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Question on a Bagged Bug
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balljoint
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 11:23 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Do it with everyting mounted on the car to be 100% sure.

If you cant see because the body is in the way take off the tyre, put a jack under the hub and carry it all the way up and have a look at the BJ.

You can also take a measurement from the middle of the hub up to the fender when the car is dropped and compare this to when you jack it up as described above.
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AcroChace
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 11:00 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Airkewld wrote:
balljoint wrote:
Lift off one of the boots on the BJ and see if its hitting the the end of it travel in the groove
I mentioned that to him as well.

I have had ball joints come across my shop that the cut out to match the arms were in the wrong place... it happens and we found it. So lifting the boots off make an assumption.... a fact. Thanks for commenting.


I did do this after our conversation the other day. I pulled the arms and the boots off the double check everything and it was all inline. reinstalled everything and left off the air shocks and the tie rods to see if there was a binding issue there and it was the same. upon me looking it looks as if the bottom of the pan head under the beam has been cut so i think that maybe the reason its not laying. it likes about a 1 1/2 inchs. ive ordered new lower tires for the front. so that should get me to within 1/2 inch from laying. ill rebuild the lower pan head section and roll with it.
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Airkewld
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:45 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

balljoint wrote:
Lift off one of the boots on the BJ and see if its hitting the the end of it travel in the groove
I mentioned that to him as well.

I have had ball joints come across my shop that the cut out to match the arms were in the wrong place... it happens and we found it. So lifting the boots off make an assumption.... a fact. Thanks for commenting.
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balljoint
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:42 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Lift off one of the boots on the BJ and see if its hitting the the end of it travel in the groove
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Airkewld
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:22 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Airkewld wrote:

I can tell you have automotive education (Appreciate you stating that) but you are not listening to person who posted. You don't work with VW's doing extreme things like air ride. We have never spoke, or maybe we have. I have 18 years under my belt, just with this business.


I have been working professionally on VWs for over 30 years. I have purchased one of your kits before & installed several of yours & others for customers.

Airkewld wrote:

No one is gaining travel to drive it maxed out either direction. If he wants to get as low as possible, I gave him some tips. You don't care what this guy wants to do or want to help him get there. So don't discredit my knowledge. I am not saying your stupid for keep your car OEM...


I did not say that you were stupid, just that your suggestion to, effectively, hyper-extend the balljoints was. If this is not how you meant it then you need to be PERFECTLY clear about this so that someone doesn't do it, this is dangerous.


There are many people that are installing your & many other manufacturers products, that should not be putting a wrench to a car. An incorrectly worded statement/suggestion regarding steering/suspension components can hurt or even kill.


Appreciate the clarifications. I am open to understanding how to word min's and max's of suspension travel to which I would not encourage people to drive at those positions. I have the conversation with clients about this exact subject. So anything to word it better, I am all ears my friend. Hope you are well.
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TDCTDI
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:54 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Airkewld wrote:

I can tell you have automotive education (Appreciate you stating that) but you are not listening to person who posted. You don't work with VW's doing extreme things like air ride. We have never spoke, or maybe we have. I have 18 years under my belt, just with this business.


I have been working professionally on VWs for over 30 years. I have purchased one of your kits before & installed several of yours & others for customers.

Airkewld wrote:

No one is gaining travel to drive it maxed out either direction. If he wants to get as low as possible, I gave him some tips. You don't care what this guy wants to do or want to help him get there. So don't discredit my knowledge. I am not saying your stupid for keep your car OEM...


I did not say that you were stupid, just that your suggestion to, effectively, hyper-extend the balljoints was. If this is not how you meant it then you need to be PERFECTLY clear about this so that someone doesn't do it, this is dangerous.


There are many people that are installing your & many other manufacturers products, that should not be putting a wrench to a car. An incorrectly worded statement/suggestion regarding steering/suspension components can hurt or even kill.
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Airkewld
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Pressing in new ball joints can cause them to become tight & cause them to be overly stiff to the point that the "self centering" of the steering or even smooth travel of the suspension can be affected. Bottoming of the maximum travel of a ball joint is NEVER an acceptable way to gain travel of said ball joint/s. Suggesting that people to do it ridiculously stupid on your part.


I can tell you have automotive education (Appreciate you stating that) but you are not listening to person who posted. You don't work with VW's doing extreme things like air ride. We have never spoke, or maybe we have. I have 18 years under my belt, just with this business. No one is gaining travel to drive it maxed out either direction. If he wants to get as low as possible, I gave him some tips. You don't care what this guy wants to do or want to help him get there. So don't discredit my knowledge. I am not saying your stupid for keep your car OEM, we all love these car for different reasons and all have different visions.

Either help him to get lower or don't comment. There are millions of topics on here who can use your OEM expertise.

Stay safe, stay healthy.
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TDCTDI
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Pressing in new ball joints can cause them to become tight & cause them to be overly stiff to the point that the "self centering" of the steering or even smooth travel of the suspension can be affected. Bottoming of the maximum travel of a ball joint is NEVER an acceptable way to gain travel of said ball joint/s. Suggesting that people to do it ridiculously stupid on your part.
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Airkewld
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:11 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

AcroChace wrote:
FullFender wrote:
TDCTDI wrote:
Besides, "laying frame" is one of the stupidest fucking things one could hope to achieve. This is incredibly dangerous. If, for any reason, any part of your system fails, the car drops & the frame digs in, not a pleasant thing for you, any other occupants, or any other drivers around you.


there's the samba we all know and love. Where is the dead horse when you need it??


Im use to comments like that I have a featured minitruck that lays body that i drive alot in the summer time, i find them funny. Everyone says when "Something" happens, Ive been building minitrucks, rat rods and customs for about 18 yrs and i still get a laugh from it because "Something" could happen to a stock vehicle.
I 100% agree with you. I reference the same statement often.
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AcroChace
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:08 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

FullFender wrote:
TDCTDI wrote:
Besides, "laying frame" is one of the stupidest fucking things one could hope to achieve. This is incredibly dangerous. If, for any reason, any part of your system fails, the car drops & the frame digs in, not a pleasant thing for you, any other occupants, or any other drivers around you.


there's the samba we all know and love. Where is the dead horse when you need it??


Im use to comments like that I have a featured minitruck that lays body that i drive alot in the summer time, i find them funny. Everyone says when "Something" happens, Ive been building minitrucks, rat rods and customs for about 18 yrs and i still get a laugh from it because "Something" could happen to a stock vehicle.
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Airkewld
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:57 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Airkewld wrote:
We had a conversation about this my friend, the ball joints just need to break in to get some more height.


That's not "breaking in", that's pounding the balljoints hoping that they wallow out before they break. Rolling Eyes


You have the information incorrect. The ball and socket area have specific gaps inside the delrin pocket. When pressing it in it collapses. You didn't know that. No one does. If you don't know this, the socket becomes too tight and then doesn't allow it to articulate fully. Once it goes up and down and breaks in, it allows the car to go lower.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Besides, "laying frame" is one of the stupidest fucking things one could hope to achieve. This is incredibly dangerous. If, for any reason, any part of your system fails, the car drops & the frame digs in, not a pleasant thing for you, any other occupants, or any other drivers around you.


there's the samba we all know and love. Where is the dead horse when you need it??
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TDCTDI
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:22 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Besides, "laying frame" is one of the stupidest fucking things one could hope to achieve. This is incredibly dangerous. If, for any reason, any part of your system fails, the car drops & the frame digs in, not a pleasant thing for you, any other occupants, or any other drivers around you.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:06 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

TDCTDI wrote:
Airkewld wrote:
We had a conversation about this my friend, the ball joints just need to break in to get some more height.


That's not "breaking in", that's pounding the balljoints hoping that they wallow out before they break. Rolling Eyes


right? ball joints breaking in? WTF
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:17 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

Airkewld wrote:
We had a conversation about this my friend, the ball joints just need to break in to get some more height.


That's not "breaking in", that's pounding the balljoints hoping that they wallow out before they break. Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

We had a conversation about this my friend, the ball joints just need to break in to get some more height. Remove the shocks from the equation. If the car is the same height, the ball joints are what is holding it up. You can't change it. If you have short side wall tire, you get shorter. That is all you can do. Good luck with the build my friend.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:43 pm    Post subject: Question on a Bagged Bug Reply with quote

I have been taking my vw apart and doing air ride and floor pans during this covid-19 stay at home. I have a problem with the front now wanting to lay out all the way. I have talked so acouple people with bagged bugs and they say they lay flat with no problem. i am running a ultimate beam from airkewld with there air ride set up, 2 1/2 drop spindles, clearanced ball joints but i like about 1 1/2 from laying. It's acting like my ball joints are binding up. has anyone ran into this problem? yes the ball joints have been installed correctly.
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