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sjbartnik
Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011
Posts: 5994
Location: Brooklyn
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 Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:57 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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The fuel fittings are a press-fit into the carb and pump. I think part of the issue with them coming loose is years of people pulling the cloth-braided fuel hose off the fittings - you've seen how hard it is to get that hose to pull off when it's fresh, the cloth braid acts like one of those finger trap toys to make the hose resistant to pulling.
I like to avoid putting that kind of strain on the fittings, so generally I keep a lot of extra fuel hose and if I have to pull a hose that's been on there long enough to have set to the fitting, I just cut the hose off and replace it with new rather than pulling and twisting it off.
It is possible to modify the carb top to accept a threaded and barbed inlet fitting, a gentleman on this site whose trade name is VolksBitz does that as an optional extra service on his carb rebuilds.
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VolkzBitz 
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2009
Posts: 300
Location: Washington State USA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:24 pm Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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http://volkzbitz.com
Quality VW Solex carburetor restoration
[email protected]
Der Vergaser Meister |
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Marcdeb
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019
Posts: 3031
Location: Vermont
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| Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:06 pm Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| sjbartnik wrote: |
It is possible to modify the carb top to accept a threaded and barbed inlet fitting, a gentleman on this site whose trade name is VolksBitz does that as an optional extra service on his carb rebuilds. |
That seems like the way to go. I thought rebuilding my components would make great winter projects but, from what I'm hearing, I think I will send it to Volkzbitz this winter.
Continued working on the engine today. Took the top of the carb off to check the float and main jet hoping to find something obvious. the fuel level in the bowl was 22mm below the top edge. The bowl was pretty dirty, but the main jet was clear. I don't have much experience, but I think the inside of the bowl is worse than I expected. I cleaned it up but can only wonder what the rest of the carb looks like. Checked the throttle valve with accelerator pedal pushed to the floor and the valve was perfectly vertical. So other than the crud in the bowl, no obvious cause for the lack of power when going up hill. It rained all day do so I couldn't test drive it. I hope to test drive it tomorrow.
Bumpers and side trim have been removed. The car is going to a friends body shop in a week. It will return in the spring looking the way I was expecting.
_________________
Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:05 pm Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=616786
22mm below the top of the carb fuel bowl with the top off is too low. I copied a link that has all the info in it.
There use to be (3) different thickness washers in rebuild kits to fit under the float needle valve. Now there's just one. You use to pick the washer that gave you a 13mm fuel level below the top of the float bowl. I had to set the float height while I rebuilt my German Solex 34-3. I sent Tim at Volkzbitz.com just the lower portion of my carb to install new throttle shaft bushings in the carb body. After I rebuilt it, I was having some issues with the carb. I FORGOT to measure the float height after I rebuilt it. Once I realized the fuel level was too low, I found the correct thickness washer to put under the shut off needle valve. I then achieved the correct fuel height and the carb worked perfectly. 
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Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6594
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:36 pm Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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Bughaus has some nice new 34-Pict 3. If you don't mind it not saying Solex you can buy one and drop it in. It's be gone over with a fine tooth comb.
https://www.bughaus.com/carburet1.htm
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Marcdeb
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019
Posts: 3031
Location: Vermont
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 4:39 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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Quote from Aussiebug in the above link:
| Quote: |
And an amendment to the info I provided previously.
After a very careful read of both "1200" and "1302/1303" Haynes manuals, plus the blue and orange Bentley manuals, the fuel height comes out as...
28PCI , 28PICT and 30PICT/1 carbs - float weight is 5.7 gm and the fuel height is 12-14mm below the top lip.
For the 30PICT/2 (from 68 models onwards), the 30PICT/3, 31PICT/3 (Euro 1300 twin ports) and the 34PICT/3 carbs, float weight is 8.5gm and the fuel height is 18.5 to 20.5mm below the lip of the float bowl.
And for info, Bentley and Haynes lists the stock needle valve washer thickness as 1.5mm for the 30PICT/3, and the 31PICT/3 (Euro 1300 twin ports); and 0.5mm for the 34PICT/3 and 34PICT/4 (CA).
Hope that clears any confusion.
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Rob
Rob and Dave's aircooled VW pages
Repairs and maintenance for the home mechanic
http://www.vw-resource.com |
per Aussiebug, if I understand correctly, the 34 Pict 3 fuel level with float in place is 18.5 to 20.5. ???
I had the float removed (2mm difference) when I made my measurement of 22mm so that puts me within the spec at 20mm. By the way, My float is the hollow type.
If I interpret this correctly, the fuel level seems ok. Can anyone confirm this is correct information?
_________________
Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:33 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| Marcdeb wrote: |
Quote from Aussiebug in the above link:
| Quote: |
And an amendment to the info I provided previously.
After a very careful read of both "1200" and "1302/1303" Haynes manuals, plus the blue and orange Bentley manuals, the fuel height comes out as...
28PCI , 28PICT and 30PICT/1 carbs - float weight is 5.7 gm and the fuel height is 12-14mm below the top lip.
For the 30PICT/2 (from 68 models onwards), the 30PICT/3, 31PICT/3 (Euro 1300 twin ports) and the 34PICT/3 carbs, float weight is 8.5gm and the fuel height is 18.5 to 20.5mm below the lip of the float bowl.
And for info, Bentley and Haynes lists the stock needle valve washer thickness as 1.5mm for the 30PICT/3, and the 31PICT/3 (Euro 1300 twin ports); and 0.5mm for the 34PICT/3 and 34PICT/4 (CA).
Hope that clears any confusion.
_________________
Rob
Rob and Dave's aircooled VW pages
Repairs and maintenance for the home mechanic
http://www.vw-resource.com |
per Aussiebug, if I understand correctly, the 34 Pict 3 fuel level with float in place is 18.5 to 20.5. ???
I had the float removed (2mm difference) when I made my measurement of 22mm so that puts me within the spec at 20mm. By the way, My float is the hollow type.
If I interpret this correctly, the fuel level seems ok. Can anyone confirm this is correct information? |
Let me look again at the factory manual for the 34-3 tonight.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
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carlk3
Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2009
Posts: 201
Location: Longmont, CO
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:45 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| heimlich wrote: |
| ... I've seen some of those brass tubes on the fuel pumps I rebuild just fall right out by pulling on them. |
I've seen that, too. My fix is to rough it up, clean with brake cleaner, apply SuperGlue, and tap in firmly with a hammer. I suppose the best fix would be to tap the hole and put in a fitting like this:
[img]https://nebula.wsimg.com/07abaa18a2c6fbf007c2f6afbeda49f1?AccessKeyId=16AE13DFCCC543E824C4&disposition=0&alloworigin=1[/img]
Screwed in barbed fitting
But, it might need to be a different size than the one for the carb. |
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carlk3
Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2009
Posts: 201
Location: Longmont, CO
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:04 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| wcfvw69 wrote: |
...
Wolfsburg West sells these style crimp clamps as does McMaster Carr.
... |
Are these the ones?
Fuel clamp
What tool is used to crimp them?
Edit: and maybe these?
Vibration-Resistant Pinch Clamps crimped with one of these?
Pinch Clamp Pliers
I have a '64, so I suppose I'm exempt  But, sometimes I run a '66 engine. |
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tommu
Samba Member
Joined: November 15, 2011
Posts: 618
Location: L.A.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:15 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| heimlich wrote: |
Bughaus has some nice new 34-Pict 3. If you don't mind it not saying Solex you can buy one and drop it in. It's be gone over with a fine tooth comb.
https://www.bughaus.com/carburet1.htm |
That's good to know. Any idea if they are correct for the 205AN DVDA?
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carlk3
Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2009
Posts: 201
Location: Longmont, CO
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:23 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| Marcdeb wrote: |
...
I can't really do a good road test as my street is flat but only a 1/4 mile long. At the end of it I can either: 1: turn around and go back and forth. 2: Go up a 1 mile hill. or 3: Go down a Seriously steep hill.
Turning around every 1/4 mile doesn't give the car much of a test, I could drive back and forth 1/4 mile at a time all day and it's happy. Going down the hill is out of the question since I don't know if I'll make it back up!!  So I've been trying to go up hill the since I can always turn around and make it back home. But the car doesn't make it all the way before it loses power and I have to pull over.
... |
Are you warming it up thoroughly? I don't know what you have hooked up in the way of carb preheat, thermostat, etc., but unless all of that is just right, you might just need to really warm it up. |
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6594
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:31 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| tommu wrote: |
| heimlich wrote: |
Bughaus has some nice new 34-Pict 3. If you don't mind it not saying Solex you can buy one and drop it in. It's be gone over with a fine tooth comb.
https://www.bughaus.com/carburet1.htm |
That's good to know. Any idea if they are correct for the 205AN DVDA? |
It should be fine. It's just like the Bocars in that regard: https://www.vwnos.com/113-129-031-k
_________________
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Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
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Marcdeb
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019
Posts: 3031
Location: Vermont
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:38 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| carlk3 wrote: |
Are you warming it up thoroughly? I don't know what you have hooked up in the way of carb preheat, thermostat, etc., but unless all of that is just right, you might just need to really warm it up. |
I'm missing both preheat tubes to the air filter. Still waiting on those to arrive. But car was running and idling for quite a while during the timing and carb adjustments so it was at nomral operating temp. Unless work gets busy, I'm planning to take it out again later today. I will drive it back and forth on my short street for a while before trying to go up the hill.
This carb has been on the shelf so long and is so dirty that I should get that taken care first and then go from there.
_________________
Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6594
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:44 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| heimlich wrote: |
| tommu wrote: |
| heimlich wrote: |
Bughaus has some nice new 34-Pict 3. If you don't mind it not saying Solex you can buy one and drop it in. It's be gone over with a fine tooth comb.
https://www.bughaus.com/carburet1.htm |
That's good to know. Any idea if they are correct for the 205AN DVDA? |
It should be fine. It's just like the Bocars in that regard: https://www.vwnos.com/113-129-031-k |
I just checked with my distributor and I have access to these at a fairly good price. For now, I can offer them for $135.
https://www.vwnos.com/113-129-031-k-2
_________________
www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:56 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| tommu wrote: |
That's good to know. Any idea if they are correct for the 205AN DVDA? |
All the aftermarket carbs don't have the second arm to hook up the throttle positioner if you're running one. Most don't run them but many like myself do.
I've tried most brands of aftermarket carbs over the past 30 years. The last was a brand new EMPI carb that was on my bus when I bought it. It is better as a door stop than a carb. I'm running a restored German Solex 34-3 carb now and my engine purrs. It's matched to a restored German Bosch DVDA.
The Bocars and other S. American carbs are "OK" but nothing works as well as the German Solex 34-3 carbs after restoration. When you match up the correct base flange number German Solex carb to the distributor you're running, you have great results.
ALL the aftermarket carbs are set up for SVDA distributors. If you bolt a Bocar onto a engine running a DVDA distributor like the 113905205AN, you'll have issues since the bypass hole in the throttle plate is smaller. There were two main variants of the German Solex carb. The DVDA version (most common) and the SVDA version.
Like most aftermarket parts, they are not a one size fits all. You have to know all the fine details before simply bolting a part as complex as a carb on an engine. This is why so many VW engines run terrible with their mix-match of aftermarket parts that don't match each other. This is especially true of non-matching carbs/distributors.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours**
Last edited by wcfvw69 on Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:00 am; edited 2 times in total |
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carlk3
Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2009
Posts: 201
Location: Longmont, CO
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:57 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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There used to be another company that did this conversion and sold kits to DIY:
PRECISION AUTOMOTIVE
Specializing in Volkswagen Repairs & Maintenance
4320 N Effie Fresno, Calif. 93726
Phone 227-4154
I wrote to them in '94, after they had stopped selling their kit, and Bruce there told me:
| Quote: |
| ...If you have access to a 1/16 pipe tap and an F letter drill and some mechanical ability you can handle this. |
So, I guess they were using a fitting like this one?
1/4" Hose ID to 1/16" Male NPT MNPT Straight Brass Fitting Fuel/AIR / Water/Oil / Gas/WOG |
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6594
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:14 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| heimlich wrote: |
Bughaus has some nice new 34-Pict 3. If you don't mind it not saying Solex you can buy one and drop it in. It's be gone over with a fine tooth comb.
https://www.bughaus.com/carburet1.htm |
They will work fine with that distributor. I recently put an NOS Bocar on my 1600 DP a few months ago. I paired it with a DVDA (the same as yours). Runs beautifully.
In care you want to add the decelerator valve I asked Redline Weber:
From Redline Weber: http://www.redlineweber.com/
Dual arm Version. OE Decelerator valve can be used with this carburetor.
Pretty good deal for $135.
_________________
www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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PolarBearVW
Samba Member
Joined: June 26, 2013
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:23 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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That's a lot of residual rust in there...which tells me the inside of your fuel tank is likely suspect. I wonder if the restoration place coated the tank and replaced the internal sock filter. When you go in for paint you might consider draining/siphoning the tank and removing it. It's a fairly easy task (about an hour) and will give you terrific access to your front end as well. It's for this reason that I run inline fuel filters (under the car not in the engine bay) with magnets in them.
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 6594
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:27 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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| tjschmidty wrote: |
| It's for this reason that I run inline fuel filters (under the car not in the engine bay) with magnets in them. |
That's a really good point. I run my filter under the rear drivers wheel well.
This is what I use https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2284793
_________________
www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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PolarBearVW
Samba Member
Joined: June 26, 2013
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:33 am Post subject: Re: O Ghia's Restoration Journey |
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Is there a clue in going uphill? I recall reading a thread about a guy who parked his bug uphill and came out in the morning with a gas leak under the engine. The fuel pressure from gravity overcame the float needle. Just a thought...is it over pressured uphill? Is that a thing?
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