Rear Fender Vents

[Multi69s]

Hopefully someone has cut up a squareback, and can answer this. I'm in the middle of a major redo / upgrade of my 73 squareback and one of the things I'm doing is to make a cold air system for my dual carbs. However, it doesn't look like the drivers side fender vents are actually connected air intake cavity. I had the engine out and I looked into cavity (bellow mounting location) and my friend shined a light into the fender vent and I didn't see any light. Are these vents just for looks?
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69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[KTPhil]

Definitely functional!

Check photos in this link:
https://vwispwest.com/air-duct-311813411/

It's far from a direct path so the light is probably being blocked.

I bet some serious build threads have photos with metal removed so you can see the whole path, and plan your ductwork mods.

[Multi69s]

My next step is to use a leaf blower, and shoot air from the bellow area towards the fender.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[cpaz5150]

Yeah, what Phil said. The fender vents connect to other hidden passages behind the rear apron area and that connects to your fan shroud via the bellow boot. Since it's exposed to the elements, the passages are not direct (that's also part of the reason for the drain flaps you see down below on the engine side. It's possible you don't see light through there due to some sort of blockage by nature (mud wasps/dirt daubers, leaves, years of dust and debris, etc.). Your approach with the leaf blower may help clear it if it is actually blocked though. If not, your best way in there is through the oval port that connects with the bellow boot; that way you can reach in there with your arm mostly (unless of course you remove the apron for other heavy body repair). Good luck with the investigation!

[Bobnotch]

Maybe these will help you some. Squareback behind the fenders. You can also see the ECU mounting plate.

Note the air enters the slot along the top, then dumps into the big tin structure, (ribbed pocket) before tunneling into the rear apron.

A Notchback inside the rear apron shot. Note later cars don't have the air divider. in front of the cooling boot.

I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120

[KTPhil]

What carbs do you have? The stock VW/Solex setup had a cold air intake with a weighted flap for heated idle air.

Some made a custom air system that used the same source:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=676126

[Multi69s]

Used the leaf blower and I am getting air through the driver's side vent, just not as much as the passengers side.

The original cold air intake will not flow enough air to support my engine. It's a pumped up 2056cc Type 4 engine with dual 40 DCNFs. So as you can see in the pic, I am increasing my air flow.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[Multi69s]

Forgot Pic

_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[Erik G]

At the risk of being blasted again, I'll re-ask. Does it really matter?

A Chevy 454 big block with a 4 barrel used an air cleaner opening about that size if not smaller. Do we really have that kind of need, or any data to support it?

This is a buick 455 360hp 510ftlb torque wildcat motor.

I'm all for innovation and cool things but this seems like a lot for maybe zero real gain

[Multi69s]

No Blast: However, stock does not always mean highest horsepower. Cost, spacing, est, are taken into account when a manufacturer designs a car. Here is a dyno run for a V8, by Engine Masters.

Switching from the stock air cleaner to a 4" air cleaner gained them at peak 14 horsepower. However, on the other side of the coin, they lost 21 horsepower when using a 2" air cleaner. So intake restriction does cost power. It also impacts throttle response as well.

However, for myself, I am more concerned with drive-ability, especially during the summer. From first hand experience, I can tell you that my engine does not like to suck in hot engine air during the summer.

So not only am I concerned with restricting air to the carbs, but building two fresh air intakes will be easier than making one that connects both carbs.

I will say that the builder did a beautiful job on the red fresh air system, and mine will not be quite as nice as his.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[notchboy]

Id be more interested if you actually do it, monitor it, prove it to be a better solution with data. But as things are and ideas being just that, the odds are against you.

Prove me wrong. I hope you do.

Not being harsh, not hating. Just being real. See these things come up from time to time with little follow through.

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[Multi69s]

The only proof that I need: is easy starting when hot, and good stop light to stop light manners next summer. As far as Data logging, or dyno pulls, that ain't going to happen.

However, I do plan on doing some seat of the pants comparison this summer.

In any good study or collection of data you always start out with a Hypothesis. Then you go out and either prove the Hypothesis right or wrong. So by going will the general vibe of the forum, the Hypothesis would be.

Adding dual cold air intakes to a dual carbed Type 3 vehicle WILL NOT improve performance or driveability.

I actually took my Squareback out for its first road test today after doing some extensive mods to the engine (another post), and its running great. However, is pretty cold, with high humidity, so just about anything would run good. So, we'll have to wait a while until the Hypothesis will be proved or disproved. I always post my failures as well as my successes.
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[notchboy]

Driving these old air cooled motors on a cool damp morning never gets old.


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[Multi69s]

I just did a Major freshen up of my Type 4 engine, and its a blast to drive now. I used AA piston set and the rings never seated (85 psi) compression. I did a lot more, but I always wonder if the folks in this forum want to hear about Type 4 stuff.

Thoughts?
_________________
69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
My builds
T4 into Squareback http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=458944&highlight=
Auto Trans Rebuild http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=516066&highlight=
AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[dougefresh]

[Bobnotch]

I have no problem with type 4 stuff in the type 3 forum. My son has a 1700 type 4 engine out of a 914 in his Pile of Bleached bones type 3. Plus he bought some carb manifolds from you for his project. He's also got a 2.0L type 4 engine from a bus sitting in the shed that he wants to build up some day. He's using the "small" 1700 engine to learn from.
Not to mention that Ray swings by to visit every now and then. Plus Clatter (Steve) has a type 4 engine in his beautiful 67 Fastback. And there are others with a type 4 engine in their type 3s, not including you.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120

[notchboy]

There's lots of Type 4 interest here for sure. I have a 2.3 Camper Special in my 77 Westfalia. Not to mention others with cross over cars like later Bay window buses.
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[W1K1]

[Jason37]

If you want to get some rough numbers to back up the seat of the pants, there is an APP, https://www.perfexpert-app.com/ that might be of some interest.