trans noisy going into 3rd

[pgurnee]

My 88 is growling at me.
Shifting into 1, 2 and 4 is no different than it has ever been, 3rd not so much.

I have tried letting the rpm drop and gently 'feathering' the shift. This helps ... sometimes.

I called the shop that has worked on the van in the past but the owner, who was the vw specialist, has retired from shop work and is not in every day any more.

Is it at all possible that the shift linkage needs adjusting or is it far more likely the synchro?
Thanks
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[MarkWard]

Growling or Grinding?
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[pgurnee]

Grinding is a better description.
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[MarkWard]

It’s likely not external. Nothing wrong with checking. Does it shift into 3rd with the engine idling in neutral quietly?
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[pgurnee]

I just went out to try that.
Yes. It shifts into 3rd quietly with the engine at idle.
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[MarkWard]

It’s likely a combination of the 3/4 slider hub coming apart and the synchronizer ring not properly grabbing the gear for shifts. Search 3/4 slider or hub and I believe Go Westy has an tech article on their website. You may want to not drive it much if the hub has failed. Pieces could cause more damage. Sorry
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[pgurnee]

Ouch Mark, bad news this is. This is my work truck. I am a carpenter. I have a job about 50 mile round trip tomorrow. Guess I am borrowing the wife's Sienna tomorrow.
Thanks
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[MarkWard]

My diagnosis is worse case scenario. Any chance of finding a good used one? Synchronizer rings do wear out and grinding is an indication they are wearing. Search You Tube for videos on how to double clutch. This method was how non synchronizer transmissions were shifted in the olden days. The good news is forth shifts fine and you don’t mention it sticking in 4th. 3
and 4 share the same moving parts. So that’s the good news. If it’s a worn synchronizer, you can drive it for years double clutching. A fluid change might also improve shifting if your not sure what’s in it. Lots of threads on which lube is best.
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[Sodo]

3rd/4th slider hubs typical failure is "150-200k miles".
Look at the drain magnet, if you see peices of 3rd/4th hub, you'll know more.

A "change" in how it shifts in 3rd/4th suggests that it has added another crack.
Sometimes the circular spring can hold the cracked hub peices in place.
But at speed, the centrifugal force throws the broken hub parts outward with more force than the spring can hold, and it doesn't shift as well.
Then slowing down, (or stopped) the spring ring is holding the parts together so it seems to shift "normal".

If that's the case.....it's on the verge of catastrophic failure.

[Wildthings]

A rebuilt exchange may be your quickest fix if the 3-4 slider is failing.

[SurfaceRust]

Have a look at your front transmission mount. It's probably not this, but its quick and doesn't hurt to check. If the mount is degraded it can create some noise.

[pgurnee]

I have found a shop to take care of my transmission.
Craig is a vw factory trained mechanic. He uses German Transaxle out of Bend. The shop has to ship my trans up to them to rebuild, no core exchange anymore for Vanagon transmissions. Good news is the turn around is presently
1 1/2 weeks. In talking to Craig I told him I had it towed because of advice from the Samba. He said I got good advice.
Thanks everybody.
Paul
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[pgurnee]

The trans went to German Transmission in Bend Oregon.
It was totally shot. It has died at 206,000 miles.
Needs: R&P, 1st 2nd 4th gears, a 1-2 sleeve and a different sleeve having something to do with a gear carrier.

I am getting the recommended 3rg gear upgrade and something called a super disk I think.
They were recommended because of the way I use the van: carpenter, very heavy loads, dump trailer sometimes. 3rd and 4th replacement gears are cut different and therefor stronger as I understand it.

ouch.
I looked into full size vans but as expensive as this tranny is going to be I can't swing that, nor do I want to.
It will be a work truck again...in about 2 1/2 weeks.
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.

[MarkWard]

It would be a challenge to have a 30 year old vehicle as a daily driver let alone run a small business out of it. It's not the cost so much as the down time. I had an Audi 5000 Turbo that I began to notice I was spending my off time keeping it going for my job. Ended up buying a new car so that when I was off, I was off.
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[Sodo]

Your mainshaft bearing bore was worn out so a fix is to "sleeve" the gear carrier, then they bore a new fresh hole for the mainshaft bearing.
I suppose they are putting straight-cut 3rd & 4th gears in?

Super disk? What's that?
Maybe Super diff? A Peloquin differential?

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I don't recall your engine size.
Straight cut gears are stronger, at the 'cost' of added gear noise, and usually for bigger engines.
But of course stronger doesn't hurt for smaller engines and especially a work truck.

So sad to see a trans driven to the bitter end - and destroyed.
But that's just how it goes, nobody could know the proper time to rebuild.
You can't tell when that magical point is - after you've gotten all the miles out and before it's started to eat itself.
It's just the way it goes.
The 'noise' increases incrementally, and very slowly so you wouldn't notice.
But any noise and really, it's DONE and is starting to eat itself up, deleting huge miles from your "next rebuild".
Where you have to buy more new parts instead.
IF they are available.
And if not, you'll wish you didn't "use up" the old ones to get just a few thousand more miles out.

With these old vans, and the dismal transaxle maintenance they receive, I kinda think.....

If it has 125,000 miles, get it rebuilt.
If you just have to run it longer, use 150,000 but change the oil as often as you can tolerate because then you'll at least know it's "over" observing when it starts to put out hairier drainplugs.
At least you can "know" to stop driving it.
If a thrillseeker, or if you still think "used trannies are out there, and I can find one if I need one", use 175,000.

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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[DanHoug]

[MarkWard]

I recall Waldi felt 60,000 miles and replace the pinion and main bearings. Easy for someone with the skills and tools. Not so easy for the masses.
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[pgurnee]

I feel fortunate that I have had such good service out of this van. I have been using vanagons for work for 30 odd years and had very good service. This one has had the most mileage on it. It was used for work in its previous life also. A machinist owned it. He designed and fabricated racing parts for motorcycles and traveled to shows to sell. He is the one who stripped out the interior and put in the Linex.

I am sure the van tried to tell me it was in need of attention. I just could not hear it. I am 70 with mod/sev loss in one ear and mod loss in the other. 40 years ago I had a reaction to an antibiotic. The Dept of Rehab has just supplied me with custom hearing aids for my job. I got them right after the trans quit. I am amazed at what I have not heard for a lot of years. I thought my wife's Sienna was totally whisper quiet. It is not. Evidently the van was not either.

The down time is problematic. I put a hitch on the Sienna and use the trailer when I need too. Again fortunately I am in the hand tool phase of a few jobs now...

Yes, I think you must be right...a super diff. Not peloquin.
I am sure the 3/4 hub is included.
Yes the 3rd 4th gears are straight cut.
The engine is the original water boxer, rebuilt before I bought it at
130,000.
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1988, In previous life a Wolfsburg Weekender in present life an excellent work truck.