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markswagen
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018
Posts: 1038
Location: san diego
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 Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 12:58 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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for a 1.8t, i would strongly consider doing the reverse rotation, and running the transmission that was designed to go on it, match the transmission to the power band of the engine.
or do the same thing with a subaru, put in the transmission that belongs with the engine.
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markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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ledogboy 
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2005
Posts: 578
Location: Scappoose, OR / Oakland, CA
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 1:40 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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| Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
No six cylinder gasser has ever produced acceptable fuel mileage for a T3; it's a cruel joke. I seriously considered installing the V6 from my old Audi 100CSQ I parted, but the shitty fuel economy reports from the Sambaru sixes convinced me otherwise.
I'm constantly baffled as to why Sambarus are so popular with these vans. The torque curve is silly and all wrong for an un-aerodynamic truck. The power is middling to meh, so the appeal is just a head-shaker. |
In fairness, neither of my 1.8t conversions (SAH or Flint reversed) have had decent mileage. Both have been worse than the WBX.
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1986 Westy Weekender
Now a full camper
1.8t Syncro conversion
Some people call him Maurice... |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 1:47 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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| ledogboy wrote: |
| Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
No six cylinder gasser has ever produced acceptable fuel mileage for a T3; it's a cruel joke. I seriously considered installing the V6 from my old Audi 100CSQ I parted, but the shitty fuel economy reports from the Sambaru sixes convinced me otherwise.
I'm constantly baffled as to why Sambarus are so popular with these vans. The torque curve is silly and all wrong for an un-aerodynamic truck. The power is middling to meh, so the appeal is just a head-shaker. |
In fairness, neither of my 1.8t conversions (SAH or Flint reversed) have had decent mileage. Both have been worse than the WBX. |
That doesn't surprise. I don't think gas is a good media for a truck, but I understand it's popular for lots of van people. I try to meet them halfway. My diesel swap seems to be a whole lot more efficient, but I've never really checked. It's certainly a shit-ton more powerful than a Sambaru.
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Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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khughes
Samba Member
Joined: July 13, 2013
Posts: 747
Location: Phoenix AZ
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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| Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
| ledogboy wrote: |
| Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
No six cylinder gasser has ever produced acceptable fuel mileage for a T3; it's a cruel joke. I seriously considered installing the V6 from my old Audi 100CSQ I parted, but the shitty fuel economy reports from the Sambaru sixes convinced me otherwise.
I'm constantly baffled as to why Sambarus are so popular with these vans. The torque curve is silly and all wrong for an un-aerodynamic truck. The power is middling to meh, so the appeal is just a head-shaker. |
In fairness, neither of my 1.8t conversions (SAH or Flint reversed) have had decent mileage. Both have been worse than the WBX. |
That doesn't surprise. I don't think gas is a good media for a truck, but I understand it's popular for lots of van people. I try to meet them halfway. My diesel swap seems to be a whole lot more efficient, but I've never really checked. It's certainly a shit-ton more powerful than a Sambaru. |
Wow, I'd be really p'od if my 2.0(now "T") didn't get much better mileage than my WBX ever thought of. My guess is tuning differences - mine's tuned to move the torque curve down where it needs to be, like 2800rpm up.
But the sixes, wow, those I know with subie 6's in syncros are looking at maybe 15 m/g babying it on the highway. I could drive 90mph for that kind of mileage. Maybe more, since I get >17mpg cruising at 80mph. As always YMMV 
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'86 Westy FAS GenV Turbo (Marvin) |
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Wellington
Samba Member
Joined: September 21, 2004
Posts: 1889
Location: Montreal
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 6:32 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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My Flint 1.8t does get better mileage than my original 1.9wbx
Better yes, but not staggering. Still moving a brick.
Just cause you got extra ponies doesn't mean you gotta light them off every time. I drive very sanely, have a stage 1 chip and run premium. |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 6:51 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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I easily get 20-23mpg in my 1.8T swap. several thousand miles and trips under it's belt.
I generally leave it stock boost and run regular pump gas. I run a 150hp AEB with an aircooled R&P on 205/70/15 tires.
I don't believe it's worth the premium for high octane or diesel fuel prices.
diesel people never talk $/mile when they boast mpg.
nor the added costs of the TDI swap and regearing the transaxle
FWIW, I think the Subie is your best bang 4 buck.
and I feel that the 1.8T in stock tune is matched well enough to the stock transaxle. though if you are going to rebuild a transaxle anyways.. then upgrading R&P is nearly moot.
if you want screaming torque and have a lead foot tendency you'll pay the gas tax with any powerplant. with great power comes great responsibility |
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westyventures
Samba Member
Joined: December 29, 2004
Posts: 2306
Location: Oregon Outback
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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Last edited by westyventures on Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:06 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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My TDI runs a stock aircooled DK trans and 28" tires. Then again, I've never boasted about my MPGs. I drive a turbodiesel for the torque and simplicity.
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Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:35 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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karl, diesel(2.69) is ~$.50/gal more than regular(2.09) here in my upstate NY station.
that's what ~%25 more per gal.
edit: forgot to back up gas prices in my local.. always told to show my work
https://www.gasbuddy.com/station/18330
a diesel, TD, or TDI shines in range/distance per tank..
I got 27mpg in my 1.6TD (DK transaxle) for years. up and down the east coast. but I prefer the quiet and actually communicating with my passengers while I travel.
somewhat in simplicity. only the mTDI rules in power and simplicity.
and what YOU who are the master and installer of custom Diesels for all my decades in the vanagon life, costs to you is not what it is to the 'everyman' and imo you are cutting yourself short of valuing your time, years of learning and experience gained over the 'everyman'
you are not in the 'everyman' category.
your less than $3k example, that's nearly used up in just the syncro transaxle these days.. it's not an 'everyman' example..
I'm not here to fight merits of TDI vs gas in any configuration but it's more $$ for the 'everyman' out there. |
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westyventures
Samba Member
Joined: December 29, 2004
Posts: 2306
Location: Oregon Outback
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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Last edited by westyventures on Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 8:29 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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come back east and see if you can find an MK3 of any variation on the road still then a TDI with less than 250kmiles. yeah right that's a unicorn over here for sure.
this thread is so far from the OP question of if there's any other 1.8T kits than SAH or FAS..
but you are still wrong on price of diesel. so enjoy it where you are..
the national average on both fuels.
Diesel is $.40/gal more money
https://www.google.com/search?q=national+average+diesel+price
| Quote: |
National average gas prices
------------------Regular-----Diesel
Current Avg. $2.161 $2.446
Yesterday Avg. $2.161 $2.444
Week Ago Avg. $2.128 $2.423
Month Ago Avg. $2.119 $2.364 |
I do remember when they were unloading the last of the new syncro transaxles. those few units were still $$ for the time..
I know well the value of long term parts acquisition.. seeing I have more Syncro parts myself than Insynco hisself.  but this isn't a pissing contest.
just don't come in here with your long term hoarde and tel us how cheap 'they[ can do it too. that boat has sailed long time ago.
I like ya Karl, I've always liked ya.. don't take me as an attack personally. |
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dobryan
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Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16504
Location: Brookeville, MD
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dobryan
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Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 16504
Location: Brookeville, MD
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16879
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:31 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| Subie torque is there. |
agreed. there is a video somewhere of me pulling the front wheels about 2" off the ground in my bus...yea, i know bay window, totally different...
bottom line... a gerbil on meth is better than any stock offering vw gave the vanagon.
one thing is for sure...it's all in the combo, gearing, tire size etc. get one wrong and you'll have a pig, no matter what is pushing it down the road.
i've never chased MPG's in buses and i have no intention on doing that in a vanagon. no matter how i drive my bay, with a frankenmotor in it, it average about 24 mpg.
when diesel was .80 a gallon, it was worth it...now...meh. no need to smell like a boiler
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:48 pm Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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come on skills you don't have to smell like a boiler,
when you can smell like a Canadian chip wagon
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buspor63
Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2005
Posts: 1179
Location: Knoxville,TN Where America stops for gas
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| Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:18 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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I'll attempt to answer the question. Those are the only two "kits" I've seen, SAH looks to be more complete.
My plan. I have a Syncro with a "good" engine and I have a wrecked Passat with a "good" AEB 1.8t. I've read that the AEB is the easiest swap because the wiring is simpler. I think the accessory belt drive system is more archaic, think 80's FWD cars.
I'll probably use a Kennedy adapter and clutch. I think the engine mounting, plumbing and exhaust is going to be all my work.
There's some additional reading in the stickies, several have done it before.
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Imagine that, theres not an "h" in either Westfalia or Syncro? |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16879
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 11:31 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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| buspor63 wrote: |
I think the accessory belt drive system is more archaic, think 80's FWD cars.
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i think i posted the pic here...
the belt drive is a PITA on the 058 blocks because of the external pump. there was no offering on these in transverse cars.
if you run just an alt, it would be easier, but if you have a/c and p/s it's a real assache to be honest.
don't waste your $$ on a mk3 serp belt setup for these either...they just won't work no matter what manifold you use.
you could do the 06A block an run AEB management, and do the tensioner elimination kit. the AEB is simple in terms of the t belt...16v tensioner and you're off to the races. the 06A block needs a spacer (i think, been a while) but there are kits for that
either way, the 058 block was a combo of V belts and a serp belt
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 11:54 am Post subject: Re: 1.8T conversion kit other than SAH or FAS? |
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The serp belt setup is one of the reasons I prefer the ALH and later TDI engines. Everything bolted right up just like in the donor Jetta, and even the PS pump fittings were the same as the WBX. Super easy
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Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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