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4Gears4Tires
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 3019
Location: MD
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 Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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| epowell wrote: |
| ...I think for now if I don't have time to grind off the rust (probably won't), I'll just keep spraying them each year with rust converter before storing the van. |
You don't have to grind off the rust, just remove the surface flakes. You want the rust converter on the last layer of rust. Putting rust converter on the outside flakes is a waste of rust converter and a waste of your time. Put a wire wheel on an 18v drill and go to town. Should only take a few hours, you don't have to get precise here, just a quick swipe of all of the surfaces should be good enough. Then go to town painting everything. If you have that much area, might be a good idea to get 2 gallons of Ospho and a 4" brush. You can also use a squirt bottle and coat the inside of things.
Or whatever. The way I look at it is that any progress to fight entropy is still progress.
_________________
'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16501
Location: Brookeville, MD
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4Gears4Tires
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 3019
Location: MD
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 6:12 pm Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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What about driving a van into a kiddie pool and then filling it with water and ospho.
Not even entirely joking. 
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'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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fxr
Samba Member
Joined: December 07, 2014
Posts: 2321
Location: Bay area CA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 6:15 pm Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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Ospho seems 'wetter' than water - it goes a LONG way. I converted a huge amount of rust on our van and only used less than a pint. Just buy a quart to start with. 
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Jim Crowther
1984 1.9l EJ22 Westy Wolfsburg Edition
Vespa GTS 300 |
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Colorado Yeti
Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2013
Posts: 356
Location: Ft. Collins, Colorado
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 8:44 pm Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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| POR-15 completely sucks....do not buy it!!! It used to be a great product but has gone completely downhill in past 10 years. I used it to treat my upper and bottom from control arms when I redid my front suspension in 2014 and it has completely flaked off in most places. And I spent an extraordinary of time prepping the surfaces as directed. Will never buy this product ever again. I started using Chassis Saver and have never turned back. Way better. |
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ZsZ
Samba Member
Joined: December 11, 2010
Posts: 1645
Location: Budapest Hungary, Europe
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 11:19 pm Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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I would say it is so rusty that you wont ever fully de-rust it properly. It needs full disassemble, sandblasting (media blasting), etch primer new paint etc.
The waxoyl will stop rust getting worse (on my van the Carplan brand wax/oil even dissolved the rust fully at some places) and if you spray it, it can get into crevises where you never can wire brush and paint. Like the inner side of the trailing arms. And if ever you or the next owner will have the time and ability to do it properly then it can be removed quickly with dry ice blasting.
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Zoltan
1.9 MTdi 2wd Multivan (ex Caravelle)
Van since 2006, engine since 2008 |
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epowell
Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2015
Posts: 4733
Location: Czech (mostly) Vancouver (sometimes)
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| Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 1:45 am Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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| ZsZ wrote: |
I would say it is so rusty that you wont ever fully de-rust it properly. It needs full disassemble, sandblasting (media blasting), etch primer new paint etc.
The waxoyl will stop rust getting worse (on my van the Carplan brand wax/oil even dissolved the rust fully at some places) and if you spray it, it can get into crevises where you never can wire brush and paint. Like the inner side of the trailing arms. And if ever you or the next owner will have the time and ability to do it properly then it can be removed quickly with dry ice blasting. |
Yes, seems you are talking about the trailing arms issue here:
So far essentially it seems I am dealing with 3 separate RUST issues:
1) structural body rust (frame, floor etc) > this I intend to grind off the rust > ospho > primer
2) rust on replaceable parts (trailing arms, backing plates) > I think on these items, until I have time to disassemble and soak in acid, I will continue just to spray oil on them each year to slow the rust.
3) exterior body rust (seams and under window seals) > I have from the PO VW factory white and brown matching colour spray cans...
I'm not completely sure how to deal with this exterior rust.
What I was told by the EpoxyPrimer dealer was this:
- grind off all rust
- paint with primer
- apply fiberglass bondo to deeper areas
- more primer, then sand flat
- apply top coat bondo (fine)
- more primer, then sand flat
- more primer, then top coat paint.
This seems like a good protocol but I wonder if it is really necessary to add a layer of primer after every single step like this? Is it really a good idea or could it be that the dealer wants us to use up more primer?
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www.edwardpowell.com |
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kguarnotta
Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2004
Posts: 1160
Location: Woodstock, NH
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| Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 5:57 am Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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Here is my advice - to mix in with all the rest...
I've used POR-15 and Master Series.I prefer MAster series - silver than top coat . I used this on the underside of my '65. I was able to put it up on a stand, and hunched over - sandblasted then painted.
Now that I'm older - I have since found that there are companies that will sandblast the underside of your bus for you. Maybe that would work for you? Look around - I can't recall the quotes I was given for my '69 singlecab, but at the time I thought they were reasonable.
I started using rust veto and fluid film recently. I like the theory behind these, I've not tried to take them off yet, but I believe the rust veto will come off with some mineral spirits if needed.
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-Kevin
Lincoln, MA
'86 Triple Knob Syncro w/EJ22
'78 Westy
'69 Single Cab
'65 Kombi - EZ-Camper |
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old_man
Samba Member
Joined: June 19, 2018
Posts: 1381
Location: Newfoundland
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| Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:05 am Post subject: Re: POR15 vs. EPOXY PRIMER for underbody rust (quick but permanent)? |
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| kguarnotta wrote: |
I started using rust veto and fluid film recently. I like the theory behind these, I've not tried to take them off yet, but I believe the rust veto will come off with some mineral spirits if needed. |
This is my philosophy. I fluid film everything, especially the cavities. (I buy it in the 1 gal buckets). The fluid film creeps very well. I then hit the exposed underside areas with a thicker local under coating product. I found fluid film washes off in the weather a little too easily.
If I needed to paint something I would probably try to torch and cook off whatever is there.
People really should shoot some sort of creeping rust undercoating in their crevices, I feel it is a very important step in preventing seam rust as there is no way to effectively paint inside there.
Just my take on it. |
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