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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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 Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:23 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Sold for $65,000!!?? That's some serious buyers remorse. Most expensive Panel ever sold?
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No.
Several panels have sold for more than that. The difference is that the others were worth more than that bus. There is another world where these cars change hands outside of auctions. The general public doesn't always get a chance to buy the best and most valuable cars. |
Now I'm curious, what's the most you've seen someone spend for a Bus, without all those horrible windows and obnoxious ventilation? |
I know of panels that have sold for six figures.
I personally have spent more on a panelvan than what that one sold for. |
Were these expensive panels all pre-64? |
Pre-'55 |
Pre-'55 has historical value, I can understand that.
But was this the most expensive 64-67 Panel anyone has yet seen? |
I have not heard of any fat hatch panel selling for anywhere near that price. If you take off the $25k premium for the Porsche logos, you get back to a still high price for the panel, but one that is more realistic. The moral of this story is that if you have a paintjob commercial model bus, paint some porsche logos on it and sell it on BAT. You should be able to get the logos done for about $1k, and Porsche apparently has no interest in protecting their trademarks...
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Split 66'
Samba Member
Joined: October 07, 2010
Posts: 1257
Location: Bay Area, California
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| Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:35 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
| Split 66' wrote: |
| Sold for $65,000!!?? That's some serious buyers remorse. Most expensive Panel ever sold?
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No.
Several panels have sold for more than that. The difference is that the others were worth more than that bus. There is another world where these cars change hands outside of auctions. The general public doesn't always get a chance to buy the best and most valuable cars. |
Now I'm curious, what's the most you've seen someone spend for a Bus, without all those horrible windows and obnoxious ventilation? |
I know of panels that have sold for six figures.
I personally have spent more on a panelvan than what that one sold for. |
Were these expensive panels all pre-64? |
Pre-'55 |
Pre-'55 has historical value, I can understand that.
But was this the most expensive 64-67 Panel anyone has yet seen? |
I have not heard of any fat hatch panel selling for anywhere near that price. If you take off the $25k premium for the Porsche logos, you get back to a still high price for the panel, but one that is more realistic. The moral of this story is that if you have a paintjob commercial model bus, paint some porsche logos on it and sell it on BAT. You should be able to get the logos done for about $1k, and Porsche apparently has no interest in protecting their trademarks... |
Completely agree, paint Porsche on any bus for a $30K BAT-bonus.
Wonder how many more of these Porsche/buses before the market is finally sated. At least one more of these will be needed for the losing bidder of this bus.
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 11004
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:16 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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The most pathetic thing is that it sold for near double what that original paint and preserved Italian panel sold for recently.
It is interesting that despite some very knowledgeable people pointing out some obvious defects that thing still sold for unbelievable money. Problem with mediocre cars getting big money is that it de-incentivizes people from doing high caliber work.
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Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
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1963 356 B coupe
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Douglas Denlinger
Samba Member
Joined: May 23, 2003
Posts: 1382
Location: Arizona's version of the east coast
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:24 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Braukuche wrote: |
The most pathetic thing is that it sold for near double what that original paint and preserved Italian panel sold for recently.
It is interesting that despite some very knowledgeable people pointing out some obvious defects that thing still sold for unbelievable money. Problem with mediocre cars getting big money is that it de-incentivizes people from doing high caliber work. |
True story 
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:04 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Braukuche wrote: |
The most pathetic thing is that it sold for near double what that original paint and preserved Italian panel sold for recently.
It is interesting that despite some very knowledgeable people pointing out some obvious defects that thing still sold for unbelievable money. Problem with mediocre cars getting big money is that it de-incentivizes people from doing high caliber work. |
On one hand, it is good for people who are wise enough to buy solid cars in boring colors without porsche logos. On the other hand, it encourages people to desecrate good buses for a quick buck at an auction.
Many of the high caliber buses are not sold at auctions because it is sometimes a poor venue for good cars. Conversely, many shiny low caliber buses are sold at auctions because they do better there than through other venues.
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sled
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2005
Posts: 6179
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Lind wrote: |
Many of the high caliber buses are not sold at auctions because it is sometimes a poor venue for good cars. Conversely, many shiny low caliber buses are sold at auctions because they do better there than through other venues. |
1000%
all of the really nice/valuable buses sell privately.
the vast majority of the buses (and other vws) that sell on BAT would not sell for anywhere NEAR the hammer prices here on the samba or other vw-specific sites. Does that mean they're actually worth what they sell for on BAT? absolutely not. If you're shopping for a vintage VW, do not shop on BAT.
I pity the fool who paid that much for that panel 
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| sled wrote: |
| Lind wrote: |
Many of the high caliber buses are not sold at auctions because it is sometimes a poor venue for good cars. Conversely, many shiny low caliber buses are sold at auctions because they do better there than through other venues. |
1000%
all of the really nice/valuable buses sell privately.
the vast majority of the buses (and other vws) that sell on BAT would not sell for anywhere NEAR the hammer prices here on the samba or other vw-specific sites. Does that mean they're actually worth what they sell for on BAT? absolutely not. If you're shopping for a vintage VW, do not shop on BAT.
I pity the fool who paid that much for that panel |
The Italian panel was a good buy on BAT. There was a '59 walkthrough kombi which was also a good buy, although it did have porsche logos. There are some good buses that go across BAT, but there are also plenty of lipsticked pigs.
Unfortunately, currently there are not a lot of good looking buses for sale on thesamba. It is probably the worst lot of split buses I have ever seen for sale on this site, which might be contributing to both the prices and supply on BAT. All of the good cars and reasonable deals here are selling super fast, and all that is left is the garbage and overpriced buses. It takes patience and perseverance to get a good bus here these days.
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 11004
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:21 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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Samba is a good place for project cars, but most people on the site are living in the 90s when it comes to prices and restoring a car today is insanely expensive even if you do your own work. The only place I’ve seen that publicly and consistently fetches sellers a good price for v8 tags VWs is BAT. True a lot of polished turds get far more than they would here, but well done cars also fetch more on BAT than on here.
I always wonder about this private sell thing. Unless you are plugged into the “scene” how do you market your car off line to private buyers?
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Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
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Erik G
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13280
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 9:00 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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Agree with most of the above but not all of it. There have been some very nice buses sold at auction. In my opinion altering the scene enough to cause some of what we are seeing. VW Buses at BJ was a huge eye opener for bus and not bus people alike. I haven't seen great buses at auction much lately though, that's for sure.
If I were selling a collector grade bus I would discuss with Holy Grail garage Brendan or maybe Randy C since I don't live in SoCal and I don't regularly speak with the monster bus crowd. |
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BUCIOBATISTI
Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2002
Posts: 6956
Location: San Diego, California, USA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:48 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Erik G wrote: |
Agree with most of the above but not all of it. There have been some very nice buses sold at auction. In my opinion altering the scene enough to cause some of what we are seeing. VW Buses at BJ was a huge eye opener for bus and not bus people alike. I haven't seen great buses at auction much lately though, that's for sure.
If I were selling a collector grade bus I would discuss with Holy Grail garage Brendan or maybe Randy C since I don't live in SoCal and I don't regularly speak with the monster bus crowd. |
Thanks.
Yes, there are a lot of horrific auction results as well that people tend to not remember.
It's a total crap shoot at most auctions with so many variables outside of your control.
Which day they take place
Which time slot
Who is in the crowd
How many people are in the crowd
How many people really care about Volkswagens and not only understand what is what but which ones are actually quality and worth owning versus the garbage that so many of them are in reality.
Then you have to roll the dice a bit as so many of the venues require that you go with no reserve or THEY determine an especially low reserve to increase their likelihood of netting a sale which is going against your interest of getting a good or great price for your substantial asset!
I have seen some absolutely horrifically bad results where sellers walk away feeling like they got mule kicked in the balls and absolutely cannot come close to replacing what they just sold for anywhere near as little as they just gave it away for.
Then we can talk about how most major auction venues are now charging 10-12% PER SIDE on cars they sell. 10-12% from the seller, 10-12% from the buyer. That's a total of 20-24% of the value of the car they sell. Can we not all agree that that is not just crazy high, it's certainly offensive on many levels as well.
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:58 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| BUCIOBATISTI wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
Agree with most of the above but not all of it. There have been some very nice buses sold at auction. In my opinion altering the scene enough to cause some of what we are seeing. VW Buses at BJ was a huge eye opener for bus and not bus people alike. I haven't seen great buses at auction much lately though, that's for sure.
If I were selling a collector grade bus I would discuss with Holy Grail garage Brendan or maybe Randy C since I don't live in SoCal and I don't regularly speak with the monster bus crowd. |
Thanks.
Yes, there are a lot of horrific auction results as well that people tend to not remember.
It's a total crap shoot at most auctions with so many variables outside of your control.
Which day they take place
Which time slot
Who is in the crowd
How many people are in the crowd
How many people really care about Volkswagens and not only understand what is what but which ones are actually quality and worth owning versus the garbage that so many of them are in reality.
Then you have to roll the dice a bit as so many of the venues require that you go with no reserve or THEY determine an especially low reserve to increase their likelihood of netting a sale which is going against your interest of getting a good or great price for your substantial asset!
I have seen some absolutely horrifically bad results where sellers walk away feeling like they got mule kicked in the balls and absolutely cannot come close to replacing what they just sold for anywhere near as little as they just gave it away for.
Then we can talk about how most major auction venues are now charging 10-12% PER SIDE on cars they sell. 10-12% from the seller, 10-12% from the buyer. That's a total of 20-24% of the value of the car they sell. Can we not all agree that that is not just crazy high, it's certainly offensive on many levels as well. |
I was really bummed out when John Jones' SWR swivel seat kombi went across the block a few years back. It wasn't BAT, just one of the other classic car auctions. I looked into bidding, and it was $200 just to register to bid. Not really worth it for me to pay that to bid on one car that I might not win. Then it sold for less than I was willing to pay. I wish it had been on BAT, which does have a better auction flow for the person who is after one specific car.
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Ohio_Style
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2007
Posts: 610
Location: You'll never leave Sparta alive, Ohio
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MrPolak
Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2004
Posts: 1337
Location: AG ,atnaltA
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ryans65
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2016
Posts: 1263
Location: Yulee FL
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| Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:19 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| nauseating comments on that one already |
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Split 66'
Samba Member
Joined: October 07, 2010
Posts: 1257
Location: Bay Area, California
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| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2022 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1961-volkswagen-bus-15/
Current Bid: $40,000 Ends In: 6 days
15 to 23 Window conversion, second time being listed on BAT.
| Quote: |
The M-code plate provides the following production information:
05 09 0 – September 5, 1960 planned production date
378 – North American equipment, includes six pop-outs
130 – Deluxe Type 2 without sunroof and roof windows
UH – Exported to Houston/San Antonio region of USA
241 – Microbus Deluxe; left-hand drive, cargo doors right, full middle seat
BGR – Beige Grey and Sealing Wax Red paint
SR – Blue Grey interior
650694 – Vehicle chassis number
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Link
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Braukuche
Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004
Posts: 11004
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| Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2022 9:47 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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That fake 23 is a good case for not converting your 15 to a 23 if you are trying to make a buck.
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Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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MrPolak
Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2004
Posts: 1337
Location: AG ,atnaltA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:29 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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Sold For $36,250 On 1/21/22
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Alan Brase
Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004
Posts: 4532
Location: Cedar Falls, Iowa
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| Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:29 pm Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| MrPolak wrote: |
Sold For $36,250 On 1/21/22
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Actually, that seems about right. I guess patina'd completely sorted buses are not nearly so attractive to the BAT big bidder crowd?
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Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
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Graysvws
Samba Member
Joined: August 26, 2008
Posts: 369
Location: Danville, VA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 2:21 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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I think it’s gotta really have the right look. I’m a “patina” guy I guess but to me this truck just didn’t have it from the outside to the interior. It looks like a plenty solid enough and sorted truck just not attractive. 36k for an ugly duckling good runner double cab seems about right.
| Alan Brase wrote: |
| MrPolak wrote: |
Sold For $36,250 On 1/21/22
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Actually, that seems about right. I guess patina'd completely sorted buses are not nearly so attractive to the BAT big bidder crowd? |
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Lind
Samba Member
Joined: November 06, 2000
Posts: 9915
Location: idaho
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 10:03 am Post subject: Re: BAT Buses |
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| Graysvws wrote: |
| I think it’s gotta really have the right look. I’m a “patina” guy I guess but to me this truck just didn’t have it from the outside to the interior. It looks like a plenty solid enough and sorted truck just not attractive. 36k for an ugly duckling good runner double cab seems about right. |
My feelings exactly. To me, patina is all about fade and a good look. Nothing exciting about the look on this bus.
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