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Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:39 am    Post subject: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

New member here with a new build. Just picked up a rust-free '70 sedan and going to be doing a lot of work on it here coming up. It has 82k miles and all documentation in a binder. I have all the original service records and even the "window sticker" and ordering sheet. The only rust I could find anywhere is on the floor pans under the tarboards and battery compartment. Knowing this I decided to completely replace both sides so I don't have to worry about it in my lifetime.

Decided I was going to build a trail runner for dusty trail, national park lands and some fire roads. I enjoy exploring ghost towns and backroads, so I wanted to make something equally as capable on road as off and still get decent gas mileage. I am trying to not going to far from stock VW parts so I can get replacements in any small town NAPA or Autozone if I should happen to break down away from home.

As it sits I've ripped out all the interior and completely stripped the body down to bare metal before I joined the site so I don't have any pre-project photos to share with you all. I am taking the engine and body out next week and will begin replacing the floor pans.

What I have ordered so far are:
    JBugs premium 18 gauge floor pans (originally they shipped me two passenger side *doh*)
    Complete set of Energy Suspensions black urethane bushings (shifter, control arms, torsion bars, engine mounts, trans mount, snubbers)
    All chassis seals, rubbers and tubes from Wolfsburg West


In the next couple weeks I will be ordering and replacing all the brakes, master cylinders and all chassis related parts such as cables and cv boots with OEM or better. I plan on the following mods:
    Bilstein 24-006200 Front Shocks
    Longer Bilstein Rear Shocks (Will have to measure when back together)
    Moog tie rod ends (they are problem solver greaseable)
    German Ball Joints
    Raptor Line low VOC on the chassis to protect it (have to take away old undercoat)
    Thing spindles and trailing arms
    Turn rear torsion bars to match front


I will probably be sticking with my stock wheels and tires (they have like 2k miles on them from Les Schwab) until I get farther on my build and see what can fit once I get it all back together.

I am really leaning on doing all the body work myself, which I've never done. The car is original paint, but I took it all off to look for rust, of which I found none other than floor pans where the water collected under the tarboards. I plan on Raptor Lining it in Savannah Beige with the tintable low VOC formula. This takes a lot of pressure off of me to get it looking professional since I am a perfectionist and hard on myself often times.

For now I will be leaving the engine and trans stock as they run fine. I will be having the generator and starter rebuilt while they are out of the car since it's easy to get to. Later down the road I will probably just build a bigger motor and get a freeway flyer style transmission.

Anyways, any suggestions are appreciated and welcome. Thanks for looking!

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Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Nov 04, 2019 4:53 am; edited 12 times in total
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calvinater
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:53 am    Post subject: Re: '70 Standard Home Build Reply with quote

Congrats, and welcome. If its rust free , why the new floor pans?
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:09 am    Post subject: Re: '70 Standard Home Build Reply with quote

Looks like it was a nice car.
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:22 am    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

calvinater wrote:
Congrats, and welcome. If its rust free , why the new floor pans?


Typical battery tray area rust was previously patched crappily and there was some soft places under the tar boards, but no heater channel rust or rust anywhere else in the body. So might as well do them now since I am taking it completely apart and doing everything else on it.


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The Energy Suspension bushings came today. Went with the black ones because they are a bit softer but have the graphite impregnated into them.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Also test fit the seats to the rails on the JBugs "premium" floor pans. They fit great and will slide a lot easier with some grease. These floor pans come with the braces and jack pad separately so you have to weld them on as well, but they are nice and thick!


Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Zundfolge1432 Premium Member
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:46 am    Post subject: Re: '70 Standard Home Build Reply with quote

Q-Dog wrote:
Looks like it was a nice car.


We should be used to this by now Very Happy but then again Iím starting to view these as click bait or maybe trolling designed to get a few old purists riled up. I even remember people taking nice mid 50s oval window cars hacking them into Baja Bugs. Now ? I just donít care. Take the long view if we live long enough our OG cars will be more rare. Have a great weekend
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TDCTDI
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:50 am    Post subject: Re: '70 Standard Home Build Reply with quote

Keep your original seat tracks & transfer them to the new pans, the aftermarket tracks suck.
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 5:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Keep your original seat tracks & transfer them to the new pans, the aftermarket tracks suck.


Look and feel pretty stout to me. Sorry youíve had bad experiences with them. I donít think that will be the case here.


Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:07 am    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

Zundfolge1432 wrote:
Q-Dog wrote:
Looks like it was a nice car.


We should be used to this by now Very Happy but then again Iím starting to view these as click bait or maybe trolling designed to get a few old purists riled up. I even remember people taking nice mid 50s oval window cars hacking them into Baja Bugs. Now ? I just donít care. Take the long view if we live long enough our OG cars will be more rare. Have a great weekend


I like stock too, but hereís the thing... my father is 62 and wanted a class 11 style but since the 70s and so I am building this with him to spend time with him, even though itís my rig and I am funding all of it. Itís going to be a nice bonding experience and something that we will have together to be proud of. Plus it gives me a little time to be out in the garage by myself and just think.

UPDATE: Found a nice set of Thing spindles and front torsion arms and eccentrics from Michael at Thing Parts! I am very excited to get these in and clean them up. I am leaning towards painting suspension parts in hammered finish paint for a neat little touch.

I am trying to get the chassis completed and the body painted before my daughter is born in March so her and my wife are not around fumes in the garage and house so we will see if I can at least accomplish that if not more.


Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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oldschool5er
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:02 pm    Post subject: Re: '70 Standard Home Build Reply with quote

Zundfolge1432 wrote:
Q-Dog wrote:
Looks like it was a nice car.


We should be used to this by now Very Happy but then again Iím starting to view these as click bait or maybe trolling designed to get a few old purists riled up. I even remember people taking nice mid 50s oval window cars hacking them into Baja Bugs. Now ? I just donít care. Take the long view if we live long enough our OG cars will be more rare. Have a great weekend


Ahh the sound of my sawsall cutting into my rust free 73 standard bug. Music to my ears. One of about 60 I have cut up to make a pristine unmolested rust free Baja racer or recreational or even worse A Drag Bug. I just can't stand building them out of rust piles, so I buy them from out west now and put the blade to them out here. Twisted Evil
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

oldschool5er wrote:
Zundfolge1432 wrote:
Q-Dog wrote:
Looks like it was a nice car.


We should be used to this by now Very Happy but then again Iím starting to view these as click bait or maybe trolling designed to get a few old purists riled up. I even remember people taking nice mid 50s oval window cars hacking them into Baja Bugs. Now ? I just donít care. Take the long view if we live long enough our OG cars will be more rare. Have a great weekend


Ahh the sound of my sawsall cutting into my rust free 73 standard bug. Music to my ears. One of about 60 I have cut up to make a pristine unmolested rust free Baja racer or recreational or even worse A Drag Bug. I just can't stand building them out of rust piles, so I buy them from out west now and put the blade to them out here. Twisted Evil


Yeah I donít know why the dude got so bent out of shape about it. Not like they didnít make 21 million of them. And I would venture a bet by the time Iím done with my and having everything repainted and mechanically like new, it will be on the road longer and safer than most of the ďstockĒ bugs that are just getting ran into the ground.


Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

Q-Dog wrote:
Looks like it was a nice car.


It was! It will be even nicer! Saves me from having to do rust repair!


Last edited by Double-Double on Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Reply with quote

I am waiting on some friends to come over and help me lift the body off, so I am doing some odd jobs on the bug today. Ordered new ball joints from Heyd, so they are the real nice German ones. Wasn't real happy with the Meyle ones I had ordered previously, they were too stiff. I decided to pull the bumpers off and sand the rust off the backsides and repaint the interiors of the bumpers. I hit them with black rust stop primer and then Rustoleum metallic silver. Turned out pretty good. Then I polished the outsides of the bumpers with Mother's Mag & Aluminum polish. I like how they turned out and saves me from having to buy crappy new bumpers. This old chrome is very tough stuff. In some places I actually took a cup brush on my drill and polished off years of road grime and garbage off the front sides before I polished them.


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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

Finally got the bumpers finished. Ended up polishing the fronts with Mother's Mag & Aluminum. I may end up getting a Flitz ball later on and chrome polish for that extra touch, but I am happy with the progress on them so far.

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Also received my Thing front suspension parts from Michael and got immediately to work cleaning them up. He was a very fast shipper and everything arrived safe and sound. Compared to what I'm used to in the West Coast, they looked like they came from the bottom of the Pacific, but I think they will clean up nicely. I am attempting to get them as clean as possible before I press the old ball joints out. I have finished half of them this morning and kind of gives a good before and after picture. I will be taking these down, along with the front beam, tie rod centers, rear trailing arms and spring plates to the powder coat shop and having them done in hammered black finish. They will sandblast them before they coat them so I think they will turn out awesome. I think this will match the Raptor lining I am doing on the chassis and new floorpans shortly, very well.

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Now my big question is what size tire to run? I know I am going to get BF Goodrich KO2, no doubt in my mind! I love the looks of those tires and I am satisfied with their tread and I am happy about them having the inclement weather snow peak rating. I think they are perfect for my needs because they will work equally as well in the snow, dirt, rocks, and on road.

I am considering between either 215/75R15 or 235/75R15. My research shows that I should be able to run either size with support from my mods (mainly the Thing front end and preloaded suspension and eventually upgraded CVs). One positive for the 235 is they are cheaper for whatever reason, probably a more common size, and there are more options in that size as well if for some reason these were discontinued.

Next up is removing the body and putting it on rollers so I can cut out the floor pan and get the new ones welded back in. Then I will be disassembling the entire chassis to have the suspension pieces powder coated, the chassis Raptor Lined and new chassis seals which should be arriving any day now.


Last edited by Double-Double on Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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oldschool5er
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

Those Thing spindles actually look pretty good as they are usually a lot worse. As far as the 235ís you should still roll the inner fender lips under as they will still hit under compression and tear stuff up, both frt and rear. Also the lower edge lip on the lower frt fenderwell should be hammered up or ground down because they can sometimes hit under a hard turn depending on the tire brand and tread pattern.
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

oldschool5er wrote:
Those Thing spindles actually look pretty good as they are usually a lot worse. As far as the 235ís you should still roll the inner fender lips under as they will still hit under compression and tear stuff up, both frt and rear. Also the lower edge lip on the lower frt fenderwell should be hammered up or ground down because they can sometimes hit under a hard turn depending on the tire brand and tread pattern.


I'm not complaining, just need that extra polish for this build! Just grateful to find some at all. It's not the easiest since they only had two years of production for the United States. Razz

Ok I will take a look at doing that. Would I still have the same problems with 215s?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

I have only run 235ís on my class 11 but I believe the 215ís will clear at full compression.
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 5:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

oldschool5er wrote:
I have only run 235ís on my class 11 but I believe the 215ís will clear at full compression.


That sounds pretty nice either way! I am excited!

Got my haul in from Wolfsburg West. Very fast shipping and good customer service, I am impressed! Will do business with them again for sure!

Received all the seals and gaskets for the chassis, except for the body to chassis gasket, I will order that later so it doesn't get damage during all the restoration. I also ordered some VW specific brake parts like adapter fittings, shift rod bushing and clip, and other parts that are difficult to find someplace other than a VW parts house.

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On a side note, make sure you order a catalog from them! I have never seen such a nice catalog and will be a very nice resource going forward. The blow up drawings are very nice and clear and it's easy to navigate (same thing can't be said about their website).

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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 1:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

Picked up a set of Atomwerk Engineering raise plates today. They are a double plate set for my '70. The raise plates are very well made and I ordered them in the raw finish so I can send them off when I have the rest of my suspension powder coated and everything will match. I believe these plates are 1/4" thick while the stock look to be 3/16" so that is a substantial upgrade in strength.

I called Jennifer at Atomwerk and she was very cordial and answered all my questions. I had the option of how many inches I would like raised and if I wanted single or double plates. I went with the double, why not? I already have double on there. I also chose the 2" lift version so I can fine tune it from there to match my Thing spindles in the front. I would like some droop as well as lift so I can have a nice ride on and off road and not jar my fillings out of my teeth and just maybe my wife will still want to ride in it with me. I was very pleased with the customer service and they welded them the same day I ordered.

It turns out they are a local company to me so I was offered to save on shipping and drive 20 minutes down the road and pick them up in person. I met Jennifer at their shop and was given a tour of the equipment and machines used to make the plates and covers. Its a very nice setup! They have an on site powder coating department as well. They gave me some hints on soaking parts in vinegar water before sand blasting and it helps with rust and mill scale both on new and old parts, in prep for powder coating.

This month they were including a free load and unload tool, so that was a very nice bonus addition and should make changing out my plates and setting the preload much safer.

Overall, I paid $229 for the double spring plate setup, which I feel is a fair price. The only modification I have to make to the parts I already purchased is now I have to exchange my bushings for the early bug style as the spring plates are 1 3/4" bushings style instead of the 1 7/8" I asked why they are like this and they explained because there was so many sizes though out production and some had one size inner and outer, they did this to standardize the sizing. I believe they offer the bushings as well, but I prefer Energy Suspension brand with the graphite impregnation to BugPack brand.

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I am now looking into upgrading to Weddle 100mm flange drives, 944 CVs and Thing or Type 2 final drives to be able to take greater advantage of my suspension capabilities.

My dollies I ordered to put the body on finally arrived so I should be able to remove the engine and then body here shortly!
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frankydee
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

Lets see a top view of those SP please. Also, you are not worried about those welds chewing up the bushings?

Are those plates not as wide at the stops (from top to bottom) than stock to allow more travel?
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Double-Double
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 5:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Double-Doubleís '70 Class 11 Style Trail Runner Build Reply with quote

frankydee wrote:
Lets see a top view of those SP please. Also, you are not worried about those welds chewing up the bushings?

Are those plates not as wide at the stops (from top to bottom) than stock to allow more travel?


Here ya go! No not worried about the welds they are smooth to the touch.

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No I believe same width but they relocate the axle at a different angle or something. Honestly I am just giving them a shot, and trying them out. Worst case scenario I go back to the stock plates re-indexed. I donít know how things work, Iím just a stay-at-home dad.

Here they are on John Layzellía Peking to Paris rally car (screen capture from his Facebook):

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Ended up order Energy Suspension 15-2110G knobby outer bushing and Prothane B658820 Smooth inner bushing both with 1-3/4Ē inner diameter.
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