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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:44 am Post subject: Windshield install advice needed |
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I installed my windshield with a new seal and it surprisingly went in very quickly and easily. German glass from a 79 and the better seal with little to no lip rust repair needed. My last bus I broke two windshields trying to install so I read every post and watched every video prior to attempting this again.
My problem is...
The upper passenger side corner on the inside lip didn't completely lip over the pinch weld like it did perfectly the rest of the way around. It's about a 6 inch area that only lipped over about half what the rest of the lip did. It makes the outer seal in that spot not tight to the metal like the rest of the outer seal is.
My question is...
Is there a way to seat it over fully without removing the glass and starting over? I'm terrified to push or pat or breath on it and break a third one so any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
I'll post a pic later.
_________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy
Last edited by dembus on Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:14 am; edited 1 time in total |
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ImAddicted Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2012 Posts: 1195 Location: Unorganized Territory, Maine
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:14 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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Try working it over from the inside with a plastic or wood stick, steal a cuticle stick from the better half, that's what I did.
_________________ 1979 Transporter (sold)
KC1MUR
strfish7 wrote: |
Original condition, which means something different on this forum than anywhere else! |
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mikewire Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2010 Posts: 802 Location: San Antonio, TX
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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I haven't done my front window, but with all my side windows (solid glass and sliders) I found that when the seal isn't rolling all the way into the frame I found that doing the following helps:
- Get it in the sun so the seal is warm and flexible, glass will be less "brittle", the metal around the window will expand, giving you a little bit more room to work with
- Use some type of lube that evaporates and leaves no residue - I mix up some 1/3r'd rubbing alcohol, 2/3rd's water, and two drops of dawn dish soap in a large spray bottle and use it liberally, spraying inside the lip of the seal so it gets in between the seal and the window frame
- Pushing on the outside edge of the seal, in the soft spot between the glass and frame, while a helper (gently) pulls on the inside lip of the seal helps "roll" the seal further around the lip
- Having a helper is critical, so both sides of the seal can be manipulated and worked into place - you maybe don't need it at this step, but it would help if someone could watch the seal move
Now that's it's 97.7655% installed, I wouldn't pull it back out for fear of it breaking. Maybe go for a few drives and see if it settles, and then try step #3 again. _________________ -Mike
@countdowngarage
@bigskyeuro
1972 VW Kombi 9 Passenger Deluxe w/ 2.0L F.I. VWAC swap
1965 VW Beetle Deluxe Bahama Blue |
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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 10:27 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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ImAddicted wrote: |
Try working it over from the inside with a plastic or wood stick, steal a cuticle stick from the better half, that's what I did.
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I haven't tried this.
Will I be able to see where it's not pulling over the lip when I fold down the inside seal? Then I assume insert stick and bring it over the lip? _________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy |
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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 10:29 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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mikewire wrote: |
I haven't done my front window, but with all my side windows (solid glass and sliders) I found that when the seal isn't rolling all the way into the frame I found that doing the following helps:
- Get it in the sun so the seal is warm and flexible, glass will be less "brittle", the metal around the window will expand, giving you a little bit more room to work with
- Use some type of lube that evaporates and leaves no residue - I mix up some 1/3r'd rubbing alcohol, 2/3rd's water, and two drops of dawn dish soap in a large spray bottle and use it liberally, spraying inside the lip of the seal so it gets in between the seal and the window frame
- Pushing on the outside edge of the seal, in the soft spot between the glass and frame, while a helper (gently) pulls on the inside lip of the seal helps "roll" the seal further around the lip
- Having a helper is critical, so both sides of the seal can be manipulated and worked into place - you maybe don't need it at this step, but it would help if someone could watch the seal move
Now that's it's 97.7655% installed, I wouldn't pull it back out for fear of it breaking. Maybe go for a few drives and see if it settles, and then try step #3 again. |
I did leave in the sun and tried even pressure on glass with silicone lube and outer seal edge but didn't try number 3, pulling while someone pushes on seal. Thanks! _________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy |
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orwell84 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007 Posts: 2528 Location: Plattsburgh, New York
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:22 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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Part of the problem that I have heard described is that the corners are too large on a lot of the commonly available aftermarket glass which makes the seal not fit well at the corners. That is the case with my bus. The windshield was installed by Safelite. It wasn’t awful but at some point I will have to have it removed and the corners ground for a better fit. You should be able to push the glass out fairly easily and start again if you need to. Better with a helper. I would rather pay for the installation. If they break it, they just get another one. |
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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:17 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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orwell84 wrote: |
Part of the problem that I have heard described is that the corners are too large on a lot of the commonly available aftermarket glass which makes the seal not fit well at the corners. That is the case with my bus. The windshield was installed by Safelite. It wasn’t awful but at some point I will have to have it removed and the corners ground for a better fit. You should be able to push the glass out fairly easily and start again if you need to. Better with a helper. I would rather pay for the installation. If they break it, they just get another one. |
Glass fitment shouldn't be the issue since it's original German glass from a 79 bus as stated above. I'll try the wood stick in the hot sun method tomorrow and hopefully that will do it.
Thanks! _________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy |
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Rodmullet Samba Member
Joined: May 27, 2010 Posts: 196 Location: New Jersey
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:17 pm Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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I very carefully used a slightly dull pick (maybe use an old dental pick) to pull the lip over while very gently slapping the windshield with an open hand...this was after the windshield guys did 99% of the installation...the one guy had this huge hand that he slapped the windshield to seat it. Definitely worth the money to have someone install it. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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I have a radiator hose pick that I have shortened a bit and rounded off well. One of the most useful tools I own. |
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OB Bus Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2003 Posts: 2531 Location: Ocean Beach in Beautiful BLUE California
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:59 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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Quote: |
where it's not pulling over the lip when I fold down the inside seal? |
Quote: |
pulling while someone pushes on seal. |
you are using two ropes right? pull from the middle out towards both sides, a little at a time each while someone GENTLY holds it on the outside Use the lube as someone suggested. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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alaskadan Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013 Posts: 1849 Location: anchor pt. alaska
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:17 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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The wooden tool might help you here. Let's assume that the glass isnt centered, and it needs to move to the driver's side. You won't have much room to use it on the inside, so work from the outside . Also assuming there isnt much lube left in the channel, that's ok. Insert the tool between the glass and the seal over on the bottom of river's side and keeping it jammed down in there push it to the passenger side. Do this on the top and bottom a couple times. You're trying to scootch the rubber to the pass side, which there is nowhere for it to go so by default hopefully the glass will move to the drivers side. If removal becomes neccessary, I mark center on the van and a piece of tape with a center mark on the glass helps. Sideways flat palm slapping the middle of the windshield hurts but has worked too. Good luck. |
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earlybayjim Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2013 Posts: 248 Location: East Dubuque, IL
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:34 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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dembus wrote: |
I installed my windshield with a new seal and it surprisingly went in very quickly and easily. German glass from a 79 and the better seal with little to no lip rust repair needed. My last bus I broke two windshields trying to install so I read every post and watched every video prior to attempting this again.
My problem is...
The upper passenger side corner on the inside lip didn't completely lip over the pinch weld like it did perfectly the rest of the way around. It's about a 6 inch area that only lipped over about half what the rest of the lip did. It makes the outer seal in that spot not tight to the metal like the rest of the outer seal is.
My question is...
Is there a way to seat it over fully without removing the glass and starting over? I'm terrified to push or pat or breath on it and break a third one so any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
I'll post a pic later.
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The seal in my wife's 71 looks exactly like this on the inside and we have been driving it for 2 years. I know it's not right, but I did some minor rust repair on the opening and I'm sure I changed the profile some. I've been meaning to have it ground and re installed, but its keeps getting pushed to the back burner... I'm wondering if that's the problem here? How much welding/rust work did you do? I'm sure some of these windshield openings vary from bus to bus from the factory as well as glass size too. Everything has a tolerance and it's not always as tight as we may expect. Good luck with the seal! _________________ 1971 Chianti Red Westfalia x2
1985 Westfalia
1984 tintop |
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sjbartnik Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011 Posts: 5986 Location: Brooklyn
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:02 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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If you've ever seen the factory film from back in the day where they're installing windshields, it looks positively brutal, but they've got the guy inside pulling the string and a guy outside whacking the windshield surprisingly hard with a rubber mallet to get it to seat. _________________ 1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650 |
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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:50 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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alaskadan wrote: |
The wooden tool might help you here. Let's assume that the glass isnt centered, and it needs to move to the driver's side. You won't have much room to use it on the inside, so work from the outside . Also assuming there isnt much lube left in the channel, that's ok. Insert the tool between the glass and the seal over on the bottom of river's side and keeping it jammed down in there push it to the passenger side. Do this on the top and bottom a couple times. You're trying to scootch the rubber to the pass side, which there is nowhere for it to go so by default hopefully the glass will move to the drivers side. If removal becomes neccessary, I mark center on the van and a piece of tape with a center mark on the glass helps. Sideways flat palm slapping the middle of the windshield hurts but has worked too. Good luck. |
This approach is interesting. I can probably get some spray silicone inside the seal all the way around both outer and inner except the lower inner side. Should I firmly "pat" the glass toward the passenger side where the seal didn't fully seat or toward the driver's side or just 90 degrees? I'm also confused how pushing the glass to the passenger side will help but Ill try. I measured and marked center of glass and opening prior to and I did very little lip rust repair and it's factory German glass. _________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy |
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mikedjames Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2012 Posts: 2714 Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:26 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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Try pulling the seal over the lip with your fingers. _________________ Ancient vehicles and vessels
1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.
1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy |
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alaskadan Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013 Posts: 1849 Location: anchor pt. alaska
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Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:49 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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dembus wrote: |
alaskadan wrote: |
The wooden tool might help you here. Let's assume that the glass isnt centered, and it needs to move to the driver's side. You won't have much room to use it on the inside, so work from the outside . Also assuming there isnt much lube left in the channel, that's ok. Insert the tool between the glass and the seal over on the bottom of river's side and keeping it jammed down in there push it to the passenger side. Do this on the top and bottom a couple times. You're trying to scootch the rubber to the pass side, which there is nowhere for it to go so by default hopefully the glass will move to the drivers side. If removal becomes neccessary, I mark center on the van and a piece of tape with a center mark on the glass helps. Sideways flat palm slapping the middle of the windshield hurts but has worked too. Good luck. |
This approach is interesting. I can probably get some spray silicone inside the seal all the way around both outer and inner except the lower inner side. Should I firmly "pat" the glass toward the passenger side where the seal didn't fully seat or toward the driver's side or just 90 degrees? I'm also confused how pushing the glass to the passenger side will help but Ill try. I measured and marked center of glass and opening prior to and I did very little lip rust repair and it's factory German glass. |
Don't silicone it, that isnt neccessary. The glass needs to move to the driver's side allowing more room for the gasket to fit on the pass side. I would try this trick dry so if when the gasket moves incrementally it stays. Essentially it's the grip of the gasket that's keeping the glass from moving over. As you run the wooden tool along the groove it will hopefully it will release its grip just a little in that point of contact. |
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orwell84 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007 Posts: 2528 Location: Plattsburgh, New York
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Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:31 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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I wish I had made a template of my original glass before chucking it. Safelite windshield installers can get a windshield in pretty easily but are not really versed in the finer points of fitting a seal type windshield. Glass is also shit compared to the original. That stuff was bullet proof, but mine was delaminating around the edges.
One of the bus restoration manuals suggests removing the windshield every few years to check the condition of the windshield. It makes sense given what an ass ache this repair is, but I'm not sure if I'm up for that. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50255
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Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:54 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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Today's replacement windshields don't tend to fit well into the upper right hand corner and haven't for the last 15 years or so. I have watch professional installers fight these things for two hours. |
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dembus Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2005 Posts: 1272 Location: Fleming Island, Florida
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Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 11:09 am Post subject: Re: Windshield install advice needed |
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alaskadan wrote: |
dembus wrote: |
alaskadan wrote: |
The wooden tool might help you here. Let's assume that the glass isnt centered, and it needs to move to the driver's side. You won't have much room to use it on the inside, so work from the outside . Also assuming there isnt much lube left in the channel, that's ok. Insert the tool between the glass and the seal over on the bottom of river's side and keeping it jammed down in there push it to the passenger side. Do this on the top and bottom a couple times. You're trying to scootch the rubber to the pass side, which there is nowhere for it to go so by default hopefully the glass will move to the drivers side. If removal becomes neccessary, I mark center on the van and a piece of tape with a center mark on the glass helps. Sideways flat palm slapping the middle of the windshield hurts but has worked too. Good luck. |
This approach is interesting. I can probably get some spray silicone inside the seal all the way around both outer and inner except the lower inner side. Should I firmly "pat" the glass toward the passenger side where the seal didn't fully seat or toward the driver's side or just 90 degrees? I'm also confused how pushing the glass to the passenger side will help but Ill try. I measured and marked center of glass and opening prior to and I did very little lip rust repair and it's factory German glass. |
Don't silicone it, that isnt neccessary. The glass needs to move to the driver's side allowing more room for the gasket to fit on the pass side. I would try this trick dry so if when the gasket moves incrementally it stays. Essentially it's the grip of the gasket that's keeping the glass from moving over. As you run the wooden tool along the groove it will hopefully it will release its grip just a little in that point of contact. |
I will try this tomorrow. It makes sense and seems like it does't need to go much.
Thank you!! _________________ "Want a little peace of mind, grab the lowest branch and start to climb"
JJ Grey
69 Westy (R.I.P.)
68 Kombi
70 Westy
68 Beetle Sedan
69 Beetle Sedan
68 Deluxe
71 Deluxe
71 HT Westy |
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