brush.
Also, you can use the large firewall piece from the FS set to cut out small sections and patch them into your car. On yours, the firewall piece is from a much later Ghia. The open areas on the left where you see body color are for the diagnostic plug (> ~ '71), and the long narrow slot to the lower left would be for the altitude compensation device. |
I see what you mean. Didn’t realize I was missing other pieces. I don’t see in the photos the cardboard backing you are talking about though. Also, a couple of pieces look pretty much permanently stained. I would get them if I thought they would clean up but don’t think there is any way to guarantee that.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:01 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
| Hell, look on the inside under the carpet & see if the tarboard insulation is on the wheel tubs & firewall, if not, I can send you some not-so-period-correct ones out of the infamous Ghiapet. Possibly some of the nicest parts that were part of the car. |
Thanks for the offer but I wouldn’t think of abusing the Ghiapet any more than it already has been.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12861
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:09 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Trylon wrote: |
| TDCTDI wrote: |
| Hell, look on the inside under the carpet & see if the tarboard insulation is on the wheel tubs & firewall, if not, I can send you some not-so-period-correct ones out of the infamous Ghiapet. Possibly some of the nicest parts that were part of the car. |
Thanks for the offer but I wouldn’t think of abusing the Ghiapet any more than it already has been. |
No abuse, I never put them back in. They're just sitting around because they were so nice that i couldn't bring myself to throw them out.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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KGCoupe
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2005
Posts: 3580
Location: Putting the "ill" and "annoy" in Illinois
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:14 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
| ... They're just sitting around because they were so nice that i couldn't bring myself to throw them out. |
I wonder just how many of us here in the Ghia forum - or the vintage automobile hobby in gerneral, for that matter - suffer from this same mentality. 
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lonotch
Samba Padrino
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 3304
Location: So. Cal. Oceanside GFK!
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:19 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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Bumper seal looks great Trylon.
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It's not about the window, it's about the people.
German Folks |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:21 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| lonotch wrote: |
| Bumper seal looks great Trylon. |
Thanks! I was also able to even it out a bit from underneath.
Kind of you to celebrate my meager accomplishments.
1 down, 3 to go.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12861
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:52 am Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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Now I just gotta find that other one.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:00 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
Now I just gotta find that other one.
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Now that I see them, I’m wondering how they are going to fit... looks like a whole other construction.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12861
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:05 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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These are on the interior side of the firewall of the car, under the carpets (Or should be). Behind the back seat.
The one on the left goes on the wheel tub (There is another for the other side but I haven't found it yet.), the one on the right goes along the firewall.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it.
Last edited by TDCTDI on Fri May 22, 2020 12:09 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 9654
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:07 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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In this shot from that ad, look at the large right side piece in the right foreground. On the outer upper edge, it appears that the tarboard is delaminating. But that's not the case- it's sitting on top of the separate cardboard piece, of which you can see a small sliver of its dark grey color.
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
These are on the interior side of the firewall of the car, under the carpets (Or should be). Behind the back seat.
The one on the left goes on the wheel tub (There is another for the other side but I haven't found it yet.), the one on the right goes along the firewall. |
Oh! There’s nothing there for sure!
So these do not take the place of the others that are for sale...
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Rome wrote: |
In this shot from that ad, look at the large right side piece in the right foreground. On the outer upper edge, it appears that the tarboard is delaminating. But that's not the case- it's sitting on top of the separate cardboard piece, of which you can see a small sliver of its dark grey color.
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Yes, I see what you mean now. Just thought it was a fold.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12861
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 12:28 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Trylon wrote: |
So these do not take the place of the others that are for sale... |
No, they do not.
Do any of the purists know if the early Ghias had these & whether these are the same or at least compatible?
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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rbsurfguy
Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008
Posts: 1757
Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 3:06 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Trylon wrote: |
Not factory...
...but about as good as I am going to get it.
Looks like it’s pinched a bit. I’ll poke at it some more later.
Turns out that the best way I could think to get it close to the body was to tighten the bolts up so that they just held, mallet a piece of wood against the corner to cozy it up, and then tighten the bolts down fully. |
What exactly did you use here? I was having the same problem and for now just temporarily used the aftermarket pieces in the touch spot to keep from scratching the paint, but definitely need to use something that curves around the top bends. Tried various adhesives, but definitely don't hold in place.
Jeff
_________________
1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:03 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| rbsurfguy wrote: |
| Trylon wrote: |
Not factory...
...but about as good as I am going to get it.
Looks like it’s pinched a bit. I’ll poke at it some more later.
Turns out that the best way I could think to get it close to the body was to tighten the bolts up so that they just held, mallet a piece of wood against the corner to cozy it up, and then tighten the bolts down fully. |
What exactly did you use here? I was having the same problem and for now just temporarily used the aftermarket pieces in the touch spot to keep from scratching the paint, but definitely need to use something that curves around the top bends. Tried various adhesives, but definitely don't hold in place.
Jeff |
I think I’ve gotten it pretty well with some adjustments made from behind (photos tomorrow).
I got these:
https://www.jbugs.com/product/141-251A.html
Unfortunately they are not formed like that but just straight pieces.
I used clear gorilla glue to tack down the inner end. Had to stuff a screwdriver handle between it and the body to hold it in place. Came back the next day and it adhered well enough to bend the rest around without it popping off.
The next trial was getting that inner end cozied up to the body. I finally tightened the bolts up enough to hold and then tapped a piece of wood held against the lower corner to move it as close as I could. Then I tightened the bolts fully. The result is what you see in the picture.
I was still not happy so poked and prodded from the back side with a plastic/nylon wedge thing and I must say that it came out better than I expected it would.
I think it is possible to do it without glueing it first, though I have yet to be successful at it. My thought is to get the inside on its groove, cozy it up and tighten the bolts enough to hold it in place. Then poke and prod the rest of it in place, finally tightening it all up when done. I actually got pretty far with this technique. The only thing that did not work was the inner part touching the rubber seal that’s already on the body. It was rolled over so that the surface that is supposed to meet the body was not. Gonna try again tomorrow and make sure to keep that flat against the body as I tighten up the bolts. I got so close that I think this is probably the right way to go. We’ll see.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:11 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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My VW logo rattles around. Found a gasket for it (being shipped).
So how do these work?
And on another note, why would it be wet back there?
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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Marcdeb
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019
Posts: 3036
Location: Vermont
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:43 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Trylon wrote: |
Not factory...
...but about as good as I am going to get it.
Looks like it’s pinched a bit. I’ll poke at it some more later.
Turns out that the best way I could think to get it close to the body was to tighten the bolts up so that they just held, mallet a piece of wood against the corner to cozy it up, and then tighten the bolts down fully. |
Wow! That looks really good. I bought my bracket seals last fall but they don't look like yours at all. When I received them, I thought they were pretty weird. After seeing your installed seal, I'm thinking what I have is the wrong seals. I got mine from CIP1 and they are labeled as Bumper Bracket Seal?   Do these look like the same thing you received?
Which bolts are you loosening to adjust the bracket closer to the body? I thought the entire bumper would move closer in order to close the gap between the body and the bracket covers, but now I see that must be wrong. I have not attempted any of this yet but I got to say, I'm confused! I read just about every thing I can find in preparation, but I'm not impressed with my seals.
_________________
Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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Trylon
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019
Posts: 4853
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:48 pm Post subject: Re: '59 Karmann Ghia fever |
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| Marcdeb wrote: |
| Trylon wrote: |
Not factory...
...but about as good as I am going to get it.
Looks like it’s pinched a bit. I’ll poke at it some more later.
Turns out that the best way I could think to get it close to the body was to tighten the bolts up so that they just held, mallet a piece of wood against the corner to cozy it up, and then tighten the bolts down fully. |
Wow! That looks really good. I bought my bracket seals last fall but they don't look like yours at all. When I received them, I thought they were pretty weird. After seeing your installed seal, I'm thinking what I have is the wrong seals. I got mine from CIP1 and they are labeled as Bumper Bracket Seal? Do these look like the same thing you received?
Which bolts are you loosening to adjust the bracket closer to the body? I thought the entire bumper would move closer in order to close the gap between the body and the bracket covers, but now I see that must be wrong. I have not attempted any of this yet but I got to say, I'm confused! I read just about every thing I can find in preparation, but I'm not impressed with my seals. |
Yep, those are the pesky items in question. I am gettin to be an expert on em.
There are two bolts on the the bracket itself that fit into a slot so that it can be moved forward and back.
_________________
1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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