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barfsurfer
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2019
Posts: 50
Location: Santa Ana, California
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 Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 12:51 pm Post subject: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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I tackled a tie rod / steering damper replacement yesterday on my '66 Kombi. All went pretty well, and the steering is so much nicer. I matched the length of the adjustable tie rod exactly but the alignment came out totally out of whack. So I definitely need a good alignment.
Here's what I'm writing about though. Everything around the front spindles was coated in 50 years of crud. So I took a little pick and wire brush to things to at least knock off the really bad crust. So far so good. But while doing this, one of the bushings between the kingpin and the lower torsion arm just fell out. It's totally gone now. See pic. I assume all of the other bushings are in similarly bad shape and I need a whole kingpin rebuild.
How bad/stupid is it to drive the bus with this bushing missing? I was about to take the plunge and spring for a disc brake conversion, and now it seems like I should just get the kingpins rebuilt at the same time while all this front end work is done. I took it out for a brief test drive yesterday after the tie rod replacement and it felt fine - quite an improvement from the new tie rods, and I didn't notice any new weird noises or vibration from the missing bushing. So it doesn't seem too bad to drive while I'm waiting for the disc brake kit - but what do you think? Should I keep her on ice until the kingpin rebuild?
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'66 Velvet Green Kombi |
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sled
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2005
Posts: 6179
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| Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 12:58 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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it is absolutely NOT dangerous to drive with missing seals. all they do is keep some grease in and dust out. Get some fresh grease in there and don't worry about it immediately.
for rebuilt kingpin spindles, contact Greg Noble "campingbox" here on the forums. He is the best.
also, those corroded seals are for the linkpins, not the kingpins...but everything should be rebuilt if you want it "as new"
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drive your split. |
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BarryL 
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14269
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2020 2:28 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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What he said ^^^. Those are rubber grease seals not bushings.
It's really hard to get two tierods the same length on the bench. I/we can tell you how to align in your garage if you want. |
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BulliBill
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2004
Posts: 4573
Location: St Charles, MO
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:23 am Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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| BarryL wrote: |
What he said ^^^. Those are rubber grease seals not bushings.
It's really hard to get two tierods the same length on the bench. I/we can tell you how to align in your garage if you want. |
You should tell us all!
Bill
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barfsurfer
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2019
Posts: 50
Location: Santa Ana, California
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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Thanks for the advice all - much appreciated! And glad I don't have to keep my bus grounded!
BarryL - definitely share your alignment advice!
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'66 Velvet Green Kombi |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12858
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:21 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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| BulliBill wrote: |
| BarryL wrote: |
What he said ^^^. Those are rubber grease seals not bushings.
It's really hard to get two tierods the same length on the bench. I/we can tell you how to align in your garage if you want. |
You should tell us all!
Bill |
Down & dirty, I use two 3’ sections of angle iron, clamp them to the wheel/tire & then take measurements in front of & behind the tire & then adjust the toe so that the front measurement is about 1/8” shorter than the rear.
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Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12401
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| Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:33 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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Yes, those are grease seals, to keep the crud out of the grease.
They get old and fall apart. Don't panic.
Did you lube the bus? jack it so the wheels are off the ground and grease all grease fittings--- 4 on the big tubes, 4 each steering knuckle, one or two on center pin. Wipe the zerk clean, and grease till CLEAN grease comes out. wipe off the icky glop that emerges. smear the old grease on your undercarriage as a rust proofing.
Do this every 3K miles.
Adjust link pins every 6K miles. To adjust link pins, you need a 17mm wrench, and a floor jack, instruction in Muir, in Bentley, etc. reall easy when the bus is off the ground.
Check for play by push pull at top and bottom of wheel. Does it thunk? it should not thunk.
grease is good. |
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BarryL
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14269
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:31 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
| ...I use two 3’ sections of angle iron... |
Really good for measuring by yourself as you can pull the tape measure against the other side's iron. My method here requires a ready and willing helper.
The camber and caster aren't really adjustable so I'm assuming nothing is bent and your bearings and spindle bushings are fairly sound and the bus is not lowered. Your tierod ends must be good.
On a flat surface with enough room to roll, put down two stops such that the tire will roll 1/2 turn.
Mark a sharp crow-foot with chaulk or tape 1/2 way up the tire in the rear on both front tires such that a tape measure can be exactly read. I use the 2 inch line as it's easier to hold and line up with the V of the mark.
Have someone on the other side read the number on their V and write it down. Now roll the bus forward so the V is in front and remeasure. Subtract to find the difference.
Loosen the clamps on the adjustable tierod and rotate it to go longer or shorter.
You will have to roll the bus back and forth as many times as you feel comfortable with your measuring and adjusting to get it zero difference to toe-ed in/out (+or-) 1/16th" (+or-1mm) which translates to about 1/8" of range.
You should kick the rear of the tires then remeasure after you roll forward and see if there's a huge discrepancy. Only adjust when the crow foot V is in the front after rolling forward to simulate real world driving. |
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barfsurfer
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2019
Posts: 50
Location: Santa Ana, California
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| Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 4:58 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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Excellent tips - love the pics on the alignment tutorial, AND I love the angle-iron method too. I'll see if I can find a couple of bits that might work.
Definitely planning on lubing up the front end as part of all this. Based on the crust, I'd say it's been a long time since anyone pushed any grease into those fittings. I've only had the bus for just over a year now, and the front end looks as if it's been untouched for years.
I've got the Muir book, I'll def take a look at the kingpin refurb section. Thanks all!!
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'66 Velvet Green Kombi |
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Clara
Samba Member
Joined: June 14, 2003
Posts: 12401
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| Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 6:36 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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| The Muir book has a good description in the 'shimmies and shakes' chapter on diagnosing steering slop. |
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don.ville
Samba YardMan
Joined: February 07, 2008
Posts: 2830
Location: West Palm Beach, FL
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| Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2021 1:39 pm Post subject: Re: Destroyed Kingpin / Torsion Arm Bushing - how dangerous? |
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Kind late, but be sure to tie the steering wheel directly straight so it does not move.
Otherwise as you adjust the tie rods, the steering wheel may move off center.
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