Tank reseal fun

[campism]

This job has been needing to be done for years and I finally decided to do it, and am starting this thread to record all the annoying little things that might have been missed in other narratives on the topic. Ordered the kit from Van Cafe/RMW because of their aluminum fittings after reading so many horror stories about the embrittled plastic pieces breaking. Glad I did. You can also see my little jumper wire that I had previously made to troubleshoot the Westy sink pump but which came in very handy here.

First annoying thing. Ken's (Vanagain) excellent video on this job says to use the van's fuel pump to empty the tank. Wonderful suggestion. However, even though I knew to remove the rightmost relay in the relay box in the engine compartment and that the box opens from the left, I did not know you could not reach the two latches on the left side so I had to remove one mounting screw so I could rotate the box for latch access. I'm no fan of the Vanagon engine compartment and have said so before.

Here's the jumper ready to be connected with the top spade connector in the vertical orientation and the lower one horizontal. Even with the ignition OFF this will activate the fuel pump as soon as the second spade connector makes contact so be ready.

Ken recommends you use the tap for checking fuel pressure and run a hose from there to your gas can. With that in place, jumper the relay and stand by while the fuel pump does its thing. Might want to have your fire extinguisher handy, just in case. I did not need mine.

Once the tank was empty I thought I'd try to see what I was getting into by using the Harbor Freight boroscope camera I bought for a bathroom model ("What IS inside that wall there?") but it worked better in the wall than for the tank. Oh, well, maybe there won't be a terrible surprise.

Time to start breaking stuff. Remove the three screws hiding behind the gas cap so you can remove the filler tube. It's reluctant to come unseated so be prepared to wrestle with it. Bad lighting does not show the seam where the smaller vent tube joins near the top of the filler but it comes apart there and you can then pull the filler out of the tank. That vent tube will be removed once you get the tank out of the van.

At this point I wanted the tank supported so got the floor jack and a piece of plywood in position. When jacking upward and the ply contacts the bottom of the tank, STOP. Any further and you'll start oilcanning the bottom of the tank. It seems to give very easily and I did not want to have to find out how to undent mine.

Each support strap has a 13mm bolt at its front end so undo those and let the straps drop. At the back end you'll need to work them loose. I had about 13 inches clearance from floor to bottom of tank and that was not enough so I used an adjustable wrench to slightly flatten the two ears on eash strap so they'd slide out of their slots.

Once the straps are out you can drop the rear end of the tank and you'll be able to reach some of the vent fittings. The first one I touched broke. Glad I paid extra for the aluminum. Slide the tank rearward in order to drop the front, cut the remaining vent hoses but not that frontmost plastic one on the right, that goes to the filler tube and it gets reused so just wait until the tank's out to remove that one.

There was not as much crud on top of the tank as I expected. Must be the low miles and not many dirt roads. You can see the crossover vent that came loose during the removal. That and the grommets and the plastic fittings looked good so the leak(s) must have come from the rubber hoses on the vent tubes; a couple of them were frayed and rotten looking so that must be it.

The fuel sender unscrews pretty easily. I used a chisel and gave it a partial twist.

Tank looks pretty good inside, despite what my HF camera did or did not show me.

The metal vent tube on the driver's side was clogged with what appeared to be rust. I rodded it out and got it clear. This is the last little bit after I lost about three times as much on the first tap.

That's it for part one. I scrubbed the tank and straps in preparation for reinstall and might paint them. Stay tuned for part two.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[dhaavers]

So far, so far!

- Dave
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS>

[campism]

Did a little more on the tank today. I worked on getting the hoses cut and clamped for fitting. Dug out one of my dad's old tools to pinch the clamps tightly shut.

After doing some more reading I decided to check the grommets, not part of the reseal kit, in the overflow tanks and one of them was bad. Another source of fumes and possibly the spilling on fillups. These had to be ordered separately so I got online and got that in the works.

Had about half a can of Rustoleum black so decided to paint the tank and will also do the support straps.

Since the overflow tanks sit outboard of the frame rails they can be reinstalled later so I'll continue with the fuel tank reinstall once the paint dries.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[dobryan]

Good idea to inspect the overflow tank grommets. They are a common source of water and grit getting into the gas tank. btdt.
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Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794

[campism]

I would think there'd be way to insulate those grommets better once they're in place. Does the water/dirt intrusion occur because the grommets fail or in spite of their presence? If they are inadequate for the task then they should be bolstered. I have not had any problems attributable to failed ones but I might try a preventive fix with the new ones anyway.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[levi]

I remember with mine that I blocked the outlet on the bottom and with a half gallon of gas inside I swished it around and then dumped into a white 5 gallon bucket, checking for rust or other crud from the center where I think there's a mesh.

Cinder blocks and wood slats came in handy for inching it back up into place. Seems like connecting those plastic fittings for the crossover was the most tedious part for me. Looking good!

I wonder if wrapping the overflow tanks with duct tape might help?
I had one of those tanks acquire a hole about the size of a dime on the upper rear of the plastic tank. Only thing I could figure is a sharp rock ricocheting onto the brittle plastic did that?
Dunno how it happened, but that let in water.
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One of these days I'm gonna settle down,
but till I do I won't be hangin round.
Going down that long lonesome highway,
gonna see life my way

https://youtu.be/cSrL0BXsO40

[dobryan]

[campism]

I'll keep an eye on that. All good information. Might even hang onto the old grommet pieces just in case I need to Shoe Goo (or silicone caulk, or whatever) them in. The second grommet that seemed to be okay tore during removal and the one that was already torn, the one in the photo above, is also kind of gummy on the inside like it is beginning to dissolve. Googling the manufacturer's number on the item #N90100501 molded on my originals brings up several of our venerable vendors, one of whom I patronized for my replacements, but even they say these are recently found reproductions of the NLA originals.

While waiting for my other parts I painted the tank and straps. It occurred to me that I probably should have used silver paint for contrast under the van during the reinstall. That new black paint might make it too much like a cave and make things even more difficult.

Meanwhile, I'm sourcing some engine oil and gear lube so I can change those also while still in the garage, but I don't want to turn this into another dreaded oil thread. This job could have been completed in a day if not painting and if all the parts had been handy. One of the problems with an immobilized van is that nothing else happens until the job gets finished.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[campism]

A little more progress. Got the grommets installed in the tank and began the reinstall but hit an obstacle; the crossover 1/2" rubber hose supplied is 22" long and the resulting fit is just too tight for me to be able to manage plugging the fittings in.

I heard about the difficulty of this part and I don't know how anyone gets their hands in past the frame rails to do that, so it was off the the FLAPS for a four-foot length of 1/2" hose that I will cut to length when I figure out how much I need. The plan is to try plugging in the crossover with the tank down low so I can reach it with enough slack for that to work.

In addition, as much as I like the idea of the aluminum fittings I wish they'd made them in the originals' Y-shape instead of this T shape. I think it would make for easier routing over the frame rails. Have any of you used this kit and do you have input on that fitting shape?

Also, I poured the old gas from this tank into my Mopar minivan and went out for five gallons of fresh to put into the VW when I'm ready. I used about a cupful to rinse out this tank before the install and got just a few teensy flakes (Dirt? Rust?) so I feel pretty good about reusing this tank.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[DanHoug]

i used the aluminum Tee fittings and was glad i paid the extra to get them. no worries about cracking them as lines are put in place. just need a little bit extra length. i cracked the plastic ones just lowering the tank, wrong material for this location.
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-dan
60% of what you find on the internet is wrong, including this post.

'87 Westy & '89 Westy both 2.1 4spd

Past projects can be found at--
www.thefixitworkshop.com

[dobryan]

I can get my hands and wrist over the frame rails to push or pull the grommets but I be Abbynormal.
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Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646

Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371

The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794

[MarkWard]

I also install the nipples with the tank installed. I do remove the front tires. I also place the crossover rig into rough position. Be sure your using the correct hole on the r/s. The more rear one is for the crossover. The slightly outer front hole is for the overflow. That might be the length problem.
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[campism]

[valvecovergasket]

[bobbyblack]

[campism]

A little more progress today. I bought 4' of hose to work with and it turns out I used 28" of it, about 6" longer than the vendor-supplied section for the crossover. That let me plug in the driver's side while the tank was still low enough for access to the topside and then route the crossover above the center section and then down on the passenger side with enough slack to work with so I could plug it in once the tank was jacked into position. I don't see how you people manage this task. I could have used Abbynormal or one of those kids from Schindler's List (no offense) who had hands small enough to polish the inside of the artillery shells. No freakin' way I was going to be able to do it. Plugging in the second vent on the right side, the one that goes to the filler tube, was no easier, but it's done now. I had to use a prybar to force the fittings down into the grommets since I could not get my hand in there with enough force to do it.

Here's a stock vent fitting with the aluminum one. You can see how the stock angles might improve the approach of the hoses to the frame rails or the crossover, but the metal ones are hella stout. I was just concerned that the fit with the right angles might be stressed by the routing of the various hoses.

My new grommets arrived just as I was getting to the point of needing them. Got some Vaseline on them and put them on the tanks. My wife made me share the Van Cafe cookie with her.

Overflow tanks ready to go back in. That can wait for tomorrow.

I'm also concerned about the press fit of the filler neck into the tank grommet but it seems to have worked fine for the last 33 years so I guess I shouldn't be worried. I never would have thought that seal--for gasoline-- would be adequate.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[Microbusdeluxe]

Well in normal times the little plastic tanks don't contain gasoline, just if you overfill &/or it's a scorching hot day.
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'69 Squareback RIP
'65 21 window deluxe sold before the price spike, damn it.
'70 rhd bay now a taxi in South Sudan
'81 Westy sold
'89 hightop Westy Joker syncro 16" now with Bostig!

[campism]

I was talking about the filler tube neck for all those fun times at the gas station, referencing @bobbyblack's post.
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'87 Westy in Wolfram Grey Metallic

[SteveVanB]

Im not so sure using vaseline on those grommets was a good idea. Vaseline is petroleum based and will eat the rubber grommets.
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91 CARAT

[MarkWard]

Years ago, I bought a small tube of silicone lube/grease from the local hardware store. It works great for the tank and expansion tank grommets. Haven’t had a failure that I know of.

I have no evidence, but am suspect of the alcohol laced fuel attacking the grommets. My Syncro tank is completely resealed, but have been using Rec 90
unleaded for now. I have noticed the diesel tank grommets seem to hold up great. Plan was to convert the Syncro to diesel at some point and am trying to maintain my tank grommets.

My opinion is unscientific. Just something I’ve noticed.
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