Baja Suspension SetUp

[TonyD007]

Just wanting to see if anyone has done a great off road setup for Baja? Im running standard 1968 suspension IRS but the car oversteers badly and also due to the front end being light it locks up under braking.

Any ideas?

[Scott SD]

Are you going to add more weight to the front? Do you have stock brakes front and rear? If so, check the wheel cylinder sizes. Depending on your set-up it might be possible to just switch them front to back.

[TonyD007]

I have type 3 front disks and after market rear disks. The car stops well but cant get grip when braking on dirt before a corner, it locks up, then when you lift off you get oversteer really badly. So trying work out what suspension changes are needed to smooth things out. I also have about 20kg extra weight in the front with fuel and tools.

[Matt Wilson]

It's common for off-road use vehicles like these to have their brake biased to the rear wheels. Like Scott SD said, simple way is to swap wheel cylinders front to rear.

As far as oversteer - what type of steering wheel are you using? If it's smaller than stock, a bigger effect will be produced from less wheel input.
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1972 Standard Beetle
1969 Baja Beetle

[TonyD007]

Hi, maybe a brake bias lever in between the front and rear. Does this assist in more braking where the weight is in the car? Maybe it will help the front end from locking up so early. I cant swap the cylinders as the rear are some after market (i think EMPI) disk kit and the front are standard T3 discs and callipers.

Steering wheel is a little smaller than standard but not tiny. Any thoughts on spring rates and dampers? Im running standard front beam but I have twisted the bottom one to give a little more lift and spring. KYB gas shocks on the front.
The rear is 28mm torsion bars and Excel Gas shocks. Im thinking of fax shocks that you can adjust the damper so I can experiment. Also not sure if I should be using sway bars? A rally guy I know said dont run any and let the wheels do what they want. Another says a big front sway bar but this didnt seem to help, possible made it worse?

[dustymojave]

A front sway (or as the English say "anti-roll") bar on dirt will make the car understeer (push) badly if the rear tires are bigger than fronts. The bigger rear tires do much the same as the sway bar does. A front sway bar will make it understeer until it all of a sudden lets it oversteer. Then it's unstable and unpredictable. Without the sway bar, it will be a very predictable and controllable oversteer.

28mm rear torsions are VERY stout and will make the car oversteer a LOT. Go down to stock or maybe 26mm at the most. If it still bottoms out, then you can increase the ride height. Then you will need rear shocks that will deal with torsions that stiff. Fox, King and Bilstein all make shocks for use on offroad race Class 11 race cars that for decades were required to use shocks that could be mounted on the stock shock mounts. If you go to buy such rebuildable shocks, then you need to tell the seller if they are to be mounted on the stock shock mounts.

If the oversteer bothers you, then you need to either learn how to drive that way and get used to it, or go to a different sort of car. The VW Bug is a naturally oversteering car. It's rear engine. Like a Porsche 911 or a 356 or a Porsche Spyder.
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[TonyD007]

Thanks Richard, that is helpful. Ill remove the from sway bar because your right , when it snaps into over steer its much harder to deal with. I went with the heavier torsion bars on the back as when the car is loaded up for a trek, it weighs in at around 1250kg and gets air-born from time to time. So yes, maybe I can go softer and see what happens. Thanks

[carlos_magnum]

If the budget is not a concern, choose Fox shocks. I got mine from 4wheelonline. They are pricey but I'm very happy with the ride. Damping and suspension control are good.

[TonyD007]

Are you running fox shocks on a standard vw suspension setup? If so, any idea of the model / serial numbers. If not Ill contact Fox and see what they recommend. Ill also check out 4wheelonline.

[dustymojave]

I prefer King Shocks. They're about the same as Fox, the difference is down to a personal preference. Maybe the fact that they help customers get their shocks set up has something to do with my preference. Also maybe that my son knows the owner of the company and we've known several people who've worked there. Those factors won't be much help in New South Wales, though. But there should be dealers for both brands in Oz.
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[TonyD007]

Thank you.