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Axitech Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2011 Posts: 1265 Location: Bucks County, Pa
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Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 8:07 pm Post subject: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Considering swap to water-cooled power. Not enough time to do it myself, and i finally have reached the point of having a little fun money. How much would you expect to pay someone, a shop to install a fuel injected, four cylinder engine, complete job, parts, labor, all in? _________________ He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson |
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rayjay Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2008 Posts: 1501 Location: Buford GA
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 8:22 am Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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$3 to $5 K |
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12816 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 9:12 am Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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If you supply the engine/donor, adapter, cooling system components, fuel system components, & all other necessary items. _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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thesatelliteguy Samba Member
Joined: January 06, 2007 Posts: 1515 Location: Santa Rosa CA
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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I did it my self to the tune of around $4,000. Mind you I built a lot of stuff my self, which I’m sure saved a lot of monies.
I think it’s kind of hard to give you a quote bc there are so many variables. _________________ Toyotas are so bumpy it makes me sick, literally.
My build Page http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=383878 |
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Axitech Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2011 Posts: 1265 Location: Bucks County, Pa
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 8:08 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Thank you! Sometimes its good to get a reality check before diving into a dark pool. _________________ He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson |
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Axitech Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2011 Posts: 1265 Location: Bucks County, Pa
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 8:25 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Thank you! Sometimes its good to get a reality check before diving into a dark pool. _________________ He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson |
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Wulfthang Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2018 Posts: 715 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Don't can the idea yet! Just make a different plan! First, what kind of engine are you wanting to swap for? That makes a difference on a lot of things like what size radiator you'll need, fuel injection or not, exhaust, etc. etc. A Kennedy adapter https://www.kennedyeng.com will run $500 to $2K depending on the engine. You don't have to run the latest engine. Maybe go for an older naturally aspirated V6. That means no expensive turbo plumbing, no electronic systems wiring, no computer, etc. I'm running an older Ford 2.8 V6 in my street legal rail and it has enough power to fly me down the highway at 100mph+ with some room left to play or pull me up and down old mining trails at grunt speed. |
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Axitech Samba Member
Joined: August 31, 2011 Posts: 1265 Location: Bucks County, Pa
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Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:46 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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I’m actually looking for reliability, with a little bit more hp than I’m getting from a built vw engine (mild build). Reliability is key. I’d love to be able to use a carburated four, or very light v6.
Just getting tired of having to pull a motor after every 2500 mile trip to see my little nephews. _________________ He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson |
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stevebaz Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2008 Posts: 189 Location: El Monte CA
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Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:08 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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the further you figure what you want the better off you are. buying parts is buying parts you can do all the hunting and buying and leave the builders just to build what you are paying for. paying someone a 100 bucks an hour to find and buy parts is going to pad the bill allot. while they wont cut corners you can saving cash. the other grey area is letting someone else build your car their way. understand the difference between building you car or building the car that represents the car and image of their work and shop. they make the decision for you and buy the easy most expensive stuff. then you end up with high end fuel cells Willwood brake system from front to rear and king triple bypass shocks. Great if you want that but sucks if you don't. Think of phasing in the work. start a phase one get that done and paid for then go on to phase 2 and so on. make sure you have a written contract with progress payments if you can. Just remember when they call for a decision that will cost you more money, its outside your deal with them.
the more you know the better off you are. if things go sour the longer you wait to pull out, the worse it gets. do you want weekly progress reports with photos then spell it out in the work order.
There are allot of good shops out there and their are poor ones that milk you out and take forever. GOOD LUCK AND MAKE GOOD CHOICES. |
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Wulfthang Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2018 Posts: 715 Location: Tucson
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Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 8:58 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Or you could use it as an excuse to get in touch with your inner creative artist, your inner engine/fabricator swapper, your inner Engine Techncian aka "Wrench". If the car isn't a daily driver, maybe lay it up for a year and do the swap yourself. It's really not that difficult, depending on what you're doing. The Kennedy swap kit does all of the really hard work and matches the engine up with your VW trany. (Don't forget drive train mods)
After that...assuming you went with a carbed V engine...it's just a matter of convincing the auto parts store clerk to let you dig thru the radiator hoses looking for one "bends this way for a little and then that way for a while and goes straight for about this long and......" and stuff like that. Well mostly. Ok not even close but I guarantee you that you'll pop with pride when you look at something that you built and made it go. |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12632 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 5:16 am Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Most shops will want to go with something "cookie cutter" easy to protect thier reputation and avoid the unknowns that burn a hole in profits quickly.
You haven't told us what the end use will be or what chassis it will be in but if it's a sand rail type I would seriously consider an ALH diesel. All the torque you will ever need for hills, rpms match the stock gearing well, excellent fuel range and it's as close to zero maintenance as you will find. _________________ We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age) |
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BFB Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 1693
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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oprn wrote: |
Most shops will want to go with something "cookie cutter" easy to protect thier reputation and avoid the unknowns that burn a hole in profits quickly...... |
there's a lot of truth in that statement _________________ Forced induction can overcome a lot of obsticles that gets in it's way
"You are the Engineer and the Mechanic.
Build it your way not the way someone else does it. Their way might not work for you." - clonebug
An interesting thing happens in forums where everyone starts parroting the same thing and "common knowledge" takes over.
“ The monkey see monkey do mentality seems to run deep in VW people. "Gene Berg said it was so 30 years ago so thats the way it is" “ - bdkw1 |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 8:03 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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You might look into a Toyota Corolla engine.
Very common in wrecking yards. Thus inexpensive and readily available. Replacement parts are easy. There's a guy on here, "Ed", who had one in his rail. Haven't seen his name the last couple or 3 weeks.
I'll see if I can round up his user ID. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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earthquake Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2008 Posts: 3984 Location: SANDY VALLEY, NEVADA
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 8:22 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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There's the old standby, the 2.3L ford Pinto/Ranger, still have a good following with the Roundy round boys. You might be able to find a complete set up from somebody going back to VW. Plenty of torque and it easy to get 150hp out of one. biggest problem is they are heavy.
eQ _________________ 74 CLASS 11 LOOK-A-LIKE
69 DUNE BUGGY
79 INTERNATIONAL SCOUT II
05 SCION XB SERIES RELEASE 2[#437]
95 Chevy C3500 dually
98 Ford E150
Link to Kelly J. Nolte 3/20/53 - 11/6/08
https://time-zonelabs.blogspot.com/p/about-kelly.html
DEATH TO CHINGERS!
[From a military recruitment poster in the novel "The Stainless Steel Rat" By Harry Harrison] |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2021 8:57 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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dustymojave wrote: |
You might look into a Toyota Corolla engine.
Very common in wrecking yards. Thus inexpensive and readily available. Replacement parts are easy. There's a guy on here, "Ed", who had one in his rail. Haven't seen his name the last couple or 3 weeks.
I'll see if I can round up his user ID. |
Look up "no1clyde ".
_________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12632 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2021 7:15 am Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Toyota is good but on top of the FI and crank trigger you have the variable valve timing to try and control. Sounds pretty complicated to me. _________________ We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age) |
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77charger Samba Member
Joined: November 12, 2005 Posts: 1492
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Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 10:26 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Did a honda 3.5 in mine.It fit my car great and was not too bad for cost got the engine,ecu,adapter plate for 1500,friend gave me clutch and PP bought some headers for 450 custom made,250 for fuel system,350 for complete cooling system cherokee alm radiator,probably another 350 in misc parts.
I did my own labor so that saved alot sold my old well built 2275 for 2500 at the time which was a steal.But love the honda as far as power goes instant and fast.
Ecotecs are also a good choice too _________________ Click to view image
Bugpack 4 seater rail
2275 built by me
Auto linea alm case,82 dpr crank wedgemated by DK machine
cb 5.4 h beams,12 pound DPR f/w,Slr xv294cam,cb straight cuts,hpmx 44s,40x35 heads ported by brothers machine |
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Scott SD Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2010 Posts: 153 Location: San Diego, CA
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Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 11:13 am Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Ecotecs have a huge following in the desert. Cheap, dependable, and fairly light. While I am not a GM guy, it does look like a good package. |
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77charger Samba Member
Joined: November 12, 2005 Posts: 1492
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Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 11:14 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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Scott SD wrote: |
Ecotecs have a huge following in the desert. Cheap, dependable, and fairly light. While I am not a GM guy, it does look like a good package. |
I was going to go the ecotec route too but was going to be within 1/4 inche clearance if all went perfect with my measurements.Then o was going to have to get full asking price for my 2275 i was selling at the time which was going to be hard to do then.
But like said came across honda 3.5 deal for half price of ecotec route but both these engines are easy to get although i think the hondas are a lil more common and cheaper.Friend had issues with his found a complete replacement for 400 bucks.
Heres what the 3.5 looks like in it and old pic of vw
_________________ Click to view image
Bugpack 4 seater rail
2275 built by me
Auto linea alm case,82 dpr crank wedgemated by DK machine
cb 5.4 h beams,12 pound DPR f/w,Slr xv294cam,cb straight cuts,hpmx 44s,40x35 heads ported by brothers machine |
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danielzink Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2004 Posts: 282 Location: Lansing Michigan
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Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 12:47 pm Post subject: Re: Swap to water-cooled? |
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I went Subaru so I could keep the "horizontally opposed" esthetic....
Granted I did 85% of my own work so I don't have much to add to the OP's question...
$600 for a rusted out 90,000 mile Legacy....$600 for the cut down harness..then various and sundry piping...sumped gas tank...eBay radiator etc...
I'd say I've got under 2k into it.
Just wanted to show another option.
Dan _________________ 1965 Notchback 2300cc Type4
Subaru Powered Rail
1915 Rail
www.danielzink.com |
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