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brownbus2 Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2020 Posts: 244 Location: Roanoke, VA
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 5:46 pm Post subject: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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Does anyone have a part number, source, or, 3 they want to part with of:
if not...two of my injectors were missing them. The two that were missing them were the white injectors...would not having that ring be a big fire hazard? _________________ formerly known as Brown_Bus
1976 FI Marino Yellow Westy |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 6:08 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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Not really sure what the rings do. Most people cut them off and don't replace them. Instead of using a hose as per the original that is sturdy enough that a clamp they just use 30r9 hose and then use a FI rated hose clamp.
Using Gate Barricade hose that carries BOTH a 30r9 and a 30r14 rating is fine, just don't use the GB that only carries the 30r14 rating.
If your injectors don't match and all meet the original flow specs running them could be detrimental to your engine's life. |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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The rings took the place of clamps, it's very similar to the Push-loc system, speedy on the production line in tight spots like that. Unless you are planning on competing at Pebble beach a good FI clamp will do the job just fine. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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brownbus2 Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2020 Posts: 244 Location: Roanoke, VA
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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i have the hose and clamps from the kit from German supply _________________ formerly known as Brown_Bus
1976 FI Marino Yellow Westy |
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germansupplyscott Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2004 Posts: 7090 Location: toronto
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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Injectors with the ring are, like busdaddy said, designed like a push-lok double hose barb. The metal ring style of injector do not come with a hose clamp from the factory, just the ring. These injectors are usually blue and are from later engines (2.0l if I recall). These could technically be used without a clamp provided the ring is present and the replacement hose is suitably tight. Clamping them won't hurt.
The earlier injectors (grey body) use a metal swaged clamp and have a smaller and less aggressive single barb. They need a clamp if you remove the original swaged-on hose.
I think the injectors look nice and clean (and they will seal fine and not leak) with just the ring but this should only be done if they are the 'push-lok' barb style that came that way originally and only if you have proper hose.
_________________ SL
Last edited by germansupplyscott on Thu May 06, 2021 7:29 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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brownbus2 Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2020 Posts: 244 Location: Roanoke, VA
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 7:15 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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thanks Scott
My bus has two of each color. I have the wonderful kit that you sell and will just use the clamps that are in that.
Thanks everyone! _________________ formerly known as Brown_Bus
1976 FI Marino Yellow Westy |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Thu May 06, 2021 10:28 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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I don't think the ring was a clamp, maybe it offered some protection to the end of the original hose against UV degradation or something? I am going to guess it's just one of those German things, where a loose end just has to have something done to it whether the solution really does anything or not. |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 6:09 am Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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Scott pretty much nailed it.
The little metal dish/ring is a ferrule. We saw them on a few low pressure clamping systems in other industries through the 80s. They are still used in some countries.
But.....he is also correct that these ferrules will NOT work on any injector or connection that does not have the double barb.
More specifically......notice how big in diameter and sharp edged those barbs are?
The two barbs close together are designed to force the hose that goes over the inner barb.....to angle inward toward the smooth part of the tube. Its just physics. Because the rubber has to stretch .....outward.....at an angle.....to get over that second/inner barb....it pulls the rubber in that direction like a ramp......chamging the angle of the OD of the tube.
The ferrule only has to have enough wall or dish..... to prevent the rubber from expanding outward/straight again.....to keep it from backing off the barb.
Cool design!
So why are these miracle ferrules not just used everywhere.....right?
Because......
A. If the hose wall section changes more than a nominal amount either thicker or thinner.....the deflection of the hose inward going over the second barb may not be enough (might need a larger barb) or may need a larger ferrule rung.
B. As hose ages and gets brittle.....depending on the type it can shrink up and with barbs this large can cut the hose.
C. Its only good for lower pressures below about 65-75 psi......and that depends on the hose design, its rubber and reinforcing type. Above that pressure you will need a standard crimped ferrule to prevent the hose from inflating and blowing off the barb.
Ray |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50254
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Posted: Fri May 07, 2021 9:26 am Post subject: Re: Fuel Injector metal ring |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
The little metal dish/ring is a ferrule. We saw them on a few low pressure clamping systems in other industries through the 80s. They are still used in some countries. |
If the hose slid outwards over the twin barbs far enough for the ferrule (as you call it) to have an effect the system would already be in a failure mode, so I don't buy that explanation at all. |
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