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Syncro Front End Rebuild
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alaskadan
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 8:47 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Nows the time for longer studs on those hubs if planning on using some of the alloy wheels out there.
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

alaskadan wrote:
Nows the time for longer studs on those hubs if planning on using some of the alloy wheels out there.


Yep, we have a couple sets of longer studs. I was able to get my hands on some CLK wheels though. If my research is right, we shouldnít need longer studs but Iím gonna put them in anyway while itís open. Open lugs and future trimming if necessary I guess.
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1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:09 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

alaskadan wrote:
Nows the time for longer studs on those hubs if planning on using some of the alloy wheels out there.


What about factory 14 alloys? Other than the different nut pitch, I assumed nothing else changed.

I've always carefully used an air chisel to walk those inner races off. Wear safety glasses. I've had chips fly before. Once you get the races off, clean up and measure them, I imagine they will be fine.
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mitch5
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 3:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

What brand did you end up going with for the lower balljoint, the lemforder and moog seem to be on backorder everywhere.
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 4:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

mitch5 wrote:
What brand did you end up going with for the lower balljoint, the lemforder and moog seem to be on backorder everywhere.


Well, I struggled but I was able to get one MOOG K9111 on eBay though I had 2 or 3 orders cancelled because they didnít have stock (even though I was able to buy them). I just ordered another one on Amazon (not my favorite approach). I had first tried the regular Vanagon sources but no luck there. Lemforder seems to be out anywhere, and the latest I saw was that their quality had gone down. Not sure if thatís truly the case or not, good luck though.
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1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 4:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Alright, inner races are off. The careful grinding trick worked great!
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Here are photos of what the hubs look like. The photo with the pad of steel wool shows the surfaces lightly scrubbed.
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Close ups of the surfaces, as well as measurements. My calipers are pretty basic so I only get so much precision but so far, the driver side hub measures 42.0mm all around and the passenger side (the one that had the loose axle nut) measures 42.0mm toward the base of the shaft and 41.9mm toward the tip. I have no idea what that would mean right now...
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

They could be cleaned up better. Donít press them, but see how the new races fit the hub. If the race drops down over, probably not good. If not, they will likely be fine. Unlike a conventional bearing, these inner races are fixed.

If they donít last, you can replace them then.
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 6:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

MarkWard wrote:
They could be cleaned up better. Donít press them, but see how the new races fit the hub. If the race drops down over, probably not good. If not, they will likely be fine. Unlike a conventional bearing, these inner races are fixed.

If they donít last, you can replace them then.


Thanks, thatís reassuring. The race was tough to remove through the entire shaft though I did feel it slide every so slightly easier on the second half.

This has been a great project to build confidence in my mechanical abilities, love it! Using a bunch of tools I never had before.

How do you suggest I clean them up a little more, fine sand paper?
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Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 7:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Emery cloth is handy to have in the tool box. Works good for something like that. Iím surprised steel wool didnít do a better job. Obviously you donít want to take material off, so donít get carried away. You want it snug. Just donít want material sluffing off when it goes together. Freezing the hub before pressing it in does help.
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1990 Vanagon Camper Syncro.
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:17 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Time for a front end update. Just like everything on this van, itís taking longer than anticipated and requiring more parts and tools than I imagined, but still learning a lot!
Since removing the inner races off of the wheel hubs, Iíve done a few things.
Dropped off all the parts to a powder coater.
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Pressed some 65mm studs into the hubs and put some epoxy paint on the hubs.
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Pressed in lower ball joints.
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Pressed new wheel bearings in the uprights.
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Pressed the hubs back in (presses are so much fun!). The hub that had the loose axle nut and some sign of wear (41.9mm diameter compared to 42mm)was noticeably easier to press in. Iíll have to keep an eye on that I guess...
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I also put the LCAís back on the van with new powerflex bushings and that was a real PITA!! Is it supposed to be so tight?
I reattached the radius rods (no hardware was tightened).
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I also started reinstalling the UCA but havenít finished. I pressed the sleeves into the UCA and trucked along putting all the pieces back together, with bush-snot, when I remembered I was supposed to figure out ďthe gapĒ for the UCA powerflex bushings.
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Thatís where Iím currently stuck. Unfortunately, the assembly is full of grease which makes things tough to handle. Iíve tried tightening the assembly but the powerflex bushing was mushrooming near the inner part, against the eccentric washer. I didnít want to tighten any more in fear of damaging the bushing.
Iíve read and re-rear the Syncro specific instructions made by the awesome Chris from T3 but I just feel confused by the process. Iíd love to hear if anyone has a way to paraphrase these instructions, Iíll get some photos next week to illustrate my issue.
Also, are front wheel bearings supposed to be tough to spin after being pressed in? Is it the seal putting pressure?
Thanks and happy new year!!!!
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Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading


Last edited by T3TRIS on Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:17 pm; edited 2 times in total
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MsTaboo
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 1:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Looking good! I don't have any input on the powerflex UCA bushings (I used OEM type on mine) but yes, the new front bearings will not spin freely due to all the seals, but you should be able to spin smoothly-no binding!

The LCA assembly might have been tight because the receivers (not sure of proper word) were bent inward from over tightening by a PO. Mine slipped right in with a little wiggling. I used Burly bushings, maybe smaller?
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

MsTaboo wrote:
Looking good! I don't have any input on the powerflex UCA bushings (I used OEM type on mine) but yes, the new front bearings will not spin freely due to all the seals, but you should be able to spin smoothly-no binding!

The LCA assembly might have been tight because the receivers (not sure of proper word) were bent inward from over tightening by a PO. Mine slipped right in with a little wiggling. I used Burly bushings, maybe smaller?


Thank you! Honestly Iím wondering if the LCA bushing had too much snot if thatís possible. Itís as if it didnít fit properly and I trapped air between both bushings that keeps pushing the bushings outward. I tried removing some snot but it didnít change much. The receiver being bent makes sense too.

Here are some shots of the UCA bushing.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

As mentioned above, I messed up without dry-fitting them first to trim the inner sleeve for that eccentric washer gap that seems to be specific to syncros. I pushed the UCA in nonetheless and figured Iíd snug it up and see what it does. Itís a tight fit and the poly bushings get pushed outward when sliding the UCA in. I didnít want to tighten the nut the whole way since part of the bushing was starting to seriously mushroom out (against the eccentric washer).
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Iíve read and re-read the instructions but am not 100% sure what to do. My understanding is that Iím supposed to tighten that nut, measure the gap between the eccentric washer and the inner sleeve and trim the inner sleeve so that the gap is less than 0.5mm. However I feel like removing material from the inner sleeve will just make the bushing itself mushroom even more!
I havenít measured the thickness of the eccentric washers but I think they are around 5mm. I guess I have to purchase thinner ones before shaving off any metal?
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Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
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T3 Pilot
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 7:41 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

This is my pre coffee analysis of your uCAB fitting....

Do you have a variety of camber washer thicknesses?.
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remraf
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 7:51 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

I didn't read your posts all that well but did notice you powder coated the suspension components. Powder coating adds thickness to the part so if the person doing the coating didn't mask or use plugs for holes you can have fitment issues. Don't think that is what you're describing here but thought it was worth mentioning.
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T3 Pilot
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Ok,

Two coffees in and now I can focus on your joint fitting issue.

First step would be to remove the purple bushings and inner sleeves and clean off all of the silicone grease.

Then you should measure the lengths of the sleeves and bushings, and measure the eccentric camber washers that you have. You need a set of calipers and a good steel ruler to do this.

Once you have some measurements written down you can adjust the lengthwise fit of the purple bushing with a sharp knife. The inner steel bushing clearance can be adjusted with a combo of various thicknesses of eccentric camber washers, ( they come in a range of from 4 to 6 mm in 1/2 mm increments I seem to remember) you will need to fine tune the length of the inner bushing sleeve with a belt sander clamped upside down in a bench vise. Check for squareness while you are doing this.

This process should require several test fittings and removals on/off of the Van. These are custom bushings and they require a custom fitting.
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Hmm? I thought the inner sleeves supplied were longer than possibly necessary and would be shortened as needed.

The factory manual has a description to describe setting the clearance. Itís critical with the syncro because the arms are cast. The stamped 2wd arms are flexible to a point.

When tightened, the pivot bolt needs to seat on the camber washers and sleeves without preloading the bushings like you describe.
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Last edited by MarkWard on Sun Jan 03, 2021 9:30 am; edited 1 time in total
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Ok cool, thank you all for the input (including the added thickness from powder coating comment).
Youíre both confirming what I was leaning towards but I needed to hear it from others! Unless I missed it, nowhere in the instructions does it mention cutting the bushing itself.
Hopefully I can get the gap right just with eccentric washers, weíll see. Seems like the thinnest I can get those is 8mm (combined). Iíll measure mine tomorrow but Iím getting a they are 5mm thick.
The instructions are worded in a way that makes me feel like ďsometimesĒ the inner sleeves need to be adjusted. From reading comments, Iím thinking that itís something that might always need to happen. As you mentioned, Iíll have to clean all the bushings and take measurements. I first regretted getting it, but now Iím glad I bought the big tube of snot from T3!
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T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
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T3 Pilot
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 9:45 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Hi MarkWard,

Good to have you weigh in here. You are right about the shortening of the inner sleeve. I think the problem is that the OP is having trouble visualizing the process with the multi part powerflex bushings. The trouble is that the purple rubber covers up the face of the inner sleeve right where he needs to be able to see it to measure that .5mm clearance. He should start by having the thinnest eccentric camber washers installed that way he has less material to remove from the bushing inner sleeve.

I did mine several years ago and ended up making spacers from plastic plumbing pipe to replicate the thickness of the purple rubber flange where it is sandwiched between the inner and outer bushings on the outboard ends of the control arm wishbone. That allows you to see the inner end of the inner sleeve while test fitting. I took the whole thing on/off 6 or 8 times before I was happy with the fit. To be more clear, I removed the purple rubber bushing and replaced it with the shop made plastic spacer while dialing in the fitment of the inner sleeve.

There should be a slight axial compression of the purple rubber when the control arm bolt is tightened, too much squish is undesirable, so that is why I say you may need to trim some of the purple off.

Also keep in mind that the correct clearance of the inner sleeve is a maximum of .5mm at each side Before Tightening, so zero clearance would be OK. (Ref. Bentley 14.18a)
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MarkWard
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

On my phone, so I donít have the detail.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


To clarify, the outer ďhatĒ on both bushings must completely seat on the a arm. Yours are not seated. That is the first step to solving. If they arenít flush, they wonít hold the A arm from floating backwards and forward. So, you must solve the fit with the bushings seated.
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T3TRIS
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:40 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro Front End Rebuild Reply with quote

Thank you both, this is making A LOT more sense thanks to the back and forth.
Youíre right about the bushings not sitting of course. I noticed right away but figured it just needed to be tightened since it doesnít mention trimming it... but I stopped as soon as it looked like it was mushrooming severely!
Alright, the geometries and tolerances make sense, no problem with all that especially with both of your input. I think what threw me off was to not have any comment about trimming the bushing itself (sorry if I missed that).
Hereís what Iím thinking: it thereís zero gap, thatís less than 0.5mm and itís ok. I can measure the space between the inner sleeves on the UCA when not installed and the space between the surfaces of the eccentric washers. As long as itís less than 0.5mm on each side, Iím good. Then I can trim the bushing so that itís maybe just 1mm longer than the inner sleeve. This way it will compress by 0.5mm up to 1mm when tightening.
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Guillaume and Jennifer

T3TRIS

1987 Syncro GL converted to poptop
- 1994 Subaru EJ22
- Transaxle rebuild
- 215/75-R15
- Mexico paint job
- Front end rebuild

Fun off-roading
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View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
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