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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:09 pm Post subject: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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I have an 83 1,6 td that was first a non turbo. I added a turbo with help from this forum. The van runs great, still don't have a muffler or cat but, just a bit noisy. I don't run high boost, around 10 -15 max and my Egt's don't get past 1200 at max. Mostly 1000 and below. Oil temp is normal. I only worry about hot days when it gets a little above those temp unless I take breaks. Is it worth adding an inter cooler to a set up like this? I want to make the engine last as long as possible, I really like the diesel Vanagon. |
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?Waldo? Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006 Posts: 9752 Location: Where?
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Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:18 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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With a decent intercooler setup, if you did not increase fueling any you would have a small amount more power and see ~150°F drop in EGTs. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 5:01 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Thanks, I suppose that 150 degrees could be really important one day. |
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?Waldo? Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006 Posts: 9752 Location: Where?
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Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Reducing the peak cylinder temps will reduce the occurrence of the cracks in the pre-chamber inserts and the cracks on the combustion face of the cylinder head. Aside from failure of the timing belt due to lack of maintenance, those cracks are probably the most common cause of engine death on the IDI engines installed in vanagons. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Good info, I've seen other 1.6 TD for sale wo intercooler so I wasn't sure if wasn't totally needed. Well it isn't I guess but probably a good investment for the motor. Maybe I'm only getting away with it because the turbo is so small, K03. |
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old_man Samba Member
Joined: June 19, 2018 Posts: 1381 Location: Newfoundland
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Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:22 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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ndorian wrote: |
Good info, I've seen other 1.6 TD for sale wo intercooler so I wasn't sure if wasn't totally needed. Well it isn't I guess but probably a good investment for the motor. Maybe I'm only getting away with it because the turbo is so small, K03. |
The 1.6TD (JX) left the factory without an intercooler. |
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?Waldo? Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006 Posts: 9752 Location: Where?
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Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:46 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Yes, an intercooler is not strictly needed. However, the 1.6TD (JX) suffered more in vanagons than in other vehicles due to the heavier load and greater wind resistance. Also, if memory serves ndorian does not have a JX but rather added a turbo to a stock non-turbo engine which does not have the piston cooling oil jets. Temperature control is a bit more important than with a stock JX. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2020 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Yes that is a fact no cooling jets for pistons. |
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Alan Brase Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 4532 Location: Cedar Falls, Iowa
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Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:20 am Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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So, what would be the best way to add an intercooler to a 1.6TD?
Mine's not a JX either, but a 85 Quantum TD motor.
Might consider a Jetta exhaust manifold and the other turbo, too, as the Vanagon is currently in the shop after collision damage.
This one has the DX 5 speed, so not subjecting it to continuous 4500rpm like previous 1982. _________________ Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
Vanagons:
80 P27 Westy JUL 1979, 3rd oldest known US
83 1.6TD Vanagon, 87 Wolfie Westy daily driver, swap meet home |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Sat May 02, 2020 10:31 am Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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I like Gizmo's set up with a separate coolant tank. lots of ideas all over the forums. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 1:04 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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I have a Saab 900 ic to install. I have read many threads about these installs. I am pretty sure that I will have to cut into my outer shell sheet metal to get optimum airflow. Even before the ic I had the idea to vent the engine bay with a 4" fan by cutting a hole between the license plate and the left taillight. It always smells so hot back there after a long hard run. Reading old threads on these installs I found much info about venting, high and low pressure in the D pillar, and the routes different people chose. I am thinking of doing a mixture of those, although I can't be certain b/c the good pics of ductwork done one good installs is NLA. My idea is to cut a 6-7" hole in the bottom of the D pillar and mount a puller fan there. Next is to shield the hole from positive pressure by putting a sheet metal duct over the fan and hole that will vent toward the rear. Cutting the valance under the bumper seems inevitable at this point. I will put a 3-4" vent there. Since I plan to seal off the D pillar so the ic gets all the flow, I am thinking about putting a 4" vent between the license plate and taillight as I was thinking like that before anyway. That would help with the loss of the D pillar cooling for the rest of the engine.
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12103 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 4:55 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Instead of cutting the visual part of the body, why not vent it directly below the pillar? Somewhere in here is a thread where a guy installed a Saab IC in the pillar and cut out the body at the base and installed a sealed duct below to the rear of the van. With the pillar sealed from the engine compartment, this allowed a direct path from the high pressure beginning at the grille to a low pressure end at the rear of the van with the IC directly in that pathway. _________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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AndyBees Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2008 Posts: 2312 Location: Southeast Kentucky
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Posted: Sun Nov 14, 2021 8:59 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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In the link below, scroll down the page to Post #1328 and then on down until you see "Inter Cooler & Related"
The links under Inter Cooler & Related will show you what I used and how I mounted the Inter Cooler for my ALH TDI. You will need to note the Post # in each link so you can find the Post. The pages are quite long. Also, you'll likely see Edits in Red which in most cases are clarifications or to let readers know that I may have made changes later.
https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/alh-t...98/page-45
I've seen EGT above 1200f very few times. I've occasionally seen EGTs above 1000f. Typically, EGTs range from around 500f to 750-800f. I have a McNally EGT/Coolant Temp combo gauge! _________________ '84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:38 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Hey thanks for the links, jealous of you TDI people.
Cutting the visual part was to vent the whole engine bay actually. I have a 1.6 that, in my mind, runs hot. I monitor EGT's and oil temps and the gauges say I'm o.k., although I have seen oil temp at 235 on a hot day. I have an oil cooler too. I worry about the engine heat, so a vent beside the license was for overall engine venting. That is a lot of cutting though, so I will probably just do the pillar bottom and some of the valance, then duct it as described. |
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AndyBees Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2008 Posts: 2312 Location: Southeast Kentucky
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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As a test, prop open the License Plate door for a few runs on the road to see how it affects the engine temp. _________________ '84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:52 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Wow, you have the pillar sealed off with plexiglass? Your van is nice, steampunk even. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:03 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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Ok, so when van is sitting in traffic, the hot air in the engine compartment is going to vent out through the top vent. Did you worry at all about losing that venting ability? |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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I just saw that post, that is something I hadn't thought of, good idea. |
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ndorian Samba Member
Joined: June 23, 2018 Posts: 760 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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See, my gauge never gets to 1/2 way. I know the gauge will go higher because I broke a water pump belt on my way home from buying it and it went up and flashed and buzzed, I think. So, I would need to put in a more accurate water temp. gauge and sensor, I think. |
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AndyBees Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2008 Posts: 2312 Location: Southeast Kentucky
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Posted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: Intercooler benefits to 1.6 td |
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ndorian, my engine has never shown any indication of overheating in more than 85k miles since putting it in service in August, 2012.
Of interest, the mechanical coolant temp gauge pressure pipe come loose under the dash on a very long road trip on the first day. I drove it for the next 30 days and more than 12k miles without the cooling system pressurized ......... it never over-heated or lost any coolant.
I sort of doubt that your engine is running hot. I suggest that you proceed with a plan to install an Inter Cooler and prepare to monitor Boost, EGT and coolant temp with quality gauges!
Your engine will benefit from an Inter Cooler as others have suggested. _________________ '84 Vanagon Tin-top, ALH TDI. 1989 Tin-top
1983 Air-cool, 225k miles, 180k miles mine. Seven trips to Alaska from 1986 thru 2003. |
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