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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 5:45 am Post subject: Re: Shifting problem in SW Florida |
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UPDATE:
Turns out it was air in the system
Bled it a 2-3 times whenever shifting became difficult
Thanks for all the help
T |
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Multiman mv Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2017 Posts: 987 Location: Martha's Vineyard, Ma
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Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 5:27 pm Post subject: Re: Shifting problem in SW Florida |
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Definitely check the base of the shifter that it hasn’t shifted in the elongated holes as someone else has already mentioned. My old shifter had a bolt that was stripped at the base and occasionally the oval plate would shift. When this happened i could not shift into first. Amazing how a small shift could have such a big impact on shiftability. _________________ 1991 multivan, FAS 1.9 tdi, Peloquin limited slip
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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space wrote: |
MarkWard wrote: |
Then adjustment should be the same as described in the manual. But since you can shift into 1st with the engine off, still sounds like a clutch type issue. The catch is, reverse should also have the same problem and you haven’t mentioned that.
Also, it may not be that the shop doesn’t know what’s wrong. Often something is lost in translation when an owner attempts to post what the shop said. Sometimes when trying to describe a problem to an owner, I need to dumb it down a bit. |
clutch and pilot hve leass than 7k mles and only 2yrs old (may not be important) |
A clutch type problem where the transmission is not completely disengaging from the engine for multiple possibilities. Also new parts can be mismatched, misinstalled, or fail prematurely.
I stand by that there has not been a single vanagon I couldn’t shift even with all the bushings blown out. You just need to have a feel and an understanding of how it works. Best of luck. _________________ ☮️ |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 1:52 pm Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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MarkWard wrote: |
Then adjustment should be the same as described in the manual. But since you can shift into 1st with the engine off, still sounds like a clutch type issue. The catch is, reverse should also have the same problem and you haven’t mentioned that.
Also, it may not be that the shop doesn’t know what’s wrong. Often something is lost in translation when an owner attempts to post what the shop said. Sometimes when trying to describe a problem to an owner, I need to dumb it down a bit. |
clutch and pilot hve leass than 7k mles and only 2yrs old (may not be important) |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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buspor63 wrote: |
First of all, no cable involved.
Here's a few things to diagnose.
Does the clutch pedal still feel the same?
Are there any leaks coming down from the steering column?
Looking in from the engine hatch, left forward bellhousing side. Does the clutch slave still move the arm about 1.5 inches through the stroke?
Harder to see, but a failure point. On the passenger side of the transmission, can you tell it the "ball" on the end of the shift lever has slid up? This usually throws your shift gate off to the left. First and second are often hard to find. |
imo SC doesnt move a full 1.5" more like 1"
ball doesnt appear to have moved up
pic upload taking awhile |
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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6833 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:31 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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space wrote: |
update:
shop says clutch etc is fine (they specialized in German vehicles)
They think its hanging up on the forward linkage
As a temp fix I will drop the shifter box and grease up the linkage
Their wait time for parts is 2 weeks
Any thoughts?
T
edit: clutch has less than 7k miles on it 90% highway |
Before you disconnect any linkage mark it's mating positions so you put it back exactly as it came off. The gearbox is a long way from the front shift lever and exact alignment of the linkage is crucial to it working! Do not re-align it from original positions to make it work. _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:14 am Post subject: Re: Shifting problem in SW Florida |
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Its at the shop at the moment (about 40miles away)
Will check these suggestions out
Want to thank everyone for their input
T
Will verify that they bled the system
However I was told the slave "piston" extended 1.5"? |
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bobhill8 Samba Member
Joined: June 09, 2017 Posts: 737 Location: MA
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:04 am Post subject: Re: Shifting problem in SW Florida |
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You mentioned the clutch pedal felt spongy. Did the shop bleed it? Did they check for dampness around the clutch master and slave. If the shop has not specifically worked on vanagons, they could be a bit lost. I’ve not come across any vanagons I couldn’t shift even with all the bushings tabs etc gone.
Dropping the spare gives you easy access to grease the base of the shift lever from below. _________________ ☮️ |
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fishgo Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2018 Posts: 127 Location: Madison, WI
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:02 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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I occasionally have this problem when the two screws that hold the shifting mechanism inside the cab come loose. I don't know the technical jargon so bear with me: pull up the rubber shift boot on the bottom of the shifter (inside the cab). You'll notice an oval plate held to the floor of the vehicle (above the shifter box under the van) screwed to the floor with two screws forward and back. If either of those has loosened up, that shift plate that holds this mechanism all together can move around just a bit, which changes the angle of your overall shifting linkage. Just a little play will hinder my shifting into 1st gear, then later 2nd gear if enough movement play is found.
You'll need to find the sweet spot to tighten that plate back down. It is supposed to align with a couple of holes in the plate and match the floor, but mine is slightly offset for best shifting performance.
Might not be your issue, but it is mine about 1x a year. |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:59 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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4Gears4Tires wrote: |
What parts do they say it needs? |
Bushings was their term |
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4Gears4Tires Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018 Posts: 3048 Location: MD
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:45 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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What parts do they say it needs? _________________ '87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:41 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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update:
shop says clutch etc is fine (they specialized in German vehicles)
They think its hanging up on the forward linkage
As a temp fix I will drop the shifter box and grease up the linkage
Their wait time for parts is 2 weeks
Any thoughts?
T
edit: clutch has less than 7k miles on it 90% highway |
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4Gears4Tires Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018 Posts: 3048 Location: MD
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:35 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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Just for testing you could remove the shifter gate box under the van to get a few more degrees. If it shifts into 1 and 2 with the gate removed, then you know it needs adjustment.
I also think it's more likely clutch related since it shifts fine with the engine off. _________________ '87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:33 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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Then adjustment should be the same as described in the manual. But since you can shift into 1st with the engine off, still sounds like a clutch type issue. The catch is, reverse should also have the same problem and you haven’t mentioned that.
Also, it may not be that the shop doesn’t know what’s wrong. Often something is lost in translation when an owner attempts to post what the shop said. Sometimes when trying to describe a problem to an owner, I need to dumb it down a bit. _________________ ☮️ |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:34 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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MarkWard wrote: |
If it shifts fine with the engine off, that points to a clutch/pilot bearing issue.
If not, the engine or trans mounts might allow the assembly to move out of alignment. But that’s a far out suggestion.
Edit. It would be helpful to know who’s conversion kit you are running and if the bell housing is stock using an adapter or a small car type bellhousing. |
KEP conversion |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:14 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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If it shifts fine with the engine off, that points to a clutch/pilot bearing issue.
If not, the engine or trans mounts might allow the assembly to move out of alignment. But that’s a far out suggestion.
Edit. It would be helpful to know who’s conversion kit you are running and if the bell housing is stock using an adapter or a small car type bellhousing. _________________ ☮️ |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:09 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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dobryan wrote: |
The subaru engine should have nothing to do with the trans shifting issue. That mechanic that looked at it does not have a clue.
If it is a linkage issue..... If nothing looks amiss at the transmission end of the linkage I'd remove the spare tire and unbolt the shift box cover that is directly under where the shift lever goes thru the floor. Take a pic of the shift linkage there and post it. The shift tabs may be missing or something else is going on? |
thanks for the response
Thats my thought about the sub/trans made no sense to me |
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dobryan Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006 Posts: 16504 Location: Brookeville, MD
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:53 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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The subaru engine should have nothing to do with the trans shifting issue. That mechanic that looked at it does not have a clue.
If it is a linkage issue..... If nothing looks amiss at the transmission end of the linkage I'd remove the spare tire and unbolt the shift box cover that is directly under where the shift lever goes thru the floor. Take a pic of the shift linkage there and post it. The shift tabs may be missing or something else is going on? _________________ Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2002 Subaru EJ25 and Peloquin TBD
"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson
MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646
Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371
The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794 |
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space Samba Member
Joined: November 19, 2017 Posts: 673
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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:49 am Post subject: Re: shifting problem in sw/florida |
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buspor63 wrote: |
First of all, no cable involved.
Here's a few things to diagnose.
Does the clutch pedal still feel the same?
Are there any leaks coming down from the steering column?
Looking in from the engine hatch, left forward bellhousing side. Does the clutch slave still move the arm about 1.5 inches through the stroke?
Harder to see, but a failure point. On the passenger side of the transmission, can you tell it the "ball" on the end of the shift lever has slid up? This usually throws your shift gate off to the left. First and second are often hard to find. |
clutch pedal seems spongy
i didnt see any leaks (master cylinder resevoir is full)
the ball did seem to get hung up once on the bracket i greased it up to reduce friction |
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