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Pez Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2003 Posts: 583 Location: Texarkana
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Posted: Fri May 28, 2021 5:18 pm Post subject: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Been having a lot of heavy rain these past few weeks and if anyone knows East Texas it takes an eternity to ever dry up. Well, the rain has gotten so bad its forced me to finally install a channel drain across the entrance of my shop which is on the rear of my house. Drain has been installed and I started digging a 50' long x 6" deep trench along side my house leading to the front where the "natural" slope brings rain to the street. This trench goes between mine and my neighbors house (10' gap between us..) staying on my side of the property line.
Beyond the background of the story, my issue arises at the last 5' of trench. And like I said I'm only 6" down and I see water percolating from beneath my dig. I start trying to get to source of water by hand but 2' of exploration shows no source. So, I check gauges at street, no movement. I cut off water at street for both my house and the neighbors. Water is still percolating even after opening up both of our faucets to confirm no water to houses. So, in my simple mechanics brain that says the source is not a supply line to a house.. Can this really be I hit the water table and its just rain? _________________ Always chasing Squirrel's. |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22668 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Fri May 28, 2021 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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If the table is only 6 inches below grade you would be liv8ng in a swamp..it could be temporary , though. How much rain has fallen in the past 48 hours? _________________ .ssS! |
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Pez Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2003 Posts: 583 Location: Texarkana
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Posted: Fri May 28, 2021 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Abscate wrote: |
If the table is only 6 inches below grade you would be liv8ng in a swamp..it could be temporary , though. How much rain has fallen in the past 48 hours? |
That was my thought, but I think(hope) the water was coming from farther down and I just gave it a path of least resistance. Wednesday night we got a record 8", and another 2" last night. We have been getting some serious rain for the past month with only a couple of days in between of good weather, not nearly enough time for it to dry up.
I should also mention my back yard holds a lot of water and when it does drain, it flows between our houses right where I was digging and will seep down towards the street for days.
We are so big time, we made the news with the amount of rain we got. 😂
Link
_________________ Always chasing Squirrel's. |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22668 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 4:05 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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If you are putting in perforated pipe just keep digging the trench and wait for the water to subside , then gravel and pipe. _________________ .ssS! |
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my59 Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2003 Posts: 3793 Location: connecting the dots
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 5:02 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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The soil looks to be saturated, not surprising given the amount of rain.
The type of soil may be part of the problem, if has a high amount of clay in it.
If you are putting in perforated pipe and gravel, lay filter fabric in the trench before the pipe and gravel, and then fold the fabric over the top of the gravel before backfill. It prevents the soil surrounding the drain from clogging the gravel. _________________ my59: Well son, my grandfather died before I got to drive it, so does that answer your question?
our79: sunroof bus w/camper interior and 2.0 FI
Other:'12 Jetta, '77 Benz 300D, and a 74 MG Midget. |
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Pez Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2003 Posts: 583 Location: Texarkana
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 7:53 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Abscate wrote: |
If you are putting in perforated pipe just keep digging the trench and wait for the water to subside , then gravel and pipe. |
Thank ya sir, exactly what I ended up doing. I have a bad habit of over thinking and worrying myself to death. Appreciate your vote of "it will be alright"
my59 wrote: |
The soil looks to be saturated, not surprising given the amount of rain.
The type of soil may be part of the problem, if has a high amount of clay in it.
If you are putting in perforated pipe and gravel, lay filter fabric in the trench before the pipe and gravel, and then fold the fabric over the top of the gravel before backfill. It prevents the soil surrounding the drain from clogging the gravel. |
It has to be, granted I don't make a habit of doing much digging but I've never seen anything like it. But, I'm sure you are right the soil where I was digging consisted of made 2.5" of terrible top soil, then a little sand and the rest clay, very fun to dig in.
Thank you for the tip though, never understood the fabric. Just one of those things you did. _________________ Always chasing Squirrel's. |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 10:44 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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there my already be a french drain there....or natural drain... you could add another or dig one deep wide hole and make a deep water drain to try to disperse it farther under ground.....I added a french drain around the hosue and down the side yard, dug a deep hole, cut the bottom out of a few 3 gallon buckets the one of the bottom had alota 3/8holes in it, rockes under it., stacked them all togeather ran the french drain to it added the top. zero drainage issues. you can also add clean rocks to the buckets to keep them from colasping.... and it's only rain water going to it. from a aera that used to flood. witch was toped with play sand the same level as the drain tube bottom with the weed stop stuff on the bottom on 2 or 3 layers. then also around the end of the drain tube and around the tube witch has a sock on it already. sand up and about 2" over the top of the tube then pavers on top to let the h20 to drain down to the sand and to the french drain tube to take away., no more mess or standing h20 not even after 14" in 2 days. different griund will need differsnt approach and different drpth for the deep hole"well" and it needs to be covered well.mine has 24" pavers on top of the aera that had the deep well drain/buckets hole. so there is no axe a dents, like OJ had. dont worry aboyt the spellen it wont affect drainage,,unlessss you druel. it worked fer me.it may or may not work fer you. |
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67 Florida Deluxe Samba Purist
Joined: June 21, 2005 Posts: 7987 Location: Gainesville and Tampa, Florida
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 7:13 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Are you at the bottom of a hill? At 38 feet above sea level in St. Petersburg (which is one of the highest points), I occasionally get percolation under my house (built on piers with a crawl space and wood subfloor covered in hardwood inside.) This only happens after extended rain events because I'm at the bottom of a hill that's bounded by a hard-packed road bed and the under drains that run along the road designed to carry off the hydrostatic pressure water are clogged with tree roots. I would sometimes get water intrusion via percolation/hydrostatic pressure in my garage and laundry on the lowest floor which was slab on grade on the lowest end of the sloped grade in a tri-level house (the rest of the house has a crawl space.) Under the house would be flooded. I dug a big sump catch basin under the crawl space of the house and installed an automatic sump pump attached to a drain pipe that expelled the water down grade from the house. That finally cured my "wet feet" issue in the lower slab on grade level. _________________ -Kent (BaT "daleallen")
OG member of the '67 Posse
A few of my toys, past and present
'56 Oval, '66 KG Conv't, '67 21-Window, '67 Bug, '79 SuperVert, '55 Pre-A Continental |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31379 Location: Hot Arizona
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Pez Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2003 Posts: 583 Location: Texarkana
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 8:24 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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mark tucker wrote: |
there my already be a french drain there....or natural drain... you could add another or dig one deep wide hole and make a deep water drain to try to disperse it farther under ground.....I added a french drain around the hosue and down the side yard, dug a deep hole, cut the bottom out of a few 3 gallon buckets..... ...........mine has 24" pavers on top of the aera that had the deep well drain/buckets hole. so there is no axe a dents, like OJ had. dont worry aboyt the spellen it wont affect drainage,,unlessss you druel. it worked fer me.it may or may not work fer you. |
I think I got most of that, but I believe my end game to my drainage operation will be the same as your 3 gallon buckets. I am tight on space so a traditional drainage field isn't a option which makes the bucket a favorable option. Thanks for your description though, spelln aside it will be a great help! lol
67 Florida Deluxe wrote: |
Are you at the bottom of a hill? At 38 feet above sea level in St. Petersburg (which is one of the highest points), I occasionally get percolation under my house (built on piers with a crawl space and wood subfloor covered in hardwood inside.) This only happens after extended rain events because I'm at the bottom of a hill that's bounded by a hard-packed road bed and the under drains that run along the road designed to carry off the hydrostatic pressure water are clogged with tree roots. I would sometimes get water intrusion via percolation/hydrostatic pressure in my garage and laundry on the lowest floor which was slab on grade on the lowest end of the sloped grade in a tri-level house (the rest of the house has a crawl space.) Under the house would be flooded. I dug a big sump catch basin under the crawl space of the house and installed an automatic sump pump attached to a drain pipe that expelled the water down grade from the house. That finally cured my "wet feet" issue in the lower slab on grade level. |
Basically. My neighbors yard on the opposite side of my drainage system sits slightly higher, but the biggest slope comes from behind my back fence where the business back there was so nice to point their drain at my back fence which keeps my back soggy pretty much year round. But, all of this water only has one way to go and its down the alley I am digging. So 3 yards, two roofs and one business feeding water to this area has to be the issue here. My parents on the other hand are getting percolating in their driveway, mainly at the joints which is normal I assume but has caused them enough concern to build a catch basin mutch like what Mike described. My grandparents basement would severally flood which force them to put in a pump, makes me understand and thankful why basements are such a rarity in Texas or else I believe Id being having your same issue.
But as an update, 24 hours later and the area where I was digging has dried up. So the ground water is back in its place and crisis averted. I appreciate everyone listening to my worrying and your input.. Now, I need a glass of wine! _________________ Always chasing Squirrel's. |
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Pez Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2003 Posts: 583 Location: Texarkana
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 8:25 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Was wondering how long it would take someone to "crack" that joke! lol _________________ Always chasing Squirrel's. |
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67 Florida Deluxe Samba Purist
Joined: June 21, 2005 Posts: 7987 Location: Gainesville and Tampa, Florida
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Posted: Sat May 29, 2021 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Pez wrote: |
Basically. My neighbors yard on the opposite side of my drainage system sits slightly higher, but the biggest slope comes from behind my back fence where the business back there was so nice to point their drain at my back fence which keeps my back soggy pretty much year round. But, all of this water only has one way to go and its down the alley I am digging. So 3 yards, two roofs and one business feeding water to this area has to be the issue here. My parents on the other hand are getting percolating in their driveway, mainly at the joints which is normal I assume but has caused them enough concern to build a catch basin mutch like what Mike described. My grandparents basement would severally flood which force them to put in a pump, makes me understand and thankful why basements are such a rarity in Texas or else I believe Id being having your same issue.
But as an update, 24 hours later and the area where I was digging has dried up. So the ground water is back in its place and crisis averted. I appreciate everyone listening to my worrying and your input.. Now, I need a glass of wine! |
In FL, the laws for water management (runoff) have gotten very strict. You can't simply pass off your drainage to an adjacent property. Water mitigation is a big deal for commercial properties. So if the adjacent property channeling their runoff onto your property is true, you should research codes, or even better, ask a code enforcement officer to come evaluate your situation. Each property owner is tasked with mitigating their own rainwater issues without encroaching/compounding neighboring properties. But that's FL. Worth investigating the rules for your situation, for sure! _________________ -Kent (BaT "daleallen")
OG member of the '67 Posse
A few of my toys, past and present
'56 Oval, '66 KG Conv't, '67 21-Window, '67 Bug, '79 SuperVert, '55 Pre-A Continental |
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my59 Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2003 Posts: 3793 Location: connecting the dots
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Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2021 9:37 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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67 Florida Deluxe wrote: |
Pez wrote: |
Basically. My neighbors yard on the opposite side of my drainage system sits slightly higher, but the biggest slope comes from behind my back fence where the business back there was so nice to point their drain at my back fence which keeps my back soggy pretty much year round. But, all of this water only has one way to go and its down the alley I am digging. So 3 yards, two roofs and one business feeding water to this area has to be the issue here. My parents on the other hand are getting percolating in their driveway, mainly at the joints which is normal I assume but has caused them enough concern to build a catch basin mutch like what Mike described. My grandparents basement would severally flood which force them to put in a pump, makes me understand and thankful why basements are such a rarity in Texas or else I believe Id being having your same issue.
But as an update, 24 hours later and the area where I was digging has dried up. So the ground water is back in its place and crisis averted. I appreciate everyone listening to my worrying and your input.. Now, I need a glass of wine! |
In FL, the laws for water management (runoff) have gotten very strict. You can't simply pass off your drainage to an adjacent property. Water mitigation is a big deal for commercial properties. So if the adjacent property channeling their runoff onto your property is true, you should research codes, or even better, ask a code enforcement officer to come evaluate your situation. Each property owner is tasked with mitigating their own rainwater issues without encroaching/compounding neighboring properties. But that's FL. Worth investigating the rules for your situaton, for sure! |
In a lot of locations your rain water has to either stay on your land or drain to a storm system. My BIL had a house in Virginia where all his neighbors had raised their grades to drain away from the house, effectively making his yard the the low spot. This caused a damp basement, a sump pump constantly pumping out to the yard, and a son with all kinds of mold related health issues, as the basement was the boys play area. He and I spent a night re-engineering their drainage system, after he had a quiet conversation with the town crew road guys who realized he had been screwed by the neighbors and permitted him to lay pipe from the sump pump out to the storm drain in the street. _________________ my59: Well son, my grandfather died before I got to drive it, so does that answer your question?
our79: sunroof bus w/camper interior and 2.0 FI
Other:'12 Jetta, '77 Benz 300D, and a 74 MG Midget. |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 34013 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2021 11:34 am Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Yes, regulations vary. When I lived in the boonies (yet still in L.A. County) I had to have my property drain in the same direction it had before I graded my building pad and driveways. This means it dumped into a neighbor's property, which it had for decades; years ago, he had a ditch dug that likewise sent it off his property and into the dirt road. Until the area gets paved streets with culverts and drains, it will stay that way.
On the other hand, urban/suburban areas change when subdivided, and all properties have to drain toward the streets, where it becomes a public utility's problem. |
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Long-roofs Samba Member
Joined: March 20, 2002 Posts: 2295 Location: Millwood, Wa
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Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2021 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Pez wrote: |
Was wondering how long it would take someone to "crack" that joke! lol |
If Bricklayers lay bricks, do Plumbers lay plumbs _________________ ---
I have been on a treadmill drinking vodka, maybe more than once.
"No, I do not own a bleepin' leaf blower"
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 34013 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2021 2:33 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Long-roofs wrote: |
Pez wrote: |
Was wondering how long it would take someone to "crack" that joke! lol |
If Bricklayers lay bricks, do Plumbers lay plumbs |
Yes.
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31379 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2021 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Who here is a Plumber? |
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Pez wrote: |
Was wondering how long it would take someone to "crack" that joke! lol |
Well, appropriate because I was in the process of installing a set of 2013 Kenmore/Whirlpool washer and dryer from my neighbor, and will be giving my 1980s Maytag ones to my daughter.
The 2013 Kenmore dryer had only intermittent heat according to my neighbor (and confirmed by me); I found the timer switch to have several "dead" areas of zero continuity, so I have a new timer witch on order. The 2013 washing machine does work (like neighbor said) but needed the inlet screen for cold water cleaned out. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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