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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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 Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2020 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
Have you measured the block the adjusting stars are seated into?? If a little bit longer....
Original parts are all too often better than new ones. You might be able to make new adjusting star retaining springs and the other brake lever/spring clip out of banding strap. |
Yeah, I may just freshen up my old backing plates and fabricate the springs for those. It was a fun experiment to try the new ones, I guess! 😂
It's just weird to me that stuff fits on one side but not the other! More investigation tomorrow...
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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Culito
11010101
Joined: December 07, 2006
Posts: 5866
Location: Columbia Missourah
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2020 7:49 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Nice truck!
For the paint, I would experiment with some Citrus Strip. It's pretty gentle - experiment with how long to leave it sit on the old paint. Start with a couple minute intervals, scrub gently with soap and water, rinse. The longer it sits on the paint, the deeper it penetrates.
That way you can avoid using any type of abrasive. Finish off with 3M Perfect It 3000. Shiny shiny.
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Copyright CJ Industries, Inc.
'64 standard w/2.0L type 4
'62 bug
| johnnypan wrote: |
| ...dont pay no attention to Culito,he's a cornhole.. |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:34 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| bobrk wrote: |
| Eric&Barb wrote: |
Have you measured the block the adjusting stars are seated into?? If a little bit longer....
Original parts are all too often better than new ones. You might be able to make new adjusting star retaining springs and the other brake lever/spring clip out of banding strap. |
Yeah, I may just freshen up my old backing plates and fabricate the springs for those. It was a fun experiment to try the new ones, I guess! 😂
It's just weird to me that stuff fits on one side but not the other! More investigation tomorrow... |
I measured the adjuster blocks on my old backing plates and they were identical the new ones. But I also noticed that the clicker springs on my old left backing plate were still intact so I will clean up that plate and just have mis-matching backing plates. Maybe I’ll paint it! 😂
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:35 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Culito wrote: |
Nice truck!
For the paint, I would experiment with some Citrus Strip. It's pretty gentle - experiment with how long to leave it sit on the old paint. Start with a couple minute intervals, scrub gently with soap and water, rinse. The longer it sits on the paint, the deeper it penetrates.
That way you can avoid using any type of abrasive. Finish off with 3M Perfect It 3000. Shiny shiny. |
I like this. I will try it. Thanks!
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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BarryL 
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14266
Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2020 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Use your fists at 4 and 8 o-clock. Sometimes the slave isn't in all the way. |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:23 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| BarryL wrote: |
| Use your fists at 4 and 8 o-clock. Sometimes the slave isn't in all the way. |
Thanks, Barry, that's the first thing I thought of. I even pulled the shoes off and checked the cylinder (which is empty right now) to make sure the pistons were all the way in. The distance between them was the same as on the right side. So between the two sides, I:
1. checked the distance between the shoes at the adjusters = the same
2. checked the distance between the pistons = the same
3. Tried both drums = the same
Gotta be the shoes! I held them up to each other and they seemed the same, but I must be missing something somewhere.
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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ach60
Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2001
Posts: 4139
Location: Santa Maria
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| Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:23 am Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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[quote="bobrk"]Good Morning!
| bobrk wrote: |
| I found one of the clips from the spring to the e-brake plate and there's no way it would clip on to anything I have in there. I'll do some more looking around on that. |
I fiddled around with that clip and figured out how it works. Just need to find the other one.
So the left brake is still not going on. I think what I'm looking at is a tolerance difference between the two brake shoes. I measured the distance between the two shoes at the adjusters and it was the same for both sides. I measured the distance between the two pistons on the cylinder, and they were also the same on both sides.
By the end of the job, I was getting way too good at putting the shoes on and off. The other day, I was so frustrated at that task, I had to take a break, but today, I became a pro...
I was super bummed to have broken both of the adjuster springs while I was playing around with the adjusters. They were super brittle. Those springs were the main reason for buying new backing plates. Grrr. I guess I will learn how to make those springs.
The adjuster on one side is thicker than the other.
Get rid of the gold colored adjuster & replace with another silver colored one.
Also make sure the cut out for the shoe, in the adjuster is facing the right way.
If it's wedge is 180 out, then shit won't fit either.
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Good Luck
Al |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:10 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Haven't worked on the bus much the last few days, but I did have a peek in my treasure chest and found some treasures!
We had bought some cheap fiberboard door and kick panels that I intend to install, but they are missing the usual things, mainly the pockets. Well, what did I find in my treasure chest but a set of torn up door panels with intact pockets! So one of my interior projects will be to put those pockets on the door panels I have.
I also found a complete wiper motor and mechanism, presumably 12 volt. I'm not sure if I'm going to use it yet, now that I know that 12 volt armatures can be gotten for original 6V motors, so that's still to be determined.
In another part "stash" I found the dual reservoir I need to use with my new dual master cylinder, so all I need now is the spacer kit to get that action going.
I also found my OG glass tail lights to replace the faded plastic repos I have installed currently, so that will be pretty cool!
Still looking for the keys. You know, if you decide to park your bus somewhere for 20 years, put the keys in a safe place!
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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djfordmanjack
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Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 2173
Location: Graz, Austria, Europe
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:01 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Finally got a bit of time the last few days to work on my bus. It's hard around the holidays, and I also work outside, so after I get done with my Work From Home, it's 3 or 4 in the afternoon and the sun is about to go down. Excuses, excuses.
First things first, I managed to remember to put my speedo-cable circlip back on before I lost it. There's a job done.
Then I got back to the right rear brake. You'll remember in our saga that the drum didn't seem to be going all the way on, partly because the shoes were in the way, and maybe some spline issues.
I pulled the drum back off and just had a long look. I remembered that I'd broken the adjuster springs off the new backing plate, so I replaced it with the cleaned up old backing plate, which fit fine.
I examined all my adjusters, including the 4 left over from the front brakes. The front ones were much larger than the ones I had from the rear, but I did find one of the slotted pieces that had a smaller distance between the flange and the bottom of the slot. We're only talking a millimeter or two so I don't think that is the issue I'm having.
So as I was reassembling the brakes, I noticed that the e-brake cable was not seated in the backing plate, and realized that if the brake cable is pulling at all on the shoes, they could be robbing me of precious millimeters of clearance. So I seated the cable, and used a big screwdriver to make sure the e-brake lever was in its most-off position.
Grabbed a drum, and tried sliding it on again. It seemed like it wanted to go all the way on but not quite. It was definitely clearing the shoes and spun around fine. It felt like there was more resistance on the splines than on the other side. I looked at them and they seemed not perfect but still square and free of any big nicks. I put some grease in a strategic spot, and noticed that the base of the drum, which fits inside the bearing housing was indeed touching the washer. So I don't think I could get it on any further. The gap between the backing plate and the drum is pretty close to what I'm seeing on the other side.
My big problem now is that there is not much thread showing on the end of the axle! I forgot to get a picture, but the drum is probably a few threads in from the cotter pin holes.
Could I expect to have the axle pull out a bit as I torque down the axle nut? Seems like when I had the bearing cover pulled off, there was a lot of axial play in the axle, but it also disappeared when I got the cover back on, so I kind of assumed that was par for the course.
Anyway, Happy Holidays!
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24757
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:17 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Put the axle nut on and tighten it down some to see.
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In Stereo, Where Available! |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
| Put the axle nut on and tighten it down some to see. |
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking, but I have some work to do before I put it back down on the ground. None of my new brakes are hooked up yet, and I have a new m/c to put in...
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1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Speedo cable 😂
Good right side
Short left side
Can it pull the axle out a bit?
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1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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Long-roofs
Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2002
Posts: 2295
Location: Millwood, Wa
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| Posted: Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:51 am Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Looks like you are dealing with '63 one ton rear drums, they take the longer stub axle, you may have the 3/4 ton shorter axle on the one side.
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I have been on a treadmill drinking vodka, maybe more than once.
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ach60
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Joined: May 14, 2001
Posts: 4139
Location: Santa Maria
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:44 am Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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If that's the passenger side axle that we had trouble with getting the drum off in the 90's,
Please remember that Mac cut the damaged treads away so there isn't much thread engagement there.
Please be careful, nothing more than mild pressure on a 1/2" Ratchet, when you're playing around with getting that axle to pop out a little.
We don't want to rip up the remaining threads.
If all else fails, you can measure the depth in the cut out of the castle nut for the cotter pin, and have the snout of the drum machined off the same amount.
But first, I'd swap the drums from side to side first, to see if the "problem" is the drum, or what?
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Good Luck
Al |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| ach60 wrote: |
If that's the passenger side axle that we had trouble with getting the drum off in the 90's,
Please remember that Mac cut the damaged treads away so there isn't much thread engagement there.
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Nope, this is the driver's side. Should go together just like it did before. The passenger side went together great! Doubt that these new drums are any different from the old ones, but I'll check that.
| Quote: |
Please be careful, nothing more than mild pressure on a 1/2" Ratchet, when you're playing around with getting that axle to pop out a little.
We don't want to rip up the remaining threads. |
Yup, super cautious on this. I do need to put the truck down on the ground before I do this, though, which would be a milestone since it's been up on those jack stands for a couple of years now!
| Quote: |
If all else fails, you can measure the depth in the cut out of the castle nut for the cotter pin, and have the snout of the drum machined off the same amount.
But first, I'd swap the drums from side to side first, to see if the "problem" is the drum, or what? |
I tried both drums on this side and they went on the same way. I think I need to take the whole thing apart again and make sure that axle is pulled out all the way. I seem to recall a lot of axial play in the axle with the bearing holder removed.
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 24757
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| bobrk wrote: |
I tried both drums on this side and they went on the same way. I think I need to take the whole thing apart again and make sure that axle is pulled out all the way. I seem to recall a lot of axial play in the axle with the bearing holder removed. |
If you have RGBs, you are not dealing with the long axles that go to the transaxle center section. Drums are hung off of the stub axle, with little in/outward slop possible.
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In Stereo, Where Available! |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
| bobrk wrote: |
I tried both drums on this side and they went on the same way. I think I need to take the whole thing apart again and make sure that axle is pulled out all the way. I seem to recall a lot of axial play in the axle with the bearing holder removed. |
If you have RGBs, you are not dealing with the long axles that go to the transaxle center section. Drums are hung off of the stub axle, with little in/outward slop possible. |
Indeed. But when I had it apart before it seemed like the stub axle had a ton of axial play.
But none of this is new except the drums so some weird thing is happening.
_________________
1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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bobrk
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 288
Location: Beautiful Downtown San Jose
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:12 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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| Long-roofs wrote: |
| Looks like you are dealing with '63 one ton rear drums, they take the longer stub axle, you may have the 3/4 ton shorter axle on the one side. |
So how much shorter? I'm amazed that there are two small nut RGBs with different size axles.
Turns out, the old drum on that side was machined down!
The part numbers on both drums is the same.
The new drums I have look like the tall one...
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1959 Single Cab “Otto”
1500 single port | 1963 small nut/big brake transaxle | CSP Disc Brakes | dual circuit m/c | Deutsch Polster seats |
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ach60
Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2001
Posts: 4139
Location: Santa Maria
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:06 pm Post subject: Re: Bob's 1959 Single Cab Pickup — "Otto" |
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Wow! Great job finding the issue.
Everyday you get closer to......I don't know?
I think I'd have the "new" drum machined down,
I wouldn't even know how to start looking for the longer stub axle,
and I wouldn't know about the matching gear that goes on the long axle.
I'll defer to the experts though.
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Good Luck
Al |
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