Chinese Diesel Heater vs Propex - the Differences

[Syncro Jael]

There were a few people wondering about my switch from the Propex HS2800 9,500 btu to a 5kw 27,280 btu Chinese Diesel Heater. And why I switched. There is nothing wrong with the Propex. For our needs the diesel heater is our preferred choice.

We really enjoyed our Propex for several years. I mounted it in the Westfalia refrigerator cabinet. It was adequate keeping the van warm while we winter camped in the Rocky Mountains. I believe our coldest night was near Breckenridge at 10k feet and -08°f below zero. With the top closed we stayed warm. When we camp I usually take the upper berth and let my wife have the lower. It is considerably colder up above sleeping in a tent. Even with the Fanchers insulation kit. The Propex could still keep it warm but it cycled on and off a lot. The temperature swing between the cycles was wide and it would get really cold before kicking back on. Reason 1 to change. I also installed twin over sized GW propane saddle tanks to fuel the beast in the winter. More weight and it was difficult finding people that really knew how to fill the bottles. Reason 2 to change.

So I purchased the Diesel Heater online, set it up in the Garage, and ran it on high for a solid three days. Then tested it for several more days running 5 gal of fuel through it, cycling it on and off. So I installed it in the exact footprint of the Propex. The installation was simple and straight forward. I went through several fuel tank ideas and finally ended up fabricating an aluminum tank of 4 gallons. It is easy to fill, diesel fuel is readily available, and with a gauge I will never run out. Reason 3 to change.

I have slept in the van with the top popped at -3°f the diesel heater had no problems keeping the van at 70°f. Now that I have an insulated NAHT and have camped at temps in the 30°s, the heater runs on low and never did cycle up to keep the inside at 70°f. On low you can barely here it running. Much different than the Propex. Reason 4 to change. These heaters do not shut of but cycle down to a low setting. You can adjust the air fuel mixture to set heat ranges. I have seen the vent temp at 270°f when testing. I run a blend of kerosene and #1 Diesel 50/50. This should keep it from sooting up at low settings.

I am excited for some winter camping here in Utah soon.

Here are a few pics and videos of the installation:

A modified bend to divert the heat up while the lower berth is folded out.

Yes, this cabinet is still accessable, the vent tubing has enough flex to open it.

Making a drivers side filler was an easy way to fill the diesel tank.

This is hidden by a layer of Prodex. It is quiet running.

Link

A skid plate to protect the pump, filter, and front of the tank.

Link

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1987 Syncro Westfalia Hightop - NAHT
Subaru EJ25 Forged Frankenmotor, Triple Knob.
Jael = (Mountain Goat)

[rmcd]

Very cool. Thanks for sharing your experience.
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VW LT40 build. Like a Vanagon but 30% larger in every direction and 40% slower even in metric.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=749359&highlight=

[westyventures]

Where did you get the wildly optimistic '27280' btu figure? 5kw = 17K btu. Even that's almost twice the btu needed for the space. But perhaps those Chinese are fudging the btu / kw?

Curious - why not pay for the quality diesel furnace with full warranty, support, and parts availability? Ya know, the ones these thieves stole the design of?
I have used the Espar units in no-propane vans, far and above one of the best, long-lasting, dependable brand. Their pricing is way more reasonable since moving production to lower-wage EU countries.

FWIW, The HS2800 outlet temp is 330 F, and with the new digital stat temp swing is 2 under set temp, one above.

I'll be curious to hear how well this functions at high altitude. Keep us posted.

[newerwesty1987]

Well you are looking at what, $150 vs. $1100, or close? I could buy 3 cheap heaters, keep two in storage and have all the parts and my own "warranty" replacement system, and have $100s left over for CV joints and tires!

I think Espar etc. are going to have to face shutting down or changing prices. Not enough people are going to pay out $1000+ to keep them running for long. The same thing happened to so many industries due to China ramping up quality and quantity on items like this. These heaters are well tested over the last couple years and are now being used by truckers and others by a seemingly massive majority lately.

You could compare something like flashlights to what's going on with heaters. Not so long ago you had Streamlight and Maglight and a couple others for bright lights. Now you have about 300 brands and they are just as bright or brighter than any of the so called high-end lights at a fraction of the price. The quality might be a little lower but so what when you can buy 10 lights and throw spares all over the place. Unfortunate I guess, but it's the way things are for now. I'm definitely not paying more than $150 for a heater, also because I don't need one that often anyway.

[westyventures]

[SyncroChrick]

Thanks for sharing these details.

Quick question - what about using a gasoline(petrol) heater such as this one? Are-they not as powerful as diesel? You wouldn't need to install a new tank.

https://www.heatso.com/webasto-air-top-2000-stc-gasoline-petrol-12v-heater-kit/

[Syncro Jael]

[Syncro Jael]

[candyman]

I also dumped the propex for these chinese diesel heaters last winter. Like Ron, I wanted to get rid of my two propane tanks. PITA getting them filled, never know the gas level, i do a lot of off road travel so having them under the van always sketched me out, plus I eliminated the possibility of propane leaks. I have 1# refillable propane bottles for the stove which we only use to boil water. Our fridge is a TF65 which is the best of the best! FWIW, the propex heated great. However, the constant cycling was super annoying and like what Ron mentioned, the temp swing between cycles was crazy.
My experience thus far with the diesel heater has been excellent. I have over 200 hours on it and it has been flawless. I run straight kerosene as I hate the smell of diesel and have no issues of sooting whatsoever. But it can run on red diesel or regular highway diesel, or a blend of these. Cheaper to run and easier to fill and can see the level of fuel. On low it draws .6 amps measured and uses .10 liters of fuel an hour. On start up it does draw 9amps but for only 2 minutes so its not an issue.
I have two complaints. even on low it gets the van very hot! So we sleep with windows open to keep the van temps under 70*, unless its below 30*s outside. It does not cycle on and off and the constant soft sound of the fan is pleasant and barely audible. Second complaint, the fuel pump ticks and can be heard. This can be annoying if you are a light sleeper. I have the pump installed under the van tucked in a safe place suspended by rubber straps to keep the sound as low as possible but I can still hear it, my wife claims she cannot, but for me its like a scene from the tell tale heart. fortunately we also sleep with a fan on even in the winter as we need that constant white noise, and that covers up the sound of the pump, so problem solved.

Cost about $100 on ebay. I have bought several as spares and have even installed one in my garage. I have upgraded the controller so I can adjust the settings for altitude and it even has timer settings to go on in the morning and evening at set times if you wish. Also there is remote that I use to turn it on from my house in the mornings if i need to.
In response to the espar and webasto price tag, there is a EU Class action suit against those two companies for price fixing, so what does that tell you https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/cl...ettlement/

In conclusion, figure out whats best for you. Propex is great served us well, but I prefer the this route and am very satisfied with my decision. Like anything, there are pros and cons so best to do your own research. There is a very active and very large facebook group dedicated to these heaters, so any and all problems and solutions have been discussed there.

[michaelbteam]

Thanks everyone for sharing. Might inspire me to finally make a move.

[fxr]

I've just today installed a 2kW Chinese knock-off. Runs a treat. Total cost including a different fuel tank, an extra length of exhaust tubing and a spare glow-plug was $180. Total time taken testing and fitting (it is now under the bench seat) was two days. The UK folk have been all over these things, and rate them highly. They work up to very high altitudes as the fuel/air mixture can be tweaked. The trick is to read the files and FAQs beforehand to know how and when to change settings if necessary.

We had originally dreamed of getting an Espar or Webasto - but the money they were asking for a pretty basic bit of kit designed years ago was consistently outrageous for what they are. These are not luxury or new technology items these days - it's not as though they bring out 'new, improved' models every year like top-of-the-range mobile phones or laptop computers. These heaters are the $10 Nokia 3310 equivalent.
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Jim Crowther
1984 1.9l EJ22 Westy Wolfsburg Edition
Vespa GTS 300

[westyventures]

[erikgundy98]

Would love to see a link to the "cheaper" Espar heaters that have come down in price.

I want a heater, also want to support the company that actually made it.... not the knock off.... but only see $1200 ones

Thanks!
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'90 Multivan Westfalia

[davlance01]

[westyventures]

[RoryGirl]

[HBB]

[Syncro Jael]

I do understand that Webasto, Eberspacher, and Planar have been producing these heaters for years. There are some videos on YouTube showing the construction differences between Chinese heaters vs these. I will agree the visual fit and finish inside the unit is not as refined, but then for the amount of money saved and the same results in the end. Reliable, safe, heat.


Link


Here is a site to learn more: https://www.facebook.com/groups/146837062640024/


Just like anything else, the materials and labor, used to construct "anything" is being produced overseas where it is "cheaper". In many cases we think we are purchasing Genuine Parts for our vans, but they are really being manufactured somewhere else. China, Taiwan, India, etc.

Here are a few other interesting things to be found. https://faroutride.com/webasto-vs-propex/

Again, I am not knocking any of these products but wanted to post this for information and the differences in these heaters, regardless of where they are manufactured.
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1987 Syncro Westfalia Hightop - NAHT
Subaru EJ25 Forged Frankenmotor, Triple Knob.
Jael = (Mountain Goat)

[Syncro Jael]

[thomas.]

[quote="erikgundy98"]Would love to see a link to the "cheaper" Espar heaters that have come down in price.

I want a heater, also want to support the company that actually made it.... not the knock off.... but only see $1200 ones

Thanks![
This link will explain another reason why they're so expensive

https://www.reuters.com/article/eu-cartel-heaters/...0T20150617