Engine stuck Will not come out

[Fred A]

Hello All
It has been almost a year since I started work on this buggy Everything has gone well up to Yesterday I will post all the information and pics in another post Right now I have a big problem After finishing the rebuild I wanted to put a couple hundred miles on it as I called the shake down run. This is new pressure plate, clutch, throw out bearing and a whole lot of other things. Engine went in no problem. With 65 miles on it I noticed the clutch pedal seemed spongy or weak. It wasn't going into gear easy Then it wouldn't go into gear at all Thought for sure it was the clutch cable (the only thing I didn't replace) Had it towed back to the house. I got under it and disconnected the adjusting nuts Then the pedal assembly pulled the cable out and there was nothing wrong, Next I got under the car with a long screw driver I worked the lever on the transmission. With it in any gear I could not get the car to roll or the clutch to disengage
So I figured something with the throw out bearing or pressure plate. Now here's the problem I can not get the engine out We have tried for 3 hours it will not budge I have removed engines from Beetles, buggy's ETC and never had one like this, I have spent the better part of 3 hours reading here. The only thing I can find is someone makes mention of taking the starter out and removing the pressure plate bolts Has anyone done this or is this just a theory I'm thinking of trying it unless there is another suggestion
Thanks for the input

[MrGoodtunes]

After you disconnect all hoses, cables, wires, etc. and the 4 bolts (actually, 2 bolts at top and 2 nuts off from studs at bottom), what could possibly keep the engine from pulling out? Not much! But it could be: (1) Clutch plate spline stuck to transmission drive shaft, tho it should slide off easily; (2) Throw-out bearing stuck to where it contacts pressure plate, tho they should be apart when clutch cable is released. The only other thing I can think of is (3) Starter pinion gear jam'd in with flywheel, but you'd have heard horrible sounds. So, I'm thinking it's (2). What did the contacting surface of your new throw out bearing look like? And can you get any wiggle action and watch clutch lever to see if it moves correspondingly with engine wiggle?

[dustymojave]

OH! OH! OH!

Teacher, Teacher...I KNOW what's wrong!!!!



But not so col really.
Been There..Done That...

Back in the early 1980s, my father and I were car-pooling to and from work in what is now my '58 Baja Bug. 47 miles each way from dad's house. He worked for Toyota at their headquarters in Torrance, CA, and I worked at Mattel Toys headquarters in Hawthorne. So one evening, he arrived at Mattel and I got in the driver's seat. Got on the infamous 405 to travel what I read many times and places was the busiest section of freeway or highway in the world. A little north of LA airport, I felt the same symptoms.
That was a LONG drive home in bumper to bumper traffic.

Got to dad's house and we pulled the engine and trans out. Took until midnight to separate them. Thought we were going to break the engine case and/or trans case.

What turned out to be the problem, was that the pilot bearing in the gland nut had gone dry and the pilot shaft welded into the pilot bearing. To separate them, I wound up pulling one axle and the side plate off the trans, and disconnecting the pilot shaft from the trans main shaft. There's a snap ring on the pilot shaft, that when slid towards the engine, lets the reverse gear coupling slide onto the pilot shaft. Then there is a threaded stud connecting the 2 shafts, so you have to unthread the pilot shaft from the main shaft to separate them. THEN the engine will separate from the trans. The pilot shaft will slide out the seal with the engine. Then take the clutch apart and take the gland nut out of the crank. We were able to knock it apart then on the bench vise with a punch and hammer and lots more swearing. Then I polished the end of the pilot shaft, had a spare gland nut. And drove the car to work in the morning.

Needless to say, I have ALWAYS been VERY CERTAIN to ensure the gland nut bearing is well lubricated since then.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[Fred A]

Oh man I really hope that it's not what you say I am still hoping the clutch or throw out bearing is hung up Going to make a couple phone calls today and sit and stare at it maybe I can intimidate it a little

[Fred A]

Well made some phone calls. no one has heard of unbolting the pressure plate thru the starter hole. However I did pull the starter and I tried to do it. I can get the wrench on it but not a good bite. I was thinking of bending the wrench a little so it lays flat. Being a one man show I can't keep the motor from turning when I pull down on the wrench. Tried putting a wrench on the front pulley but I ended up pulling down on the pressure plate bolt and unscrewed the front pulley bolt. I don't want to mess it up Going to stare it into submission today. and do some more reading.

[slalombuggy]

put it in gear with the bark brake on. that will hold the engine. Your pulley bolt was not tight enough, the clutch bolts should only be 18 ft/lbs, the crank pulley is double that.

brad

[fastfil]

Sounds like what I had happen many moons ago. The pressure plate bolts had loosened themselves and I gradually lost clutch. Tried to pull the motor and it took four blokes with timber levering from anywhere we could to budge it. Turns out the pressure plate had cut itself into the bell housing.
_________________
"...swingaxle...transaxle...same diff."

[Fred A]

Well as embarrassing as it is I will admit to a rookie mistake I had a guy come by who has worked on Volkswagen for many years He got under it Came out two seconds later Asked for a wrench and it was out Seems my old style clutch arm doesn't let you take the bolt completely out I backed it off until it hit the arm thinking it was free he pulled down on the arm and turned it the 3 or 4 turns it needed What a DA move Won't happen again that's for sure

[Letterman7]

Consider it a learning experience. We've all been there. At least it came out!

[Fred A]

This is related to this thread
As I said I couldn't get the engine out because I didn't back the bolt out far enough. That's because when the bolt hit the clutch adjusting nut I assumed it was backed out . So now I was in the process of replacing the clutch cable. Has anyone ran across this. The lever is directly in front of the engine mounting bolt. I took this picture to two places they both said this is not correct but neither one had a solution. They did say the nut should be a wing nut. If I site from the lever to the bowden tube it's a straight line. Is there another lever? and would I have to space the bowden tube out so they line up. something I'm missing?

[Dale M.]

Bowden tube should have about 1 inch deflection... As for cable make a loop and put a couple of cable clamps on loop and then pull out slack and tighten clamps...

Bowden tube may need to be longer or clutch cable tube may be to short (can happen when shortening chassis).......

Clutch cable wing nut...

https://www.jbugs.com/product/131721349.html?utm_c...tIQAvD_BwE



Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns" - Thomas Jefferson.

"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
============================================================
All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...

[MrGoodtunes]

[jsturtlebuggy]

Fred you have the early style clutch release arm that was use with an engine that had 4 nuts holding it to the trans.
You need the later style release arm that is straight and uses a wing nut.
They are some what easy to replace. Only held on with the snap ring in the picture.
_________________
Joseph
Fair Oaks/Orangevale, CA
Elrod Motorsports
Motion Tire Motorsports
Having fun with Dune Buggies since 1970
Into Volkswagens since 1960

[EVfun]

[manxdavid]

Not sure about the early arm, yours looks to be a later trans going by the design of the clutch release bearing. It looks like someone's bent the arm to gain a bit of clearance to the body (I've had to do this myself with a Signature Manx body on a later chassis) but I bent mine the other way so that I could still access the bolt.

[dustymojave]

JS is right. Early arm. That one is not "bent". It was made curved like that. Not a big deal to replace it with a later model straight arm. Or just be aware of the bolt hitting the arm when you back it out.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.