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Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy
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andk5591
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 18, 2020 12:18 pm    Post subject: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Just getting started on a customer project. Supposed to have run fine before an accident - we are redoing the entire car.

Manx clone, assuming 1600 DP. I have VERY limited experience with the Weber Progressive that is on it and we are going to be making a decision soon on what to do.

Here are the parameters I am dealing with. Since its a buggy, he has some thought about the header he wants to use and they do have provisions for heat (which he currently has).

I have installed lots of dual set ups and usually go with HPMX or Dual Kads. Assuming he has or I will add the capability for better flow through the heads (ratio rockers or he may already have a cam), what is my performance benefit staying with the Weber or replacing it with duals.

Did a search and did not find the answer. Thanks for your help.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 18, 2020 1:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

The limit on the progressive is still the stock dual port end castings. Don't matter how much head cam & rockers you bolt on the engine.

You will always get better MPG with dual carbs.
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andk5591
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

This is a street car and with the tires and gearing, I don't expect there to be a concern about 5000 RPM. I should have clarified that. What I am weighing is, till I am done messing with the progressive, would my customer be further ahead springing for duals.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

For years, I ran a Weber Progressive (32/36DFAV) on a 1915 (042 Heads, VW200 Cam, 009 w/Pertronics) in a full body Ghia and got 32MPG. I was happy buy eventually went Dual Dells (40s). Woke it right the funk up.

If your guy wants to wake it up, get some 36 duals for the 1600 if it is indeed a 1600.
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[email protected]
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

The progressive is going to be more set it and forget it once it's tuned. Duals require a little bit of common sense and knowledge to know when they need to be adjusted. A lot of folks aren't willing to learn that (too lazy or impatient).
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 9:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

[email protected] wrote:
The progressive is going to be more set it and forget it once it's tuned. Duals require a little bit of common sense and knowledge to know when they need to be adjusted. A lot of folks aren't willing to learn that (too lazy or impatient).

This^^ most guys who are paying for upgrades can’t understand small motors. It’s stock 2 barrel on a v8, to edelbrock for more power, and then Holley double pumper bolt-ons and maybe a manifold upgrade all with no drive ability issues and little tuning. Adjusting linkages and other finagling is considered poor workmanship.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:01 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

I would go duel hpmx. if somebody is too stupid and cany learn how to or what to do or listen thats thier issue. you cant fix stupid and they will have issues with anything. there should be no reason the duels would need resyncing if done right unless someone had effed with it or removed the crabs. do it right the first time and forget about it.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 5:06 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

mark tucker wrote:
I would go duel hpmx. if somebody is too stupid and cany learn how to or what to do or listen thats thier issue. you cant fix stupid and they will have issues with anything. there should be no reason the duels would need resyncing if done right unless someone had effed with it or removed the crabs. do it right the first time and forget about it.

I wouldīnt call them that. I would rather say that their talents are in other areas. And you will be surprised about how many who donīt know, or canīt hear if somethings wrong. Thatīs partly why I began working with std plus engines.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:05 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

You see that in music all the time. The smartest guy in the world may not be able to appreciate anything more complicated than a drum beat. Don't bother taking him to listen to the philharmonic orchestra, he won't get a thing out of it. His ear is what heavy metal and rap were invented for. Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:05 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Progressive carbs can be re-jetted and made to work, but they will never have the HP of a single IDF , or better yet dual IDF's or even dual singles.

Progressives are worth about 3hp over a stock solex.
Not worth the effort and hassle IMO. I pretty much HATE them. NO place on a VW motor.

I have had much better luck with a single IDF carb setup. They run very well and offer lots more HP.

Obviously, dual IDF's are the ticket for best all around performance and drivability, but you MUST learn to syncronize them. When right, they are the best.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:42 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

a little progressive carb history...they are a universal replacement version of the factory carb that came on a pinto or vega in the 70's...so they were designed for a small 4 cyl...theres absolutely nothing wrong with that carb and it was a wonderful replacement for the early rabbit carbs...i've even seen kits to put them on jeeps and other stuff....the problem is the manifold...lack of manifold heat causes fuel to come out of suspension, drowning some cylinders in raw fuel while others run lean...you then need to make the idle mixture too rich so the lean cylinders run at all...so the end result is fouled plugs and and gas in the oil...header systems that dont allow PROPER FLOW (NOT JUST A HOLE DRILLED IN A HEADER PIPE) of exhaust gas through the riser tubes make the situation worse...so fully warmed up in good weather its a great carb...but daily driver conditions in colder weather its awful...stock single barrel carbs can have these issues too but the increased volume and subsequent lower velocity in these manifolds makes the situation worse
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:27 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

And that is why it is, again, important to chose the right manifold. With the right manifold and decent manifold preheat you do not need to have it to run rich. In fact it can handl a pretty nice and Lean setting.
The 3 hp postulate ist plain ridicules and has no bearing at all.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:52 am    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Upon further examination of this car, it was a decent build when done initially..not wild about some of the welds, but they held. This car looks like it was ridden hard and put away wet. We know nothing about the progressive other than it looks like its been on the car for quit a few miles. We may decide to give it a good cleaning and then see what happens, BUT it will also be dependent on what header he wants to use. Thanks for the input.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

if you stick with it the floats on them are prone to absorb fuel and lose buoyancy so if you pull the carb apart throw a new one in it
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 5:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Which one should I run on my shitbox 1600? Looking to try something different just for fun. Running an 009 right now.

I'm not even exactly sure what they are. The single barrel is an ICT? And thr dbl barrel is some sort of progressive?
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

I wouldn't run any of them TBH Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Chickensoup wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

[snip]
Which one should I run on my shitbox 1600? Looking to try something different just for fun. Running an 009 right now.

I'm not even exactly sure what they are. The single barrel is an ICT? And thr dbl barrel is some sort of progressive?

That one is an old Weber replacement carburetor for a stock Bug. They used to be fairly popular back in the 1980's. I've always found them interesting and wondered how well they worked. Thing is, back in the '80's you could still find decent stock carb bodies (not needing to throttle shaft bushed) so I never bought one. It would be unique as I've not seen one in use for years. I've been told it takes 3 hands to rebuild those Webers. Laughing
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 7:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

HPMX 40's would be my choice...
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2022 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

Dale M. wrote:
HPMX 40's would be my choice...

I agree, Kinda. A set of 40IDF FAJ's clones from Sherryberg (ebay) would be a better choice than the Weber progressive below,
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Those will take almost the same amount of $$$ to get them cleaned and setup to run correctly.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2022 2:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Weber Progressive or duals? 1600 Dune buggy Reply with quote

The carb shown needs a bath,soak it in parts cleaner make sure the whole carb is submerged and let it for a week what shows on the outside is most likely in every port inside but its a TRUE weber and worth refurbishing,i run quite a few dfev progressives on offrd buggys and once there set properly theres not much that happens to them,iv had goodluck with them,its only a 1600cc so that extra little bit of carb over a pict 34 is good.

But if ya want new carb(s) dont think just sitting it,them, on and go,most times they need reset float etc and it dont matter if there hpmx or weber.

If your staying with the progressive or any centermount make sure the intake heat is hooked.

Check the main shaft for up and down play if it has any play it needs rebushed and may not be worth all that.goodluck with it.
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