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Fuel line smelling gas
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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 4:24 pm    Post subject: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Hello Folks, my 1991 van engine has been completely restored including many components as well as the fuel lines, but not the injectors, however when parked in the garage and walking by the rear driver-side back vent, I smell subtle gasoline smell, I repeat very subtle, when I open the engine bay ( when cold) and I stick my nose and get close to the fuel lines I could indeed smell gasoline from all four lines. I do strongly believe he the mechanic has used fuel lines going into the injectors. Obviously the question is, is this normal? One less item, we end up not utilizing the original manufacture slip covers since they were all cracked. I appreciate any guidance.
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jayinduluth
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 4:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

check your fuel line clamps. recent history is showing that some clamps are loosening after a time.
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VicVan
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 7:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Eskandrm wrote:
Obviously the question is, is this normal?

Yes. A small piece of fuel hose connects each injector to the fuel rail. Speaking of which, check it for cracks or leaks. The most probable culprit is the clamps, as stated above. Next on your list is the fuel rails.

Can you post a picture? Curious about the type of clamps used too.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 7:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Make sure the proper fuel line was used, it should say 30r9 on it somewhere if its American hose, there are European equivalents as well. Gates Barricade hose can say 30r9 and 30r14, but not 30r14 alone.
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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 7:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 7:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Those common screw clamps aren't suitable for FI as they will tend to cut into the hoses over time. Looks like you have at least two spring clamps as well, which I wouldn't use here though they may be okay if you don't live in a high salt use area. Your hoses look like they might be Cohline hoses, but I don't know what number and letters make them okay to use. Usually when using metric hose 7mm is called for though but not 100% necessary.
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VicVan
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

You want to use the clamps like the one on the bottom injector of the 3rd picture.

Among the differents things written on the hose, there should be an indication such as Fuel Injeciton rated, or F.I. Rated, or " ___ psi max"

Also, just thinking out loud on my keyboard, the driver side rear well is where the charcoal canister is. That is an item I don't know very well, except that it's there to collect gasoline vapors, which do tend to smell like, wait for it, gasoline.
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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

I truly appreciate your advice and recommendations, if I were to replace the injectors and the connectors, where would you recommend to purchase a entire set/kit??
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

I searched "EPDM" and "Fuel Injection" and didn't find any site that listed them together for one of their products. It looks to me that EPDM hoses are suitable for water and not gasohol. No expert here by any means though.

As I said you want your hoses to say 30r9 on them. The high pressure variant of Gates Barricade hose, which carries BOTH the 30r9 and 30r14 rating is for most the best way to go these days, you need 5/16" hose.

LEFT TO OTHERS, THEY WILL DEPENDABLY INSTALL THE WRONG HOSE. MOST MECHANICS DON'T EVER HAVE TO REPLACE THE ORIGINAL FI HOSE AS FOR MOST NEWER CARS THE OEM HOSE WILL LAST THE 10-20 YEAR LIFE OF THE CAR, SO THE MECHANICS DON'T KNOW WHAT HOSE NEEDS TO BE USED AND WILL ALL TOO OFTEN BUY AND USE THE WRONG TYPE OF HOSE.

I am really glad that you paid attention to the smell as your van may have quickly turned into a rolling bomb.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2020 8:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

I felt really alone 20 years back when I was fighting my local NAPA to stock the correct hoses for use on FI'd engines. It is sad to know that the battle is still a long way from being won. Crying or Very sad
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DanHoug
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 9:05 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Wildthings is dead on ... you MUST see 30r9 on the fuel hose so rotate them, move stuff around until you can see it or not. it also looks like you have some Cohline hose but *maybe* some other type too.

at this point, assume NOTHING is correct with your fuel lines until you see it for yourself. there's several things that are INcorrect in your pictures with regard to clamps, injector hoses not replaced, and i'll bet you anything your plastic firewall line splice is still there, with old fuel hose behind it.
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 10:41 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

As far as injectors go, keep yours. Replacements are not as good. If it hasn't been done, have them professionally cleaned. Should cost $100 bucks or so, they'll come back new. Sometimes they even come back with the little piece of hose already attached to it. Do a search on the forum.
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 11:41 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

A few years ago upon starting my '87 Camper GL after winter storage for the first time in months and backing it out of the garage, others yelled to shut down. I did and fuel was gushing from a crack in the original plastic VW fuel rail on one side. No problem with it the previous season of driving and no issue when we stored it away. That could have been disastrous. Left a visible trail of fuel on the ground while backing out of the garage!

Towed it to my home garage and pushed her inside. So I ordered up all new and correct F.I. hose, a pile of correct ear clamps and the ear clamp pliers and best of all a pair of billet aluminum fuel rails - all from GoWesty. Nice stuff, I slowly and methodically replaced all those lines/clamps/rails as well as installed a new Bosch fuel filter and hose between the tank outlet and fuel pump and filter. It went well, was fairly easy to do and all is well again in Vanagon world.

Amazing to see the hard to spot or inspect for crack in the original fuel rail after 30 years of use. I sure didn't expect it, but it was understandable because of the age of the plastic in retrospect. I could have lost the Van to fire if that happened out on the roads or highways. I'm glad to have billet aluminum on there now!

Bill Bowman
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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:09 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Thank you for everyone taking time and explaining in detail, I read everyone’s notes and I will definitely consider all of them. On the other note, one question from Dan above, when you say” your plastic firewall line splice is still there, with old fuel hose behind it”, Would you please be more specific not sure what you meant
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:40 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

I "think" what he/you are referring to is a junction piece screwed to the firewall above your engine from the factory. Pressurized fuel in his old fuel line comes rearward in the old fuel line to the engine firewall and plugs onto this firewall fitting, flows through this now very old and brittle plastic fitting and exits the fitting on the rearward side of your firewall into his probably new hi-pressure fuel line to the engine. After 30+ years of use, that plastic firewall fuel line fitting is brittle and a recipe for disaster. When it cracks or completely fails it'll spray pressurized fuel all over your nice hot engine at driving speeds. Most of the suppliers have fixes, either a thick rubber grommet to replace the plastic fitting or a metal version. I replaced my original plastic fitting about 10 years ago with the grommet from GW. There are probably ooodles of threads about it here with photos?

Bill
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Mission VW - San Fernando
Thornton VW - Stockton

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:59 am    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

Eskandrm wrote:
Thank you for everyone taking time and explaining in detail, I read everyone’s notes and I will definitely consider all of them. On the other note, one question from Dan above, when you say” your plastic firewall line splice is still there, with old fuel hose behind it”, Would you please be more specific not sure what you meant


Dan is referring to this. It would be located on the passenger side firewall, where the fuel hose goes from the engine compartment towards the front of the vehicle. If you hoses have been upgraded at this location, then it is likely you will see a fuel hose pass through the fire wall instead of ending in a splice at this location. Post a picture of the location for us, if you are unsure.

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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

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Last edited by Eskandrm on Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Eskandrm
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

The auxiliary throttle plate spring does not look correct where it attaches to the throttle body. Something is jamming. The spring should not be wrapping around the shaft.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Fuel line smelling gas Reply with quote

I would suggest you find a good mechanic. I wonder if samba member crazyvwvanman (Mark) would travel up to you. He is in San Diego and could do a lot to sort out your engine. Your coolant tank should be completely full. The plastic fuel splice that you located in the firewall should be abandoned immediately. MarkWard is very knowledgeable and has pointed out a throttle body spring issue.

If you are smelling fuel. You should stop driving until it gets sorted out.
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