Udo Becker lifter questions

[67rustavenger]

After losing a set of racing lifters and then a Webcam 86b camshaft and another set of racing lifters. I bought a set of Udo's lifters from ACN.

Is there any prep work required for the lifters before installing them and the new Webcam 86b? The lifter bores are bronzed. Brothers did the work a while back.
I'll be using camshield on the cam lobes and the lifters during assembly.

Also is the Webcam 86b compatible with Udo lifters? I know a dumb question. But I need to know as I'm tired of going through my engine on a regular basis due to valve train issues.
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

[FreeBug]

I thought they were compatible with everything. That's one mean setup you have, sounds pretty bulletproof to me. Kick ass!

[bugguy1967]

Do you know why you’re losing cams and lifters yet? Are you running crazy heavy springs like 650s?
_________________
"A petrol engine can start readily, run smoothly and give every appearance of being in good order, without necessarily being in good tune." - Colin Campbell, "The Sportscar Engine"

[Alstrup]

[Theconvert]

Cb650 springs are not that strong, pat uses a lot of them with no problems so why would they be too much pressure

[KROC]

The way I have always treated Udo Lifters...

If your Web Cam is a pre clearanced SC1 blank Do Not use Udo’s Lifters.

Udo’s lifters are only compatible with EP12 cam blanks.

[vwinnovator]

[[email protected]]

[67rustavenger]

bugguy1967 - The springs are dual coil that the Tim's installed when the heads were built.
Altrup - I'm running VR-1 30wt.
KROK - I have ordered a Webcam 86b pre-clearanced. I'm not sure what blank they use when grinding the camshaft.
vwinnovator - I did the cam break in as described here by many users. Fire off the engine and bring the rpm's up to 2K. Vary the throttle position a little up and down but not crazy or at idle until the 20 minute break in time has elapsed.
roy@mofoco - I checked that there was clearance between the lifters and the cam lobes when I built the engine. I don't remember the measurement. But it was over 0.040".

I already have the Udo's in hand.

The last two sets of lifters were CB Racing lifters. Both times I took the engine apart after running it for a while. There was visible pitting on the lifter faces 1st build.
2nd build the lifters and cam lobe failed completely.
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

[KROC]

[KROC]

[jpaull]

That VR1 has some zinc but might not be enuff for a good break in.

Comp Cams break in oil is loaded with zinc.
12 pack for $60 shipped, best deal out there:

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F133312348441

These are my CB lightweights and CB cam after break in with comp cams break in oil. Even after a light polish to highlight imperfections there is no pitting.

[67rustavenger]

The current matterial of construction for Webcam blanks is something called,
From the Webcam site,
"CAST BILLET
A term used to describe a camshaft which is made from a casting. The material for the casting is a special grade of iron alloy called "Proferal."
Modok had a discussion on cam blank materials a few years back and Proferal came up late in the conversation. Unfortunately there was no conclusion on this material at the end of the thread.

After searching for the last couple of hours. I cannot find any reference to a Webcam SC-1 blank.
The cam that was in my engine was a billet as described above. There are no casting marks on the camshaft. It was machined end to end.

When I ordered my parts from ACN. I exchanged a number of emails with John. He asked about the engine build and specifically the camshaft I intended to use. He didn't offer any opinion on the Udo lifters after I said I was using the Webcam 86b.
I guess I'll call Webcam and ask tomorrow what their made of (SC-1?) Proferal, unobtainium....

Thanks for the input guy's.
[/quote]
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

[modok]

If they have ground the markings off, you will just have to ask web what cam blank it was. Should be no secret. i don't think there are more than 3 or four kinds. Probably nobody asks except me and Dan.

I only build a few engines per year but what I do is call Web and just request what I want on the ep-12 blank, and that's been OK.
Trouble is the wait time MAY be...long. If you are in a hurry get a cam from CB. inspect it, send it back because it's somehow goofed, then proceed back to plan A. Just kidding most of them are ok, but CHECK

I use Eaton or CB lightweight lifters on ep-12 cams, good oil, make sure the cam taper is correct.
Virtually no legitimate reported failures with this combo.
More importantly over "appearance" the lifters show the least wear.
Although this may seem like I know what I'm doing, not really, it's just that actually it's been this way for over 30 years.
There have been periods when the cam or lifters were NOT available, but has been only temporary, which is good, no learning new things required.

I tore down an engine recently that was....unfortunately it's mostly destroyed.
Built so long ago it has the original scat H-beams, if you know what those are.
Eaton lifters on a ep-12 cam, looking good.
The lifters are still crowned, only .0005" wear.

Don't fix what ain't broke. It just works.

[Dan Ruddock]

10W-30 is a better choice over 30W on break-in. Cold thick oil does not splash off the rods well. I would heat the oil or over-fill the sump to bathe the cam, must keep the parts cool or they will score. Dan

[Ohio Tom]

Webcam 86B strikes again..

I have seen more than a few lose a lobe.

Not a fan of Webcam.
Soft cams, rampy profiles that need crazy spring pressure for the grind.
(7,000rpm motor needs 175lbs on the seat? ).. Yep, that's Webcam.


Get a better cam blank/grind. No need for expensive lifters.

[sled]

[jimmyhoffa]

[Ohio Tom]

I know.. Right?

I am different than the "popular" crowd.

I only use Steve Long Racing cams and lifters. He has a whole list of different grinds and can customize anything you want. Grinds to order. Spot on the cam card too. (not many cams can say that).
He uses Scat cam blanks and Scat lifters. He re-grinds them so they are matched.
Scat cam blanks are much harder than the EP12/SC-1 blanks.

Without a doubt, the most successful combination I have used in the motors I have built.

Even a Pro-Stock motor running 8,500rpm with some K-800 valve springs shimmed up tight are no match.
3 seasons and the cam/ lifters look and measure like new.



What I have found about the ever popular 86B Webcam, is that it NEEDs lots of spring pressure to keep in control. NOt something you want to run in a hot street motor. Don't plan on changing springs every year.
Also, the 86B wants 9.5/1 compression at least to work right.
Not exactly pump gas friendly.
You "can" run less octane, and you can run less spring, but you are giving up the potential that cam has.

So, as a cam that seems like it would be good for a hot street motor, it acts more like a full race grind.

Lastly, the 86B is hard on lifter bores. Noisy when hot too.

I much prefer a milder ramp cam that doesn't beat the heck out of the case and heads.

I have said my piece.
Take it for what it's worth.

[modok]

What you hear about camshafts is half garbage. Just like oil batteries and politics.
If you want to know about ramps on a camshaft, measure the ramps on the camshaft. It's very simple. It would be nice if all things were so simple.