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SS100 "replica" Kit Kar
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2023 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

It’s really not a symmetrical in the way you think.

I might end up having some shims in the end to get it exactly so, but I am going to stretch this frame and twist it.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2023 5:58 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

The frame extension is really pretty heavy.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I removed the bolts and rolled it off on the floor jack.

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The headframe is crusty and has pinhole perforations along the bottom.


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It’s not really this bent. But it is off by 0.7°, down on the driver side. The iPhone fisheye camera affect makes it look worse than it really is.

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Some of the perforations were larger than pinholes and you can see an ice pick a sticking out of one at the bottom of the photo. This metal will all have to change around the bottom.

So I am finally at the point where I can actually start cutting this frame but in the process of looking and measuring I realized that I have another problem.

The rear swingarm on the driver side has over an inch more droop than the passenger side. I thought one side had a shorter shock absorber but this is not the case. I would consider the torsion bar housing is twisted except that it’s perfectly level at the shock towers.

I’m not sure what’s up with that and I will have to do some more examination in the cold light of day. I don’t think this is a matter of saggy rubber bushings But I haven’t had them all the way apart yet.

I hope I don’t have something cracked, but up to this point I haven’t noticed anything, and I’ve been under there a lot.
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DeathBySnuSnu
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2023 12:20 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I did my set up very similar.
Bar in the bottom socket. Got it all square and where I wanted it, tack welded in place and looking good. Then put the beam in. The bottom beam/lower ball joint all very good, feeling happy about it. Then started
moving the travel up and down (grubs cut loose in the middle) and i was getting something different from side to side. Checked a lot of stuff, beam not bent (no curve to it), location squareness....ect.
What I found was the bottom was square....but the top beam was not. The best guess is the donar car was wrecked without visibly bending anything on the beam and frame. it seem the drivers side top socket was pushed back roughly 1/4" without leaving any visible clues....not even a scratch. The top beam was not bent, just out of alignment with the bottom beam.
I has to split several factory welds and twist/rack the top inline with bottom and weld back up. Shim in the one side with out of line socket.

So......bottom line.....it was so perfect condition that it makes me wonder if it was in factory tolorance.
CHECK the top vs the bottom.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2023 4:43 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I set the front beam up and checked it with the digital level and it is not bent warped or twisted more than the tiniest fraction of a degree. This discrepancy I noted could be attributed to thick paint variations.

None of that concerns me but this does. Here is the driver side swingarm stop.

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And the passenger side.

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You can see that the casting looks quite different from the factory.I think there was a little core slippage. Anyhow, the swing arm sits different by over a degree from side to side.

This discrepancy causes the car to look crooked from the back when it is unladen. Under load, the driver side swingarm is always coming off the stop before the passenger side. That means the passenger side has more preload applied. (I hope the torsion bars are equally clocked, and I haven’t checked that yet.)

The handling of the car underway would tell me they are ok. Ultimately I can fix this (basically cosmetic) problem just by judicious shaving of the stop on one side, and maybe a little shim on the other.

I need to make me a better swing arm lifter before I do this because my first one was less than ideal. OK it was total junk. I didn’t even post a picture of it.
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DeathBySnuSnu
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2023 8:06 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Good you are checking things... like i said mine was digital level on both beams.....was not the plane that was off.

The rear torsion springs are on splines at both ends. Different tooth count inner to outer. By adjusting tooth engagement you can index the spring plates at 50 second intervals....roughly equaling 0.22" at the wheel up or down.

It is typical to have to adjust the springs with having a lighter body and different weight distribution.
You do not want it topped out just like you dont want bottomed out. So once adjusted and the weight on the wheels it should be well off the stops (up and down).
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Dale M.
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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2023 6:19 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

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Ulu
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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2023 10:14 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Thank goodness you didn’t post a chart scheduled in a radians! Wink

I thank you guys. Your attention means a lot.

This car is not super light in the rear. But the left side was definitely coming off the stop before the right.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2023 4:20 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I spent a lot of time burnishing hardware on the rear suspension arms, shock absorbers, and axles, and giving them an anti-corrosion coating.

I am making my first relief cuts in the damaged frame area, and here I stopped to change the cut-off wheel.

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My plan from the beginning was to aim directly for the nuts.

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I got to a point where it was starting to pinch the disc and it was because the frame is starting to relieve itself. In the photo I have just started the first cross cut, but I have since cut the bottom plate in two.

This relieved some of the frame twist, but not nearly enough.

Meanwhile there was an ancient mouse nest, with some kind of tiny seeds in it, concealed in the tunnel. I caught that on fire and had to blow it out of the tunnel with an air hose.

I expected something like this and I have a fire extinguisher close by, plus a garden hose, but it was very minor in the end.

Just a bit stinky like a hay fire.
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oprn
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 5:12 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Laughing Laughing Laughing

Yes! Always surprises when working on these old cars!
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 7:52 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I returned to working on the rear suspension yesterday. There were still too many layers of paint over dirt and rust. I started cleaning it up and I was going for the patina look.

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But when I got those spring plate covers off I found that one was terrible and the other one was totally unusable. Which sounds funny because they were still working when I drove the car. The rubbers looked OK.

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This is a two piece welded assembly. It’s designed to let the water drain out of it, but the drains are totally clogged with rust and dirt. After a minor declogging:
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I bought these chromed versions sold by EMPI, and this is one more example of why I would avoid their parts.

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These were made for a slightly different car, with dual spring plates, and I had to remove the four stand off bushings. Fortunately they’re only lightly riveted in, and after drilling them out 1/32” they pop loose with the aid of a vise.

The first one went on perfectly well. This one took some rework. The hole pattern wasn’t centered up perfectly when they stamped this and spot welded it.

I had to re-drill all four holes to 1/2” diameter in order to get it to center up, and even then I did a little bodywork to it, defacing the chrome, because there was not enough socket clearance after moving the holes.

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This one is still not centered correctly and I will have to slot the holes a little more to get it backwards 1/16”

I have bought many products from EMPI over the years, and some of their stuff is just fine. But some of the stuff has extremely poor quality control and this is one example. Also I didn’t care about the Chrome as it was nothing to cheer about regarding the quality of the polish or thickness of the chrome. I’m going to etch them and paint them black.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 10:15 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I was determined to get the bottom off of the headframe today, and armed with my trusty grinder and a few cut off discs I laid into it with gusto.

I don’t have a rollover trunnion, so I just hoisted the frame up in the air on its tail bones.

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After cutting all the way around I realized that some of the metal I thought was rusted completely away inside the frame was still attached. I had to cut a window into the frame so I could see what was going on.

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So this is what was going on. Big patches welded under the frame, and lots of toasty mouse nests, roasted with the grinding heat.

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I plugged that window back in place, and you can see that the original tunnel bottom in that area was completely rusted away and there is no original Volkswagen bottom left inside the headframe.

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Looking up inside the tunnel, I can see more mouse nest.

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Also I see I just barely kissed the fuel line with my grinder. Just enough to wipe the rust off.

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You can see I still have another foot of Tunnel bottom to remove here but this will be easy by comparison to what I have done.

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Twisting the headframe around into alignment will be no problem now, because it is quite flexible with the bottom removed.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2023 5:59 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I chopped out another foot from the bottom of the tunnel, and then I flushed out the whole frame with a garden hose, and an air hose, and the high-volume air hose from my shop vac, until it was all dry again.

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In the process I uncovered a considerable amount of mouse nest and debris.

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Evidently the mouse hole wasn’t big enough and they had to take a torch & enlarge it.

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I found both of those bits still inside the frame.

I removed the pedal set so I could figure out how far the rust damage went and it goes another foot on the driver side. Was this the car sitting in a swamp?

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It’s been repaired but it looks like I’m going to have to do some repairing to the repairing. The good part is this doesn’t have to be official Volkswagen anything when I get done. It can be completely custom to my wishes and that’s what I’m shooting for now.
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MrGoodtunes
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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2023 7:54 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Ulu wrote:
... It can be completely custom to my wishes and that’s what I’m shooting for now.


That's the spirit, Ulu. It's what'll keep these cool little buggies going after we're gone.

This might be a consideration:

https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-internal-frame-coating-14oz-aerosol.html
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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2023 8:06 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

MrGoodtunes wrote:
Ulu wrote:
... It can be completely custom to my wishes and that’s what I’m shooting for now.


That's the spirit, Ulu. It's what'll keep these cool little buggies going after we're gone.

This might be a consideration:

https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-internal-frame-coating-14oz-aerosol.html


Thank you MrGoodtunes,
That might be a big timesaver for me. I have a gallon of phosphoric acid solution and I was going to prep the inside of the frame with that, Hit it with a neutralizing solution, then dry it back out again.
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Ulu
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2023 5:38 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

I cleaned up the bolts and the headframe face, so I can remount the appliance. I don’t like calling it an adapter because I’m not adapting two different cars together. I’m just stretching out one car by a foot. Anyhow I just need to clean that up and I can start putting the new frame together. In the meantime I started assembling it on the floor to get an idea of how much notching and trimming will be required, and how I will do the front floor.

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Unless I do a bunch of paneling, this is going to be wide open to the air. I will have to fill in with plate behind the appliance, and fill the floor completely.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This really isn’t a luggage compartment, because of the gas tank, the batteries, and brake hardware. There’s always going to be some fumes from charging batteries and venting the gasoline tank. I don’t really want it to be airtight and in fact it should also have ventilation on the top that it does not have. Previously that ventilation was coming through the passenger compartment around the firewall (which was never sealed to the cowl until I did it.)

I’m going to create tank ventilation around the base of the Jaguar ornament. This will be easy to do, and pretty invisible. The batteries will have to be the externally ventilated type unless I create a isolated battery compartment (which is entirely feasible.)

I know this thread is long and boring for some of you guys, but writing all this down helps me to figure out what I need to do.
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2023 6:07 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

All good! Hats off to you, very few would have the courage or skill to get this deep into a project!
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2023 7:56 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

If I had a lot more money I could just pay somebody to build me a frame from scratch. Instead I’m going to patch this one back together, and it will be good enough.
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2023 10:42 pm    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Ulu wrote:
My plan from the beginning was to aim directly for the nuts.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

I hope my wife doesn't start learning from you. Shocked

Why did you choose to aim directly for the nuts? My first instinct would be to aim the cut just below them. I don't use the stock pedal location in my Berry Mini-T but I did use one of the threaded holes to attach the ground strap of the battery I relocated to the front. I used the other one to install a pivot for a lever to allow me to pick up the throttle cable, then made link back to the relocated pedals with a bar from that lever to the roller throttle pedal. (I am using an oval window roller throttle for style points and compactness, a real pedal pushing it is more comfortable.)
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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2023 8:53 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

Guess where I found this?
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Last edited by Ulu on Tue May 16, 2023 9:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2023 8:59 am    Post subject: Re: SS100 "replica" Kit Kar Reply with quote

That ugly chunk of clutch cable tube was floating around inside the tunnel, and I had to extract it the hard way.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I hoisted the chassis in the air as much as possible and banged on the tunnel with a rubber mallet. Here it is from the bottom.

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There is still a big patch on the underside of the tunnel, connecting to the patch at the pedal cluster above. That’s the weld bead in the photograph (at the white arrow.)

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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Looking inside the tunnel, you can see the remaining rot. The X represents the tunnel wall. The tunnel floor is mostly patch right there.

I burnished off the mating surfaces of the appliance and the headframe and put them back together cleanly. Then I did another string check and I find that about half of the warp is still there.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Last edited by Ulu on Tue May 16, 2023 9:12 am; edited 4 times in total
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